Automatic Draft Inducer on Wood Stove???

[peauxrouge]

Hi there,
We recently had a Quadra-Fire Millenium installed in our house. It is installed in the basement and the chimney goes out through the foundation and up the side of the house. We live in Montana and as you can imagine it gets quite cold. I love the stove when it is up and rolling. The pain is getting it started. The outside pipe gets very cold and when you open the door to first start a fire you can feel the air coming down the chimney into the house. I have tried pre-warming the chimney by pointing a heat gun up the chimney for about a half-hour then lighting the fire, still smokes an ungodly amount for about 20 minutes before the cold air is forced out of the chimney. Then all is well save for our house smelling like smoke for ages. I have searched this forum and checked most everything though I still have to verify that the fireplace people did indeed get the stack to the required height above the roof.

Assuming that everything is done as it should be, what can I do here? I know you can get a chimney fan for the end of the chimney, though they are around $1k. If it comes to that, I am willing. However, I noticed online here: http://www.northlineexpress.com/itemdesc.asp?ic=5TJ-AD-1 that you can install a draft inducer that would be much cheaper. I am interested to know how well this works if anyone else here has used one? I am VERY interested in this draft inducer and I am willing to try anything right now as I am NOT willing to put up with a smokey house like I have been.

BTW, this model wood stove has a baffle at the top of the inside that helps burn extra gas/ash for a cleaner burn, so this prevents me from performing the rolled up newspaper trick, and the draft is coming in at such a rate initially I doubt it would really work that well.

Thanks for your input.

(BTW, since originaly writing this, we have made sure all pipes are sealed properly, etc. and I have even gone as far as using a weed-burner to pre-heat the chimney, which has worked the best to date.)

 

[karl]

Tjernlund is the company that made the power vent I put in my sisters house. It works well and they included everything I needed.

What gets me is, I live alot further south than you do and I regularly go a few months without the stove every going out. Are you just a weekend burner or something?

 

[peauxrouge]

Yes, the stove is not my primary mode of heating the house, rather a backup heat source for emergencies, or to help in heating when it gets very cold out, teens or lower, which it has been and then-some the last few weeks.

Anyway, was the vent similar to the one I have linked in my initial post? I am intrigued as to how you thought the install was?

 

[atvdave]

I've been to Montana and boy doe's it get cold... and very windy. I'm wondering if the wind isn't causing the problem. Has it been windy outside when the cool air is coming out of the stove?

If so this may be something to look at. I don't know how thy work I just ran across them looking for a replacement rain cap for my chimney.

http://www.chimneycapdesign.com/

It's worth taking a look at.

EDIT... sorry, I forgot to tell you which product to look at.. DraftMaster cap

 

[LLigetfa]

It sounds to me like a stack effect problem with the house. Opening a cellar window should reduce the amount of cold air coming down the cold chimney unless it is wind induced and there is no window on the upwind side.

 

[peauxrouge]

Thanks for all your responses. atvdave, I did make sure to see if it was windy when I was lighting the fire, and at least on ground level it was calm out, just cold. However, I do like the look of that end cap and may have to install it just to be extra sure.

LLigetfa, I think you are most likely correct with your assesment. I do have a window right next to the stove and I do crack that when I attempt to light it now in addition to making sure the furnace and other fans are not on. I have thought a bit about the physics of this and am wondering that, if there is some other vent stack on the roof that sits taller than the chimney stack if that could cause the problem, something like a syphon? I would assume the best way to correct this would be to extend the chimney pipe, no? I believe I read somewhere else that the chimney stack should be at least 2 feet higher than the highest point of the roof. Correct? Or should one go higher?

Thanks again for the responses. This is definitely giving me something to work with.

 

[LLigetfa]

The rule is 2 feet taller than anything within 10 feet of the chimney but if there is another chimney drawing from the cellar that can be a problem. If you get into draft wars, you could end up reversing another working chimney, drawing CO into the house. If there are appliances that draw room air to service the chimney, you need to ensure there is adequate makeup air to the room.

If there are any cold air returns, there must be twice as many sq inches of warm air ducts feeding the space. Cold air return fans must never lower the pressure enough to reverse a chimney. If you damper off warm air registers, you need to reduce the size of the cold air register.

A very common problem is that many people will seal up every cold draft they feel but fail to seal up where the warm air is leaking out higher up. It's easy to find where cold air leaks in but harder to detect where warm air escapes. This "stack effect" causes the pressure in the cellar to drop due to a lack of makup air.

 

[peauxrouge]

The rule is 2 feet taller than anything within 10 feet of the chimney but if there is another chimney drawing from the cellar that can be a problem. If you get into draft wars, you could end up reversing another working chimney, drawing CO into the house. If there are appliances that draw room air to service the chimney, you need to ensure there is adequate makeup air to the room.

If there are any cold air returns, there must be twice as many sq inches of warm air ducts feeding the space. Cold air return fans must never lower the pressure enough to reverse a chimney. If you damper off warm air registers, you need to reduce the size of the cold air register.

A very common problem is that many people will seal up every cold draft they feel but fail to seal up where the warm air is leaking out higher up. It's easy to find where cold air leaks in but harder to detect where warm air escapes. This "stack effect" causes the pressure in the cellar to drop due to a lack of makup air.

Yeah, I hear what you are saying. There are cold air returns for the furnace and those are quite a bit smaller than than the hot air vents. So I think that is OK. The Stove does have it's own air intake running from the outside as well, so I would assume that takes some of the pressure off the stove as far as competition for room air. When my stove is up and rolling, it burns fine and even when the furnace kicks on and starts sucking air the stove doesn't appear to have any problem drawing air and kicking smoke out the chimeny, it's only when starting it when it's 20 degrees F or lower. Even above 20 I can have the problem, it just doesn't take as long for the chimney to get hot and start drawing properly.

It is interesting in what you say about stopping warm air leaking out of the house and that it could have an effect as well. We are in the process of finishing off our basement and the wall on our stairwell is shared with the garage outside. THough there is insulation betweem the walls, we do know there are some cracks where the wall meets the ceiling at the top of the stairs. I imagine this could possibly be some of the problem here, too. Though I know we have blocked some of the cracks, though it won't be completely blocked off until we finish sheet-rocking.

My assumtion here with your comments in mind, though, is there is a stack problem and I will likely have to raise it some and possibly change the chimeny cap to a wind resistant one.