30NC: was VC Encore vs Defiant

[ryan21756]

Hey all,
First time post on this forum. We are purchasing a used woodstove. We will be heating aprox 2000 square feet, with a masonry chimney about 24 feet tall. located inside our house. We intend on using the stove daily but not as our sole source of heat. We would buy new but just built house so are tight on money, and I want to make sure we can make wood heat worth our while. We will purchase seasoned hardwood. I have found some VC stoves that interest me. One is an encore. seller is original owner it was installed new in 2002. He has burnt a cord or less in the stove each year. $600 asking price.
The second is a defiant. Bigger stove but history is not a good. Second owner. has no maint records. He does not even know if the stove has had cat replaced or not. got him talked to $550.
Both stoves look good from pics. IE no warped casts no signs of over firing. The defiant does have some rust on the griddle plate but appears superficial. I feel better about buying the Encore. What are your thoughts? Will the Encore heat the house ok even though it is at the top of its ratings? Typically how long do these stoves last? Thank you guys all for your help. Great site here.
Ryan in Maine
Also what do you all think? Catalytic stove vs non catalytic? I now everone has their opinion. I am interested in hearing what they are.Thanks again. Ryan

 

[BCC_Burner]

I personally wouldn't buy either of those stove to put in my house unless someone was literally going to drop it off on the hearth for free. VC has a pretty poor reputation for customer service, reliability and ease of use. What are the inside dimensions of the flue? Depending on size you may need a liner dropped down it.

For only a couple hundred more bucks you can buy a new Englander NC-30 or Drolet stove and end up with a much higher quality product.

Also, you should buy your wood yesterday. Unless you are buying kiln dried, nobody is going to sell you wood that is actually dry enough to burn well. I would get your wood supply figured out first, then worry about the stove.

 

[Highbeam]

That's like picking between a broken arm or a broken leg. Good gosh man, you live in Maine, you want a better heater.

649$ for a brand new englander NC30 if you are trying to save money. I bet you'll love it so much that you keep it for many years.

 

[stovelark]

Wow guys, no VC fans here!! Me neither, but if the OP is interested in just these two, that's a lot to heat with an Encore in Maine. I too would pass on them and get the best newer stove I could afford. I also agree the NC30 would be the better buy by far. I've had to rebuild the innards of a few VC everburns (AKA Neverburns) and they were always ugly. Ive rebuilt many Jotuls, never seen the interiors be as mangled as some VCs I've seen. Now there are plenty of happy VC owners out there, but their modern products are very expensive and the quality just isn't the same. There are a lot of other MFRs stoves that are just better for less money. Good luck with whatever you choose. If you stay on this path though, I'd go with the Defiant for that area to heat.

 

[ryan21756]

Thanks guys!! I think I will for sure go with the Englander. The thought of a used stove does make me nervous without the ability to completly rebuild it. Where can I get them for $649 shipped. Home Depot shows much more than that. Thanks for your help. Ryan

 

[begreen]

That price is ephemeral. Look for previous threads on the 30NC for examples of how folks have done this. Like this one:
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/englander-nc-30-for-649-00.127299/

 

[Charles1981]

Most everyone on here is pretty harsh on the VC's. I have a 2011 encore which is a slightly different beast. Love mine so far and it heats 2000 sq feet from the basement well but I do wish I had the larger defiant.

It seems there was quite a bit of problems with VC stoves built around that time you are looking at. There probably still is nowadays but the design has changed somewhat. I haven't found mine to be a finicky as some have complained about, but we are still only going into year three this winter with it. Give me another 3-4 years and I may be just as harsh on the VC's as everyone else.

You still want a big stove and the NC30 fits around your price range and the right size and it is new vs used so really not a lot of contest there.

 

[blades]

If you want to heat 2k sq ft you need a stove rated at 3k sq ft. Not knocking the 30, I have one but your Main winters are a bit meaner than my area. Might do well to consider the largest Drolett, or BK King for a one stove install. in reality with 3k footage 2 stoves would be better. If this is a 2 story be aware that as heat rises cold flows down so there will be a cold air draft running down the stairs from the second level. Not a fan of basement installs as always leads to start up problems with reverse flow in the flue. Pre-warming the flue resolves this. A good flue arrangement for a single story is going to cost about a $1k so add that to cost of stove.
Wood stoves are area heaters not whole house furnaces used correctly can make a significant reduction in a utility bill - but you pay your dues up front.
Wood - ditto on what has already been mentioned, no such thing a dry ( less than 20% moisture content internally) fire wood from 99% of vendors. New stoves must have this requirement met or we will be see post of lack of heat, high usage, hard starting , and the like. So plan on acquiring a ton or so of the compressed wood bricks to mix with the firewood for the first season. Also no such thing as dead standing being dry either, maybe the extreme top area branches but the rest of it siphons water back up between the cells. Cut 2 years ago but just split yesterday ain't going to be ready either. Be aware also that most ads stating kiln dried are more to kill bugs than to properly dry fire wood for burning. Raising the internal temp of a split to 170 or so degrees for a couple hours doesn't get it dry. Not trying to be negative just stating facts to give a heads up. I love(particularly when the utility bill shows up) my wood heat been doing it for a long time but it is a life style that needs plenty of advanced planning.
Wood heat is not an area to be cutting corners cost wise- do it correctly the first time and you will be a happy camper.
Couple more points, very important, check with your homeowners insurance - some take a very dim view of solid fuel appliances. Depending on your Ins. and local codes you might have to have a service do the install ( got watch them like hawks also) so they don't try to cut corners to make a extra buck at your expense.

 

[aansorge]

Another possibility...(broken link removed to http://maine.craigslist.org/hsd/4506082429.html)

 

[Charles1981]

F2400 is 2.3cuft, NC30 is 3.5cuft.

Hands down at his price level 600-800$ nothing is gunna beat a NC30.

And as far as needing a 3k stove to heat 2k I really have to argue it is case by case. As I said I have a setup everyone considers worst case with a stove everyone considers a poor choice and it heats my entire house alone from the basement (2100sq feet) without too much difficulty and 1/2 this past winter was at -15degrees and this is with a 2.3cuft firebox as well. Never turned on any supplemental heat.

There are more cases and situations where this doesn't work out than does, but in the world of sub 800 dollar stoves the NC30 is king and not even by a small margin.

 

[Highbeam]

It has been said that while stoves are space heaters, the space we are heating is the whole home. I use no other heat source, even during weeklong stretches of single digit temps.

 

[begreen]

The stove is an area heater. How large that area will be depends on the layout of the area and how well it is isolated from outdoor elements. If the floorplan is relatively open then the stove will heat a large area. Also, if there is an open convection path like a stairwell to a 2nd story above the stove room, then it can help heat the upstairs too. However, if the stove room is isolated by a single doorway, then most of the heat will be concentrated in that room. A fan or two may help mitigate this situation.