Appalachian 32 BW - Cats working?

[mscotter]

Hello all, I have just started using this stove and it's my first catalytic stove (previously had Buck 26 series in last house). Anyhow, this was a Craigslist purchase, but appears to be in good shape. My home has a real masonry fireplace, terracotta lined, so I went ahead and installed the insert with an 8" flue going up to a stainless blankoff plate that I made and installed just below the damper.

I've been using the stove for several days now and can't determine if the catalyst is working or not. It seems to take a while (30+ minutes) to get the stove warmed up (or the chimney warmed up?) to close the damper so the exhaust is going through the catalyst. It seems like I really have to babysit this stove, and it doesn't seem to run near as warm as I expect it to (compared to past experiences with old Buck stove). It does produce heat, but like I said I can't tell if the catalyst is working or not. Once I have everything warmed up I can completely close off the damper so the gases must be going through the catalyst, but I can see smoke coming out my chimney when I go outside. The old manual I have indicates the catalyst will eliminate most all the smoke. Additionally, the draft control doesn't really seem to affect the stove at all. I can move it from one extreme to the other and it doesn't seem to affect the performance of the stove.

I can see the catalyst honeycomb if I open the door and peer up into the stove and it appears to be in good shape, i.e. it's not blocked off, doesn't look blackened or damaged.

Anyone else have experience with this stove and can comment?

 

[mellow]

Sounds like you have a positive chimney connection, just to make sure is this picture what you have?

(broken image removed)

 

[mellow]

According to the manual the 32 is pretty close to my 52, you can feel free to read up on my stove at: https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/appalachian-52-bay-wood-stove-insert.83621/

You will be able to see where I installed my catalytic probe for monitoring my cats temps, according to the manual you can install one in the same spot above the door next to the damper rod, I would highly recommend doing that so you can make sure your cat is functioning correctly.

 

[Heatsource]

stove wont work very well w/o a full length liner i'm afraid

 

[Woody Stover]

On the Buck 91, I can look in around the bypass rod hole and see the cat glowing (hard to see unless the cat is really blazing.) Not sure if this is the case with your stove...

 

[mscotter]

Sorry for not replying sooner. I was expecting to get an email when there were replies to my post, but never got any so didn't realize so many people had chimed in (thank you).

Mellow, yes my install is similar to that, except my flue pipe from my insert only extends up ~12". I took it up just past the blank-off plate. I was hoping to just get started using this stove and see how I like it before considering a full liner. The cast iron fixture that my damper (Vestal plate) set on is 33+" wide when looking at the front of the stove, but only 6" front to back. Plus that opening is on an angle, so I guess I'd have to get some kind of flex pipe for the installation?

There is no probe hole above the door on my 32-BW. BTW, the serial plate on the back of mine says the mfg date is 2 97, so assume that is Feb '97. The only hole for a probe is on the top of the stove, near the flue pipe. The manual says that the probe there is located just behind one of the catalyst beds.
I'm wondering if I just haven't been running this hard/hot enough. I left the flue open for a bit longer last night and got it much hotter before closing off the flue. I have an IR thermometer I was checking the temps on the top of the stove with, this time it was getting up to 230F or higher, which is definitely higher than I was seeing on the first several burns. I don't know what kind of catalyst temperature this corresponds to on the inside of the stove, but it seemed to be maintaining that temperature.

 

[mellow]

You really need to get a full liner for these stoves to work correctly, and insulation on the liner is highly preferred for optimal draft. I really think you're seeing the effects of poor draft since you do not have a full liner.

The hole on the top is for a digital thermocouple, you can get one for around $60, if you are interested I can get you the link to the one I use. Burning without monitoring cat temps is almost like burning blind with these stoves, stove top will give you an idea, but the blower will also affect those temps since it exits right below.

You can try running it as it is but you will not have its full heating potential.

 

[mscotter]

Would love to have that link for $60 probe! Only one I found cost $110. Please share!

 

[mellow]

http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=17&products_id=279
http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=20_3&products_id=22 <--- order the 6"

When you order put in the notes field to setup the thermocouple for the AT100 and they will put the proper end on it.

 

[mscotter]

Mellow, thanks so much for that info. I just ordered that unit. Great find!
I think I was definitely being too wimpy with how hot I was running the stove, but I wanted to be careful. I've run it a couple more times now where I got it much hotter (temp on top of stove approaching 200F) before closing the damper to engage the catalyst. Something def seemed to happen, as the burn settled down to a nice glow, but the temp on the top of the stove climbed up to 235 - 250 (depending on where I read), and stayed there. Definitely cranking out more heat that's for sure.
This initial install was just to try it out and see how I like it. I think the next step will definitely be to install a liner. I have a terracotta lined chimney, but of course that liner doesn't start til several feet (4 - 5 from looking up from inside the fireplace). The bigger question I have is what do I get to run up through the fixture that supported my damper? I've attached a picture. The opening for my damper is ~33-1/2" wide, but a little less then 6" in the fore/aft direction when looking at the fireplace. Soooo, would I just get 6' flex and flatten it a little to fit up through this opening?

 

[mellow]

You will need to cut out the back part of the damper to fit the liner through.

It will look something like this:

 

[Keimaxbode]

Just wondering if you were able to get everything settled down and what you think of the insert? We are currently looking at one on CL as well. I believe it is the same model anyway. I'm assuming you don't get to take the tax credit if you buy it used, correct?

 

[mellow]

Check with your tax advisor, every state is different, but I was under the impression it is only for New stoves/insert that are replacing an existing non-epa stove/insert.

 

[Jo191145]

Instead of permanently destroying my damper I attached a 12" piece of standard 6" single wall pipe to my liner before dumping it down the chimney. 6" single wall is much smaller than a 6" flexible liner, at least my liner that is. Pulled the single wall right through the damper. Turns out my damper was 7" anyway but I knew I needed all the length I could get.
You should have no problem getting single wall through that damper.

 

[mellow]

Singlewall is not for use in chimneys, should be stainless steel only. The reason being singlewall is only for freestanding stoves where you can see the pipe at all times and know if it has issues, since you will not see the singlewall in the chimney it is not to be used.

 

[Jo191145]

Singlewall is not for use in chimneys, should be stainless steel only. The reason being singlewall is only for freestanding stoves where you can see the pipe at all times and know if it has issues, since you will not see the singlewall in the chimney it is not to be used.

The flexible insert ends at the damper plate/ block off plate. Commonly referred to as a poor mans block off plate on this forum. The single wall is visible in the firebox just like all the other single wall connected to it. Manufacturers produce transition plates which effectively accomplish the same thing. I simply used a standard adjustable elbow to alleviate the need for a costly transition plate.

I agree single wall shouldn't be run up inside a masonry chimney for the exact reasons you specified. I'm curious though. Just for my own edification is there a building code that would prevent it if someone chose to do so?

 

[BKVP]

stove wont work very well w/o a full length liner i'm afraid

+1

 

[mellow]

I agree single wall shouldn't be run up inside a masonry chimney for the exact reasons you specified. I'm curious though. Just for my own edification is there a building code that would prevent it if someone chose to do so?

Plenty of threads on this issue in the past, use the search function.