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Pleasant Hearth not making heat?

Post in 'The Pellet Mill - Pellet and Multifuel Stoves' started by MYON, Jan 9, 2013.

  1. MYON

    MYON New Member

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    Just bought the 2200 sq ft stove from lowes. It is a really nice stove. I have it in my basement living room which is about 300 sq. ft.. I let the stove run on high all night long. The highest the temp got in the room (opposite side coffee table) was around 67 degrees f. I would think that a 50,000 btu stove would run me out of the room. Fire has a good burn to it so i'm not sure if its the stove itself (using high grade pellets). Stove gets plenty hot but the air temp coming out of the stove feels around 75-80 degrees. I have a 30,000 btu natural gas ventless wall heater that will heat the room no problem. Any thoughts?

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  2. imacman

    imacman Guest

    Can you describe the exhaust system for the stove? Lengths, elbows, etc, etc. Also, the area is all insulated, I presume?

    What brand of pellets are you using?
  3. MYON

    MYON New Member

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    statesman from southern states brand pellets. the exhaust is the normal 3" line. 90s up out of the stove with a cleanout, about 4 feet than another 90 into an 8" adapter into a chimney. Room was just remodeled. All R5 insulation on block covered with wood tongue and groove and brand new windows.
  4. imacman

    imacman Guest

    The chimney has a 8" liner running to the top? The chimney part is new, or existing? If existing, was it completely cleaned before pellet stove install?

    And the room insulation I asked about?
  5. MYON

    MYON New Member

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    Dont mind the base. I took out an old stove. currently building a platform. It was an exiting chimney, it was cleaned this fall and no liner just open

    Attached Files:

  6. imacman

    imacman Guest

    Any combustion air trim controls on the stove? It may be sending the heat out through the stove & exhaust too fast and isn't having enough time for the heat exchanger to pull it out.

    If you turn the room blower speed down, does the air get significantly hotter?
  7. SmokeyTheBear

    SmokeyTheBear Minister of Fire

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    Nothing like heating rock and where is your gas wall heater located?

    Also how fast are you going through a bag of pellets?
  8. MYON

    MYON New Member

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    Gas heater is on the opposite wall in the center of the room. havent gone through a whole bag yet. estimating about a half to 3/4 a day. No air trim controls fan just turns on and runs as far as i know.
  9. imacman

    imacman Guest

    Well, if the stove is running as it designed, even with the rock wall and tile floor, that thing should blast you out of there, IMO.

    BTW, does that stove have the ability to run on a thermostat?
  10. MYON

    MYON New Member

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    thats my thoughts. no thermostat control. just a cable that runs out of the rear as a temp probe.
  11. imacman

    imacman Guest

    And the probe is located where? Does the owners manual specify a location to put it?
  12. MYON

    MYON New Member

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    out of the rear of the unit. cord is about two feet long so not much reach.
  13. SmokeyTheBear

    SmokeyTheBear Minister of Fire

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    Here is how it works in order to get 50,000 BTUs/Hour input to the stove you have to burn pellets at the rate of 5.95 pounds per hour and would go through a bag of pellets in 6.72 hours. Remember this is gross input using a slightly better than average pellet the effective heat output would only be about 41,500 BTUs/Hour due to the efficiency of the stove.

    You have placed your stove on what looks like rock and concrete and that all by itself will remove a lot of the stoves ability to heat the air in the room.

    Now about that R5 insulation and specifically what is behind it if you have 6 inch concrete blocks, your total wall R value is less than 11 and I'll give you an additional 1.5 for the sheathing and air films between the layers so call it less than 12.5 which isn't all that great but not anywhere near as bad as a rock or concrete wall or floor is.

    Your new toy primarily heats by forced hot air and that requires that the heat exchanger transfers the heat it gets from the hot exhaust gases to the convection air stream, anything that is in contact to that heat exchanger even indirectly without a thermal break will also get heated by conduction and what I'm seeing is a huge heat sink called your hearth and the area behind the stove.

    Now do you think you have burned pellets at the rate of 5.95 pounds per hour?

    Your heater attached to the wall doesn't have the heat sink (thermal mass) that your pellet stove has to contend with.

    Hopefully I can pull a manual for your stove and do some reading.
  14. imacman

    imacman Guest

    I hope it's as far away from the exhaust as possible. Any chance you can lengthen it? I seem to remember that the Harman's temp probe can be lengthened, although theirs is a lot longer than yours is to begin with.
  15. imacman

    imacman Guest

    Yep, you're onto something here Smokey....at his rate of pellet consumption, that stove isn't burning enough pellets. That's why I asked about the temp probe....if it's getting fooled by heat from the stove, it's never really getting to hi fire condition.

    Can we see a pic of the control panel?
  16. MYON

    MYON New Member

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    I am not expecting to heat my entire basement at 85 degrees. i took out a 20 year old buck stove that heated great. i just got tired of dealing with a wood stove that wouldn't stay lit while i was gone. they only other heat i have is that gas wall heater. i was hoping this stove would be enough to keep the basement comfortable so i wouldnt have to run the gas heater all of the time. i have some work/research to do.

    i will have to get back to you on the rate of burn, i am just guessing. i filled it up last night with 80lbs and had some gone but not sure on the amount.
  17. imacman

    imacman Guest

    Remove all the pellets, and then re-fill with just 1 bag at a time for now....easier to calculate the amount burned
  18. MYON

    MYON New Member

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    this is the only contols

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  19. imacman

    imacman Guest

    Is the stove set to Auto or On? If set to auto, maybe just set to On and see if heat output increases.
  20. SmokeyTheBear

    SmokeyTheBear Minister of Fire

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    The manual says that extra wire is provided to increase the length of the wire for the ambient temperature probe.

    It also says that in order for the stove to enter high fire mode there has to be a difference of 8 degrees between the setting you want it to reach and the current ambient temperature probe reading.

    Yep you've got to play with probe placement from appearances.
  21. MYON

    MYON New Member

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    i will give that a try tonight. thanks for all of your help
  22. St_Earl

    St_Earl Minister of Fire

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    it has a different control than my PS50. so not sure about the settings there. i seem to remember it has a high and a low and a "dynamic"
    the dynamic may be causing it to reduce the feed rate. but i am only guessing as i have never used that control. mine just has low , med and high.
    *added imacman's quote after seeing it.

    that's the heatiator cousin. i'm guessing there is a feed gate inside the hopper.
    adjusting the feed gate isn't hard. but you want to not get too many pellets in the firepot as they can slow the burn by blocking the air flow.

    you want an energetic, active flame without any "lazy" looping flames.
    different burn pot in that one than mine as well. so i won't try and get too specific other than that.
    but i will say small adjustments in the feed gate can have big effects. so go in increments and give the auger time to empty and refill with the new feed amount before judging.

    it's also possible to get the baffle plates in slightly cockeyed. it's probably not that. but they need to be seated and join up properly to each other or the air path will be messed up.
    i got one hung up one time and didn't notice it till a few hours later.

    like i said. that's a longshot of a guess. but something to be aware of.
  23. MYON

    MYON New Member

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    adjusted around last night. after watching some youtube videos and reading, i dont think im getting the proper flame height. when it first lights it comes about halfway up the window but while running it just comes above the fire pot. I got better heat last night (around 75f) but it was much warmer outside. After some research i think i need to upgrade my pipe to 4". I live in WV so my altitude is just around 2500 ft.. Also how do you tell if you need to install the fresh air vent. is it a good idea to just install it anyways?
  24. SmokeyTheBear

    SmokeyTheBear Minister of Fire

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    An OAK (fresh air intake) is generally a very good idea as it removes the possible impact of existing negative pressure issues in the house from interfering with the stoves combustion process.

    It also doesn't pump air you have already heated up the flue.

    That stove adjusts its burn rate to match the heat loss as measured by that probe. Most stoves exit start up from high burn (this allows them to cycle through their control range and to bring the heat exchanger up to temperature faster). So a change in flame height is to be expected.

    Did you do as imacman suggested and take your stove out of auto mode and vary the heat setting manually?
  25. MYON

    MYON New Member

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    Yes it burns better manually. Found out something this weekend. took the side off and was playing around with the trim. I found that if i take my hand and cover the air intake I can get a great flame. Its a bit lazy but still a great flame. I can plug the pipe up for a few minutes and get great heat not to mention it started to burn off the chemicals on the outside. This is what i would image the flame is supposed to look like more so than the small flame i am getting. Would this suggest that i most certainly need to upgrade to a 4" pipe?

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