2020 “phase 2” and outdoor wood boilers

[Ashful]

I know a guy with a really nasty OWB setup and his neighbor moved away because of it.

Got the same situation on the main road outside my development. Neighbors have been feuding over it for years, maybe decades. It creates an uncomfortable situation for those of us burning responsibly, that others may lump you in with that bozo, when they lodge a complaint or it generates some authoritative action.

 

[Ashful]

Is it burning 20 cords a year that is the problem?

Instead, what’s the evil thing about them that you’re trying to stop?

No, it’s their impact on their neighbors. People have a right to expect they’ll not have to live downwind of a mess like this, when they buy a home or property in a rural or residential zone. The obscene wood usage is simply an indicator of their horrendous efficiency, and a contributor to the problem.

Highbeam, you know I’m just about the last person on this forum to start talking about moderation, or limiting usage. [emoji41]

 

[Highbeam]

No, it’s their impact on their neighbors. People have a right to expect they’ll not have to live downwind of a mess like this, when they buy a home or property in a rural or residential zone. The obscene wood usage is simply an indicator of their horrendous efficiency, and a contributor to the problem.

Highbeam, you know I’m just about the last person on this forum to start talking about moderation, or limiting usage. [emoji41]

I do, fast cars and big homes for ashful and anybody else who wants them! I hope the real issue is not about having these freedoms but how to have them without hurting your neighbor.

 

[SpaceBus]

I do, fast cars and big homes for ashful and anybody else who wants them! I hope the real issue is not about having these freedoms but how to have them without hurting your neighbor.

I think every issue facing humans goes back to how we treat our neighbor.

 

[salecker]

I probably would have ventilated it first long before I sold my house.

Yes a few well placed chunks of lead should make it inoperable.

 

[hondaracer2oo4]

The landscape has changed as far as owb go. The epa made sweeping changes and started phase 2 in 2015. Any owb now produced for residentual wood use has to be phase 2 compliant meaning it meets the threshold limits set forth. They are independently tested by Intertek and certified. Take a look at the list here. https://19january2017snapshot.epa.gov/burnwise/list-qualified-hydronic-heaters_.html

I own a heatmaster G200 which actually meets the 2020 emissions standards. I have been running it for 3 full seasons. I went from a hardy h4( non compliant smoke dragon) burning 12-13 cords per year to +/-7 cords per year with no more smoke. It is extremely efficient. It is very simple to run, it does idle and will begin to gas in about 60 seconds after start up. Yes you need to use one of the big 3 foam insulated pipes(logstor, rehau or thermopex) to avoid ground water intrusion from a cracked casing. I personally own a 220 year old home that does not have a place for an indoor gasser with storage. The owb gasser landscape has changed, they are simple and easy to run and very effieicnt.

 

[SpaceBus]

The landscape has changed as far as owb go. The epa made sweeping changes and started phase 2 in 2015. Any owb now produced for residentual wood use has to be phase 2 compliant meaning it meets the threshold limits set forth. They are independently tested by Intertek and certified. Take a look at the list here. https://19january2017snapshot.epa.gov/burnwise/list-qualified-hydronic-heaters_.html

I own a heatmaster G200 which actually meets the 2020 emissions standards. I have been running it for 3 full seasons. I went from a hardy h4( non compliant smoke dragon) burning 12-13 cords per year to +/-7 cords per year with no more smoke. It is extremely efficient. It is very simple to run, it does idle and will begin to gas in about 60 seconds after start up. Yes you need to use one of the big 3 foam insulated pipes(logstor, rehau or thermopex) to avoid ground water intrusion from a cracked casing. I personally own a 220 year old home that does not have a place for an indoor gasser with storage. The owb gasser landscape has changed, they are simple and easy to run and very effieicnt.

I wish other folks would be so considerate

 

[Ashful]

The landscape has changed as far as owb go. The epa made sweeping changes and started phase 2 in 2015. Any owb now produced for residentual wood use has to be phase 2 compliant meaning it meets the threshold limits set forth. They are independently tested by Intertek and certified. Take a look at the list here. https://19january2017snapshot.epa.gov/burnwise/list-qualified-hydronic-heaters_.html

I own a heatmaster G200 which actually meets the 2020 emissions standards. I have been running it for 3 full seasons. I went from a hardy h4( non compliant smoke dragon) burning 12-13 cords per year to +/-7 cords per year with no more smoke. It is extremely efficient. It is very simple to run, it does idle and will begin to gas in about 60 seconds after start up. Yes you need to use one of the big 3 foam insulated pipes(logstor, rehau or thermopex) to avoid ground water intrusion from a cracked casing. I personally own a 220 year old home that does not have a place for an indoor gasser with storage. The owb gasser landscape has changed, they are simple and easy to run and very effieicnt.

This is great, but 7 cords is still nearly double the average used by those who heat with a wood stove. Not criticizing you, maybe the house is large, but it’s always worth noting cords/sq.ft./HDD, when talking about overall system efficiency.

 

[maple1]

This is great, but 7 cords is still nearly double the average used by those who heat with a wood stove. Not criticizing you, maybe the house is large, but it’s always worth noting cords/sq.ft./HDD, when talking about overall system efficiency.

And how much do you burn per year?

 

[brenndatomu]

This is great, but 7 cords is still nearly double the average used by those who heat with a wood stove. Not criticizing you, maybe the house is large, but it’s always worth noting cords/sq.ft./HDD, when talking about overall system efficiency.

HDDs would be needed if you wanted to crunch the nitty gritty numbers, but with having run an old school OWB long term, and now 3 years in on the G200, I'd say he has enough data to confidently say "I cut 5-6 cords per year (40% ish) just by switching to a gasifier"
That was a lot of wasted fuel, read: a lot less smoke.

 

[hondaracer2oo4]

Yes you are correct about naming all of the metrics involved. I am located in New Hampshire and am heating a 3000 sqft 220 year old home which is decently insulated with high quality Windows but a 220'year old house can only be so tight unless you went crazy. I have a Woodstock soapstone stove
As well that I use during the shoulder seasons and anything below 45 degrees outside It is almost
Useless due to heat loss. After three years of burning the g200 to compare to the conventional I can confidently say i have reduced wood use 40 percent. I doubt I could save more than one extra cord going to a gasser with storage and no idling. Look at the epa list and see what the g200 did compared to the whs1500 and 2000. It is impressive.

 

[Ashful]

And how much do you burn per year?

I never claimed I was average.

 

[Highbeam]

HDDs would be needed if you wanted to crunch the nitty gritty numbers, but with having run an old school OWB long term, and now 3 years in on the G200, I'd say he has enough data to confidently say "I cut 5-6 cords per year (40% ish) just by switching to a gasifier"
That was a lot of wasted fuel, read: a lot less smoke.

Wasted fuel does not always mean extra smoke. It could just as easily mean wasted energy. I’ve certainly been exposed to very clean burning but inefficient stoves!

 

[brenndatomu]

Wasted fuel does not always mean extra smoke. It could just as easily mean wasted energy.

Good point...

 

[Bad LP]

And how much do you burn per year?

Being in Philly probably not much.

 

[Ashful]

Being in Philly probably not much.

We are at only 5000 HDDs/year, surely below some of you. But I burn ten cords of oak + 1000 gallons oil + several hundred dollars in electrons every year, thanks to the size and age of this house.

 

[hondaracer2oo4]

I also have a thermometer at the breach of the stack. Typical stack temps run 300-375 depending on wood, hours on current load etc.