1. Welcome Hearth.com Guests and Visitors - Please enjoy our forums!
    Hearth.com GOLD Sponsors who help bring the site content to you:
    Hearthstone Soapstone and Cast-Iron stoves( Wood, Gas or Pellet Stoves and Inserts)
    Caluwe - Passion for Fire and Water ( Pellet and Wood Hydronic and Space Heating)

Top Auger not working Englander

Post in 'The Pellet Mill - Pellet and Multifuel Stoves' started by Blaino, Dec 7, 2012.

  1. Blaino

    Blaino New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2012
    Messages:
    2
    I own a England Stove Works 25- PVDC. The top auger just kind of stopped working.. So I did a bunch of research online and then started tearing into the stove. First thing I did was
    Step 1- deep clean the entire stove including the exhaust fan and flu. Tested... FAIL
    Step 2- Took apart top auger to clean out any clogging in it. The bearings seemed fine. Put it back together tested: FAIL
    Step 3- Checked on vacuum hoses, they seem fine so I unplugged the wire from the vacuum switch and bridged the wires together with an auto fuse to bypass the switch. Tested: Motor still doesn't work.
    Step 4- While vacuum switch is bypassed I took wires from top auger and plugged them into bottom auger, the bottom auger would turn....pause....tun....pause just like the top auger was suppose to. Then I took the wires from the bottom auger and plugged them into the top auger.... it was able to turn constantly just like the bottom auger is suppose to. That leads me to think that the switch board is fine and both motors work, and vacuum switches are working.....
    So yeah I'm stumped and looking for answers as to why my top auger wont turn.

    Blaine

    Helpful Sponsor Ads!





  2. SmokeyTheBear

    SmokeyTheBear Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Messages:
    12,104
    Loc:
    Standish, ME
    Top auger motor might be binding under load, when you were playing were there pellets in the system or was it empty?
  3. CT Pellet

    CT Pellet Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2012
    Messages:
    668
    Loc:
    Torrington, CT
    +1
    I have seen this on several 25's. Quite often, the customer will question why the top auger motor (which turns intermittently) will burn out before the bottom one which will turn constantly. The constant start and stop can be as tolling on the motor as constant turning. It may turn freely but when its pushing a spool of pellets the resistance may be enough in its old age to stall it. if this is the case, put the weak motor on the bottom (much less resistance) and the good one up top. This will get you through til the new motor comes in. How old is this motor?
  4. Blaino

    Blaino New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2012
    Messages:
    2
    Thanks for the info CT Pellet, that's actually what I ended up doing directly after posting my original question. The stove has been running now for a good 30 min with no problem. As for age of the motors I have no idea. Just bought the house 2 months ago and this is the only source of heat. I probably will not buy a new motor for the current stove. Hopefully this stove will last me through winter, or until I get a new WOOD stove. I am a forester and out in the woods 3-5 days a week so bringin home a small load of Black Oak is what I normally do once a week.. Already have about 2-3 cords of wood outside seasoned and ready to go but alas I have a small pellet stove to heat my 1500 sq ft house with 12' ceilings... I CANT WAIT TO BURN WOOD!
  5. MCPO

    MCPO Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    May 1, 2008
    Messages:
    2,216
    Loc:
    western Ma , close to NY state border
    I think most of us here understand. For some folks wood really IS the best thing but not for those of us who lack the time, or can`t manage the work anymore, can`t live with the the dirty mess, bugs and critters,not to mention the increased dangers of a wood stove, creosote and chimney fires, having to refuel it 3+ times a day. Then you have to deal with the uneven heat output levels.
    I burned wood for many years and I can`t say I miss it.
  6. bill3rail

    bill3rail Feeling the Heat

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2012
    Messages:
    438
    Loc:
    LI, NY
    Order a new motor before you need it!
    One will burn out on the coldest night of the year and you stated that it is your only source of heat!

    As far as Wood Vs Pellet, I wish I had a wood stove after this hurricane, I would have 20 to 30 cord of wood in my yard if I had a wood stove. FREE energy Yeah!

    Bill
  7. imacman

    imacman Guest

    As mentioned above, you probably should have at least 1 spare on hand....just in case. Seeing that you aren't going to keep it past the winter, here's a great place to buy a "spare"....only $19.00 plus shipping. I bought one as an emergency spare....... it runs great and has a MASSIVE stack.

    http://www.surpluscenter.com/sort.asp?catname=electric&keyword=GIAR
  8. Harvey Schneider

    Harvey Schneider Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2012
    Messages:
    983
    Loc:
    Southbury, CT
    The motors that are listed are all intermittent duty. The pdvc uses 1rpm these are not.
    be careful.
  9. SmokeyTheBear

    SmokeyTheBear Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Messages:
    12,104
    Loc:
    Standish, ME
    Frequently the surplus center has 1.0 RPM gear motors ( and lower ) and Pete just gave a link to one of their 3 gear motor sections. They also are known to also carry continuous duty motors.
  10. Harvey Schneider

    Harvey Schneider Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2012
    Messages:
    983
    Loc:
    Southbury, CT
    They just don't have them at the moment. I was just advocating caution.
  11. imacman

    imacman Guest

    If used on the upper auger, they should work fine.
  12. Harvey Schneider

    Harvey Schneider Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2012
    Messages:
    983
    Loc:
    Southbury, CT
    I agree that an intermittent duty motor would be fine for the upper auger, as long as you don't forget and swap them next year. The big problem is, they aren't 1 rpm. The stove is going to run hotter with a 2 rpm motor in the top auger drive.
  13. imacman

    imacman Guest

    Not a huge issue....just run the stove at a lower heat setting than normal, or even turn the LFF down a couple of notches.
  14. HD41

    HD41 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2008
    Messages:
    150
    Loc:
    Northern Ohio
    2 RPM upper auger motor not the best for 25PDVC but works well on lower auger.

    I brought my lower auger motor back to life with WD40 a couple years ago. When I saw a user had installed a 2 RPM motor from Surplus Center for $18.95; I purchased a pair of 2 RPM CCW motors as backup even though my original motors were still working. The original Merkle Koroff motor actually turns at 1.3 RPM.

    I found when used on the upper auger the 2 RPM motor would overfeed (too much heat) on the lowest setting even with lowest three button feed setting. Was OK for colder weather or emergency but I moved it to the lower auger and this works fine. I'm keeping the original Merkle Koroff motor as spare for the upper auger.
  15. slvrblkk

    slvrblkk Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2008
    Messages:
    1,192
    Loc:
    Northampton, PA
    My old pdvc Merkle auger motors were listed as "intermittent" on both motors. Does anyone know if it still says that on the newer ones. My pdvc was an '06.
  16. jtakeman

    jtakeman Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2008
    Messages:
    13,463
    Loc:
    Northwestern CT.
  17. slvrblkk

    slvrblkk Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2008
    Messages:
    1,192
    Loc:
    Northampton, PA
    That's interesting......I thought someone was selling Merkles on ebay that were "continuous" duty.....might have been Mr. Munson.....don't see any listed right now.....
  18. jtakeman

    jtakeman Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2008
    Messages:
    13,463
    Loc:
    Northwestern CT.
    Maybe he super charged it to last forever? :rolleyes:
    slvrblkk likes this.
  19. Harvey Schneider

    Harvey Schneider Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2012
    Messages:
    983
    Loc:
    Southbury, CT
    I have been searching online, and I am surprised to find that virtually all of the small gear motors are rated for intermittent duty.
  20. slvrblkk

    slvrblkk Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2008
    Messages:
    1,192
    Loc:
    Northampton, PA
    Csh Inc. has continuous duty....I believe Gleason Avery too
  21. imacman

    imacman Guest

    No, GA are also listed as "intermittent" duty. The ones listed in CSH are the only ones I've seen that are listed as "continuous". Funny, though, as they don't look to be any different than any other.
  22. Harvey Schneider

    Harvey Schneider Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2012
    Messages:
    983
    Loc:
    Southbury, CT
    Copied from Gleason Avery web page:

    MOTOR CONSTRUCTION
    Gearcase: Zinc die cast
    Lubrication: Grease filled
    Gears: Hardened steel and phenolic
    Bearings: Spherical
    Mounting: All positions
    Rotation: CW facing shaft
    Shaft: 3/8" diameter x 1" long with flat, hardened
    Type: Shaded pole
    Protection: Impedance or thermally protected *
    Hz: 60 or 50
    Duty: Intermittent
    Bearings: Self-lubricating bronze sleeve
    Insulation: Class B
    UL and CSA
    Motor Leads: 6" from bobbin
    I looked at CSH INC and couldn't find gearmotors. The C-frame motors they have are all designed for air over operation for ventilators. The cooling air is how they get their continuous rating.
  23. slvrblkk

    slvrblkk Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2008
    Messages:
    1,192
    Loc:
    Northampton, PA
    Thats what I think is funny too....they have similar stacks to the Merkle and Gleasons...I wonder if the gears are different?

    On a side note...the ones at Surplus Sales have HUGE stacks...gonna pick up another spare...they are too cheap not to.
  24. slvrblkk

    slvrblkk Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2008
    Messages:
    1,192
    Loc:
    Northampton, PA
    Look under "auger motor"

    Click to enlarge
    [​IMG]

    PV003 Auger motor by Multi Products of Wisconsin USA

    115 Volts
    SP/Open
    .5 Amp
    1 RPM
    Continuous duty, Impedance Protected
    CCW rotation, viewing from rear
    3 in. body
    Skeleton frame
    1 in. x 3/8 in. shaft
  25. SmokeyTheBear

    SmokeyTheBear Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Messages:
    12,104
    Loc:
    Standish, ME

Share This Page