Am I being Lied To?

[InformalMantis]

Hello,

I purchased a home in July of this year. It was originally built in 1900 and was completely renovated before coming to my hands.

One of the conditions in the agreement of purchase and sale was that the gas fireplace insert in the wood burning chimney would be operational by close. It wasn't, and after much debate, the company that installed the gas fireplace insert came to my house today to fix it.

I couldn't miss work so my real-estate agent house sat for me. The hvac company sent 4 guys over under the assumption that they would have to replace the liner. They also rented a boom truck for this job. They were able to successfully remove the old liner.

5 hours later my real-estate agent texted me this: "They think there is a nest blocking the hole from when the house was vacant. It's still raining the boss wants to get a bucket truck that goes higher and fabricate a tool from metal that can punch through. He apologized but said he will make it right. It's very far up in the air and this would have worked except for the blockage. So hang in there, boss said he will get it done. His friend has a bucket truck that can get directly above the hole and they can get an auger down."

What is the community's opinion on this text? My question is how were they unable to get the new liner in because of a blockage? If they old liner went down the chimney fine then how can there be a blockage? If there was a nest wouldn't it have been in the old liner which they removed?

 

[bholler]

Hello,

I purchased a home in July of this year. It was originally built in 1900 and was completely renovated before coming to my hands.

One of the conditions in the agreement of purchase and sale was that the gas fireplace insert in the only wood burning chimney would be operational by close. It wasn't, and after much debate, the company that installed the gas fireplace insert came to my house today to fix it.

I couldn't miss work so my real-estate agent house sat for me. The hvac company sent 4 guys over under the assumption that they would have to replace the liner. They also rented a boom truck for this job. They were able to successfully remove the old liner.

5 hours later my real-estate agent texted me this: "They think there is a nest blocking the hole from when the house was vacant. It's still raining the boss wants to get a bucket truck that goes higher and fabricate a tool from metal that can punch through. He apologized but said he will make it right. It's very far up in the air and this would have worked except for the blockage. So hang in there, boss said he will get it done. His friend has a bucket truck that can get directly above the hole and they can get an auger down."

What is the community's opinion on this text? My question is how were they unable to get the new liner in because of a blockage? If they old liner went down the chimney fine then how can there be a blockage? If there was a nest wouldn't it have been in the old liner which they removed?

It sounds a little funny but it is absolutly possible. The liner for a gas insert would be very small and birds could have easily made a nest around it. Especially because many birds make nests in chimneys by simply dropping stuff down the chimney untill it gets hung up and reaches the top.

Or they could have been unprepared and be lying to you to cover that up. No way for us to know.

 

[webby3650]

My first reason for pause would be having an HVAC company work on it. Perhaps they have a specially trained crew? Around here they are known for either messing fireplaces all up, or simply replacing all the expensive components at the customers expense due to their lack of experience. It’s not a furnace..

 

[webby3650]

Did they mention why the liner needed replaced? That’s pretty unusual.

 

[bholler]

My first reason for pause would be having an HVAC company work on it. Perhaps they have a specially trained crew? Around here they are known for either messing fireplaces all up, or simply replacing all the expensive components at the customers expense due to their lack of experience. It’s not a furnace..

Yeah hvac guys dont exactly have a good rep here either

 

[bholler]

Did they mention why the liner needed replaced? That’s pretty unusual.

Not if it was an aluminum one they dont last long at all.

 

[InformalMantis]

Well the fireplace is under warranty with this company so any costs associated with the work they did today falls on them and not on me.

They devoted a 4 man crew for 5 hours + boom truck rental + the liner at their expense to today's fix and they still have to come back.

They left the instruction manual for the liner they brought over, it's called the "Z-Flex" by NovaFlex Group.

They did not mention why they suspected the liner needed to be replaced. But if they want to replace the most expensive part out of their own pocket I won't say no to that.

If the nest was around the liner why would they need to replace it? Wouldn't the nest have no effect on the fireplace?

The original issue was that there would be a pilot light but as soon as you turn up the flame it would die out.

 

[InformalMantis]

Also is it normal to stick an auger down a chimney to clear a blockage?

 

[bholler]

Also is it normal to stick an auger down a chimney to clear a blockage?

Yes it is really the only way to clear a nest.

 

[bholler]

Z flex can be aluminum or stainless. I am guessing they are using aluminum which if they are it is far from the most expensive part.

There is no reason a nest would cause a liner to need to be replaced no matter where the nest was.

 

[InformalMantis]

Well the suspected nest was unknown to any of us until today. I don't know much about fireplaces myself, but during the consultation weeks ago I showed their technician how the gas fireplace dies out under 30 seconds when you turn up the flame and he concluded there needs to be a liner replacement. Anything more than a pilot light and it would snuff out on its own.

It's only when they tried to feed the new liner down the chimney today that they encountered a blockage and told me they need to get an auger.

 

[webby3650]

A direct vent insert would have 2 liners. Typically 2-3” liners, sometimes a 3” and a 4” are required. Very easy to get down most chimneys. It sounds as if they know one got damaged during the original install. If the unit can’t intake air or exhaust it properly, the flame will lift off the burner and shut the unit down.
Lots of other things can cause this too though. Hopefully they are on the right track...

 

[bholler]

Well the suspected nest was unknown to any of us until today. I don't know much about fireplaces myself, but during the consultation weeks ago I showed their technician how the gas fireplace dies out under 30 seconds when you turn up the flame and he concluded there needs to be a liner replacement. Anything more than a pilot light and it would snuff out on its own.

It's only when they tried to feed the new liner down the chimney today that they encountered a blockage and told me they need to get an auger.

There is no way for us to know what is going on without being there. What they are telling you could absolutly be possible. Or it could be complete bs.

 

[InformalMantis]

To be honest, I thought it was a little bizarre how the technician knew that it was a liner issue without ever really inspecting the liner or chimney. I think it was damaged during the original install like you said and they tried to get away with it until they got called out on shoddy work.

 

[InformalMantis]

I wish you guys could see it in person lol. I know speculating is hard and I apologize.

 

[webby3650]

I wish you guys could see it in person lol. I know speculating is hard and I apologize.

No worries, that’s why we are here.

 

[bholler]

To be honest, I thought it was a little bizarre how the technician knew that it was a liner issue without ever really inspecting the liner or chimney. I think it was damaged during the original install like you said and they tried to get away with it until they got called out on shoddy work.

That is entirely possible.

 

[bholler]

I wish you guys could see it in person lol. I know speculating is hard and I apologize.

Not a problem. I wish we had a real answer for you.

 

[webby3650]

Once the new liners are down hopefully it works likenit should. Do you know the brand by chance?

 

[yooper08]

I'm no expert but with a gas fireplace, the fire going out within 30 seconds doesn't seem to me a liner issue. I would be looking at the control valve assembly.

We have a gas log set in one of our fireplaces. To get it to stay lit, you have to turn it just ever so slightly and get lucky, which is abnormal. It was troubleshooted to be the control assembly and however many couple of hundred dollars to replace. We hardly used it before, so I just turned the supply to the logs off and we never use it now.

 

[webby3650]

I'm no expert but with a gas fireplace, the fire going out within 30 seconds doesn't seem to me a liner issue. I would be looking at the control valve assembly.

We have a gas log set in one of our fireplaces. To get it to stay lit, you have to turn it just ever so slightly and get lucky, which is abnormal. It was troubleshooted to be the control assembly and however many couple of hundred dollars to replace. We hardly used it before, so I just turned the supply to the logs off and we never use it now.

This is a direct vent gas insert, totally different than your gas log.

 

[yooper08]

Didn't catch that part, thanks.

 

[webby3650]

Didn't catch that part, thanks.

It could be a few other things than the vent though. We have a few that need modified and tweaked a little right out of the box. If these guys are unfamiliar with direct vent, they could be chasing their tails... sometimes they won’t burn right just because it’s too hot outside to establish draft.