1st Time Pellet/Biomass Furnace Purchase

[MnM129]

Hello everyone. I have been lurking around this forum and the web trying to educate myself over the past several weeks but the more I look the more I am confused. I am currently in a home in western Pennsylvania that is heated with an air source heat pump and an electric water heater. There is no natural gas available at this time. It has 2800square feet of finished space and an unfinished, subgrade, basement of 1400square feet. The home was built in 1992 and as far as I can tell has decent insulation for that time but with a lot of windows. The electricity bills have been significantly higher than I feel is necessary for a house of this size, $800 on average in winter which is mainly for heat. So I'm looking for cheaper heating options while trying to avoid tending to a stove/heat source daily. This brought me to looking at central pellet/biomass furnaces but the more I look at them the more I am confused. Ideally I want something that can completely offset the heat pump in the winter, cost significantly less to run and dosen't require me to tend to it except for maybe once a week. Can anyone give me direction or advice on the following?

1. What would be an appropriate size pellet/biomass furnace for a house this size?
2. What brands of furnaces should I be looking at?
3. How much are these furnaces?
4. How much time each week should I expect to spend cleaning/tending to the furnace?

Thanks everyone!

 

[velvetfoot]

800 bucks for the entire winter?

 

[bogieb]

If that is per year - then I'm not sure you can beat it. I would spend pretty close to that per month heating my much smaller house using propane boiler.

What size heat pump do you currently have (rated BTU's)? That should give you a good idea on the size of stove to look at.

Are you talking actual furnace or stove? Furnaces are not cheap and AFAIK, only a few manufacturers make pellet/bio fuel furnaces. I don't have one, so could not even begin to advise you on furnaces.

If you are talking pellet stoves, and are only spending $800/year on heat, then you would want a really cheap stove (BBS/Aubuchon offerings) in order to realize some sort of payback in a couple of years (If a payback is even possible). But, with a really cheap stove, you have to be prepared to do everything yourself - I hear the customer service is usually really good, but that is by phone only.

 

[velvetfoot]

To heat that entire space: 5 tons? Pellets are 259/ton here.

 

[MnM129]

800 bucks for the entire winter?

Oh I wish $800 per winter. If that were the case I would not be wasting my time with researching this. I'm talking $800/month in the winter months..... sometimes more. I will be getting a home energy audit and following through with the advised insulation improvements but I can't see it changing my electric bill drastically to the point that a different fuel source isn't worth it.

I am looking for a central furnace to blow through the existing HVAC ducts. To me these seem more flexible in that they can burn corn or pellets and are more automated. I'm ok with the idea of tending to the furnace and I realize none of them are going to be a set and forget type appliance like oil or gas but I'm looking for something that I can let run for at least a week without cleaning or tending to besides adding pellets.

 

[velvetfoot]

I don't know anything about pellet furnaces. I think you could use a pellet boiler and put a heat exchanger in the ductwork. There's a pretty good selection of pellet boilers. I don't think they usually burn corn however.

 

[MnM129]

If that is per year - then I'm not sure you can beat it. I would spend pretty close to that per month heating my much smaller house using propane boiler.

What size heat pump do you currently have (rated BTU's)? That should give you a good idea on the size of stove to look at.

Are you talking actual furnace or stove? Furnaces are not cheap and AFAIK, only a few manufacturers make pellet/bio fuel furnaces. I don't have one, so could not even begin to advise you on furnaces.

If you are talking pellet stoves, and are only spending $800/year on heat, then you would want a really cheap stove (BBS/Aubuchon offerings) in order to realize some sort of payback in a couple of years (If a payback is even possible). But, with a really cheap stove, you have to be prepared to do everything yourself - I hear the customer service is usually really good, but that is by phone only.

Looking at my heat pump it is a 4 ton Lennox that was installed about 5 years ago. I'm not sure how to convert that to determine how many btu I would need to replace it with. Is there a way to do this?

 

[peakbagger]

The city next to me , Berlin NH got a pile of state,federal and local dollars and become the "Pellet Boiler capital of America" about two years ago. The folks who signed up got all sorts of subsidies but before subsidies the installed cost was quite steep, 25 K . Here is an older article about the project with some info (broken link removed to http://www.nhcdfa.org/resources/news/134)

Realistically I would look at other options. I expect mini splits would be more efficient then your current heat pump. Maybe consider a pellet stove for supplement heat but realize they require moving pellets around, feeding the hopper and cleaning the stove. Possibly consider a ground source heat pump?

 

[bogieb]

Looking at my heat pump it is a 4 ton Lennox that was installed about 5 years ago. I'm not sure how to convert that to determine how many btu I would need to replace it with. Is there a way to do this?

Of that, I have no clue - sorry.

However, there is a quick and dirty BTU calculator. You can play with going whole house (including basement) or just the main floors and describe the insulation and ceiling heights.

 

[bogieb]

The city next to me , Berlin NH got a pile of state,federal and local dollars and become the "Pellet Boiler capital of America" about two years ago. The folks who signed up got all sorts of subsidies but before subsidies the installed cost was quite steep, 25 K . Here is an older article about the project with some info (broken link removed to http://www.nhcdfa.org/resources/news/134)

Realistically I would look at other options. I expect mini splits would be more efficient then your current heat pump. Maybe consider a pellet stove for supplement heat but realize they require moving pellets around, feeding the hopper and cleaning the stove. Possibly consider a ground source heat pump?

I think each state decides on how much they will subsidize. I actually looked into a pellet furnace but I have nowhere to put the huge storage hopper needed in order to qualify (I think it had to hold a couple of tons - been several years since I looked though). Plus, don't know any bulk dealers - although to be fair, didn't look since my basement size and height were an issue to begin with.

 

[peakbagger]

The entire goal of the Berlin (and subsequently Farmington Maine) project was to get these boilers installed despite very poor economics. It also helps that Les Otten happened to own a nearby bulk pellet distribution center and also sells Pellet Boilers.

 

[MnM129]

http://www.americasheat.com/
https://www.caddyfurnaces.com/en/products/caddy-alterna-pellet-or-pellet-electric-furnace-pf09010/
(broken link removed to http://www.fahrenheittech.com/endurance_corn_stove.html)
(broken link removed)

To clarify, these are the types of furnaces I have been thinking of. However, I'm not sure what size I would need or what brands are best for what I'm looking for with minimal upkeep.

 

[bogieb]

Try a BTU calculator to figure out the rough size you need. We don't know the height of your ceilings (you aren't heating sq/ft, but instead are heating cu/ft). And once again, that calculation will be based upon weather you have poor, normal or excellent insulation/sealing.

 

[Jay Z]

I have a 2200 sq ft home and running pellet furnace in parallel with oil furnace. Not counting basement space. Being on electric is always a wallet killer.

I have a Fahrenheit 50F rated at 50,000 btu. It does a good job with temps above 10 degrees as my house is 130 years old. You cannot venture into any pellet device unless you do maintenence. Furnaces have some better controls but its daily, weekly and monthy work. Other factors are manufacturer support and a parts network. Fahrenheit is located in MI and has tech staff who responds.

 

[2011 GT/CS]

Just for a reference. There is 12000 but per ton on a heat pump ac system.. So a 4 ton unit gives you 48000 but.. Hope this helps a bit.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[MnM129]

I have a 2200 sq ft home and running pellet furnace in parallel with oil furnace. Not counting basement space. Being on electric is always a wallet killer.

I have a Fahrenheit 50F rated at 50,000 btu. It does a good job with temps above 10 degrees as my house is 130 years old. You cannot venture into any pellet device unless you do maintenence. Furnaces have some better controls but its daily, weekly and monthy work. Other factors are manufacturer support and a parts network. Fahrenheit is located in MI and has tech staff who responds.

I originally started looking at the Fahrenheit but I am pretty sure it is too small for the area I'm trying to heat. Do you have to use your oil furnace much when it is above 10 degrees? How much time would you say you spend each day and week to maintain the Fahrenheit? I am probably in a similiar situation as you in that I'm heating about 2800 square feet (not including the basement) but I would imagine the insulation in my house is better unless you have made significant improvements to your house. Looking at what 2011 GT/CS said below, my heat pump is rated for 48,000btu which is about the max output for the Farhenheit. However, the pellet furnace runs continuously so that works in it's favor when considering sizing.

Just for a reference. There is 12000 but per ton on a heat pump ac system.. So a 4 ton unit gives you 48000 but.. Hope this helps a bit.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[chken]

For your application, I would try asking in the boiler forum.

 

[Jay Z]

The rating on the 50F of 50,000 btu is measured different than typical stoves. Alot depends on how present ductwork is laid out too.

I boost oil for temps below 5 degrees and only for a few minutes to bring up for the day.

For maintenance on a daily its fill hopper and rack pipes. I empty ash every few days. I have a quick clean for pot removal and vac exhaust every two weeks for an hour. Monthly blow out main exhaust and clean fan blades.

For me this was a way to keep heating costs under 250.00 per month for three or four months.

And my wife likes the constant warm heat unlike spikes with wood and the mess.