Bye bye ICE

[begreen]

The Bolt EUV is a small vehicle, which is great for urban and local driving, but not a great trip car. The Equinox is much bigger than the EV6 and has a slower charging architecture. My wife tried the Equinox and in less than 5 minutes said no way. It feels like a big SUV. That was a deciding factor when we got the EV6. The Equinox is only 2" shorter than the Blazer EV IIRC and 7.3" longer than the EV6. Chevy needs something in between. The salesperson at the Chevy dealership confirmed that this is a popular and currently unfulfilled request.

Bolt EUV = 169.5" long
VW ID 4 = 180.5" "
KIA EV6 = 184.3" "
Ford Mach e = 186"
Chevy Equinox = 191.6"

 

[EbS-P]

The Bolt EUV is a small vehicle, which is great for urban and local driving, but not a great trip car. The Equinox is much bigger than the EV6 and has a slower charging architecture. My wife tried the Equinox for less than 5 minutes and said no way. It feels like a big SUV. That was a deciding factor when we got the EV6. The Equinox is only 2" shorter than the Blazer EV IIRC and 7.3" longer than the EV6. Chevy needs something in between. The salesperson at the Chevy dealership confirmed that this is a popular and currently unfulfilled request.

Bolt EUV = 169.5" long
VW ID 4 = 180.5" "
KIA EV6 = 184.3" "
Ford Mach e = 186"
Chevy Equinox = 191.6"

And for comparison
Model 3 and Model Y = 186”
ID Buzz. 196”
Model X = 198”
Odyssey = 205”

 

[gthomas785]

Ok I get that there's demand for an inbetween size in the US but the Bolt just doesn't feel that cramped to me. I think it's perfect for other markets that don't have the same American fixation on road tripping. Speaking of which, I think most people would be happier with their cars if they let go of that. Yes, I occasionally need to go on a long trip. Would a larger car be more comfortable? Sure. But the rest of the time, you're burning more kWh to lug around a more expensive, more dangerous, oversized hunk of metal.

 

[DBoon]

And for comparison
Model 3 and Model Y = 186”
ID Buzz. 196”
Model X = 198”
Odyssey = 205”

And Bolt at 163" - remarkably little choice in this segment in the US, much to my consternation.

 

[DBoon]

but the Bolt just doesn't feel that cramped to me.

The backseat legroom of the Bolt is ridiculous for its size. Most people who have ridden in my car can't believe it has that much room on the inside compared to the size on the outside. And the Bolt doesn't feel choppy to me, and it is a nice quiet ride. I just traveled >1000 miles to Virginia and back and averaged 3.7 miles/kWh (average speed probably about 60 mph overall) with snow tires on the car and it was -4 degrees F when I left that day. Not too bad for efficiency.

 

[woodgeek]

The backseat legroom of the Bolt is ridiculous for its size. Most people who have ridden in my car can't believe it has that much room on the inside compared to the size on the outside. And the Bolt doesn't feel choppy to me, and it is a nice quiet ride. I just traveled >1000 miles to Virginia and back and averaged 3.7 miles/kWh (average speed probably about 60 mph overall) with snow tires on the car and it was -4 degrees F when I left that day. Not too bad for efficiency.

Agree 100%. I've owned two now.

Folks pick the EUV to get 2" more legroom in the back, and give up 2" in the cargo area. And then it is longer, more kWh/mi and harder to parallel park.

Whenever I go to a city with difficult parking, I can usually find a spot that no one else can get into.

 

[EbS-P]

Agree 100%. I've owned two now.

Folks pick the EUV to get 2" more legroom in the back, and give up 2" in the cargo area. And then it is longer, more kWh/mi and harder to parallel park.

Whenever I go to a city with difficult parking, I can usually find a spot that no one else can get into.

I never got the appeal of the EUV. Was is AWD? Or at least on option.

 

[gthomas785]

I never got the appeal of the EUV. Was is AWD? Or at least on option.

The drivetrain is 100% identical to the EV. From what I can tell the appeal of the EUV is either the 3" extra legroom in the back seat, or the fact that it 'looks' more like an SUV because the hood is longer. Neither of which sold me on it, which is why I got the EV.

The backseat of the Bolt EV has enough room to fit the ridiculously bulky rear-facing child seats of today even with the front seat all the way back, which IMO is the most space you could possibly need in the back seat of a car.

 

[EbS-P]

The drivetrain is 100% identical to the EV. From what I can tell the appeal of the EUV is either the 3" extra legroom in the back seat, or the fact that it 'looks' more like an SUV because the hood is longer. Neither of which sold me on it, which is why I got the EV.

The backseat of the Bolt EV has enough room to fit the ridiculously bulky rear-facing child seats of today even with the front seat all the way back, which IMO is the most space you could possibly need in the back seat of a car.

Until you have 230# 6’1”, 13 year old He barely fits between car seats in a 3 seat sprinter bench but prefers the front row vs the 3rd row 4 person seat all to his self!

But yeah for normal sized passengers it seems great.

 

[begreen]

Until you have 230# 6’1”, 13 year old He barely fits between car seats in a 3 seat sprinter bench but prefers the front row vs the 3rd row 4 person seat all to his self!

But yeah for normal sized passengers it seems great.

LOL, I was thinking the same thing. We aren't big people, but have some relatives that are. I also like the extra capacity. We've loaded up the car for camping trips with a tent, cooler, pads, food, etc. and still had people room.

 

[DBoon]

Yeah, realistically I'm not statistically short, but I'm also not 6'1" and 230 lbs. I play ice hockey with a a guy who is literally twice my weight (and taller) and I get that not everyone is going to fit comfortably into a Bolt. Having said that, I also didn't "get" the reason Chevy made the EUV, and most likely they made that because their uninspired and uncreative marketing/accounting team (that seems to drive all of their business decisions) put a bunch of survey b.s. into a blender and it came back with "we need to make something bigger but we don't want to spend any money".

 

[sloeffle]

I said the KIA is sure priced great, and the warranty is very tempting. His answer was, well that's good because you'll need it. He went down the list of major defects they discover as mechanics that will never be resolved with part swaps, and then proceeded to name about a dozen other issues that scared me away from the brand for life.

HK ( Hyundai / Kia ) cheapening out years ago. and not putting immobilizers on their vehicles definitely put them on my do no buy list. Some insurance companies won't even let you insure a HK vehicle.

Hyundai and Kia car thefts surged by more than 1000% since 2020 after viral TikToks exposed key security flaw, report says

The rise in thefts began after viral social media videos showed how some Kia and Hyundai models could be hijacked using only a USB cord.

www.businessinsider.com

 

[begreen]

HK ( Hyundai / Kia ) cheapening out years ago. and not putting immobilizers on their vehicles definitely put them on my do no buy list. Some insurance companies won't even let you insure a HK vehicle.

Hyundai and Kia car thefts surged by more than 1000% since 2020 after viral TikToks exposed key security flaw, report says

The rise in thefts began after viral social media videos showed how some Kia and Hyundai models could be hijacked using only a USB cord.

www.businessinsider.com

That is for a specific date range of their cars. It was corrected by 2022. Not an issue with their newer cars or any of their EVs.

 

[sloeffle]

That is for a specific date range of their cars. It was corrected by 2022. Not an issue with their newer cars or any of their EVs.

Correct, but they should have never built a car without an immobilizer in the first place. This isn't the 70's or the 80's.

My uncle has a Genesis and he says it's the best car he's ever had. Hopefully they learned their lesson, but time will tell.

 

[biopete]

I've been driving electric since 2004, starting with a 2004 Honda Insight hybrid, then a 2014 Nissan Leaf EV, and now a 2020 Chevy Bolt. Charging with the sun as well. I'll never go back.

View attachment 329064 View attachment 329065

I love your place so much. It is a really good feeling driving with Sun power.

 

[sloeffle]

Saw this on the news last night. 10k for a used Bolt with 15k miles, that's my kind of deal.

Why the red state of Utah is going green and embracing electric vehicles

This past week, President Trump suspended a program to expand the country’s network of electric vehicle chargers. It’s the latest in his series of efforts to undo Biden-era policies encouraging EV adoption. But in some parts of the country, EVs and other low-carbon technologies are becoming more...

www.pbs.org

 

[walhondingnashua]

Saw this on the news last night. 10k for a used Bolt with 15k miles, that's my kind of deal.

Why the red state of Utah is going green and embracing electric vehicles

This past week, President Trump suspended a program to expand the country’s network of electric vehicle chargers. It’s the latest in his series of efforts to undo Biden-era policies encouraging EV adoption. But in some parts of the country, EVs and other low-carbon technologies are becoming more...

www.pbs.org

I personally have thought it shouldn't ever be a political issue on whether there should be more EVs or not. For environmental reasons, its the correct direction to go. However, I have seen it as more of an expansion of choice for consumers. For some, the EV is the way to go. For others, as least based off of what is available in the market today, ICE is still the best option.

I was very interested in the Canoo trucks. I don't really care how they looked, but they were very functional for my needs and the price was more reasonable. Unfortunately, its seems they have gone bankrupt.

 

[begreen]

More, competitive choices has always been touted as good for the market. Hybrids make good sense for those that still need an ICE vehicle. We're enjoying not visiting the gas pump and silent running. Not going back.

I'm looking forward to the return of long range. It's starting to creep back up with spring temps. The car so far has exceeded EPA estimates for our driving. In the summer we were gettting north of 310 mile range. In the winter with all the creature comforts and heat we wanted, this dropped down to around 270 miles with a full charge. Still not shabby.

 

[woodgeek]

Well, I did get my first 'grown-up' BEV a couple weeks ago, >11 years after I got my first, a LEAF.

A used 2022 Volvo C40, in Fjord Blue. Behold!

It has adaptive cruise control with lane keeping, AWD with sticky Pirelli Scorpion tires and a 4.4 sec 0-60 time. Panoramic glass roof and the 'Ultimate' trim package for a nice interior with ambient lighting and matching Blue trim panels.

Its a 'crossover', higher driving height, with all dimensions interior and exterior similar to the Ford Mustang Mach-E. But its quicker than the MME standard and premium trims, and a much nicer interior and cheaper (used).

MSRP about $60k in 2022, I got it for $28k with 24k miles. TCO is similar to the leased Bolt it replaces, insurance is lower.

Drove it on a 750 mile round trip the day after I bought it. A 'shake out' if you will. I only charged at Tesla superchargers the whole trip, at up to 150 kW speeds (<20-80% charge time about 25 minutes). HW range is about 220 miles (or 140 miles 80% to <20%) at 75 mph in the summer.

It weighs almost 6000 lbs, and is thus 50% heavier than my Bolt. Uses maybe 10-15% more energy per mile.

I got it bc my partner got a '23 last year, and she has loved it.

I sold my 2015 Volt over the summer, and will return my 2022 Bolt lease this month. We are an all BEV family now.

 

[sloeffle]

I was reading something about insurance rates for BEV's on electrek yesterday. Are they that much higher for a BEV than an ICE? I'm assuming that's being considered when comparing TCO.

 

[woodgeek]

I was reading something about insurance rates for BEV's on electrek yesterday. Are they that much higher for a BEV than an ICE? I'm assuming that's being considered when comparing TCO.

I don't have enough comparison data WRT ICE... but I think insurance costs track purchase price. The C40 is much cheaper (bought used) to insure than the leased Bolt (with a high MSRP) it replaces. And that helps TCO on that comparison.

 

[begreen]

Congrats on the new wheels.

I think insurance costs track repair costs which are substantially higher with modern high tech cars. The tech gets inserted into a lot of places that used to be cheap to repair but now are not. There are sensors in bumpers, cameras everywhere, cooling system pumps tucked in corners, etc. A relatively minor incident can total some cars for this reason if it's hit in the wrong place.

 

[bogieb]

Well, I did get my first 'grown-up' BEV a couple weeks ago, >11 years after I got my first, a LEAF.

A used 2022 Volvo C40, in Fjord Blue. Behold!

View attachment 340040

It has adaptive cruise control with lane keeping, AWD with sticky Pirelli Scorpion tires and a 4.4 sec 0-60 time. Panoramic glass roof and the 'Ultimate' trim package for a nice interior with ambient lighting and matching Blue trim panels.

Its a 'crossover', higher driving height, with all dimensions interior and exterior similar to the Ford Mustang Mach-E. But its quicker than the MME standard and premium trims, and a much nicer interior and cheaper (used).

MSRP about $60k in 2022, I got it for $28k with 24k miles. TCO is similar to the leased Bolt it replaces, insurance is lower.

Drove it on a 750 mile round trip the day after I bought it. A 'shake out' if you will. I only charged at Tesla superchargers the whole trip, at up to 150 kW speeds (<20-80% charge time about 25 minutes). HW range is about 220 miles (or 140 miles 80% to <20%) at 75 mph in the summer.

It weighs almost 6000 lbs, and is thus 50% heavier than my Bolt. Uses maybe 10-15% more energy per mile.

I got it bc my partner got a '23 last year, and she has loved it.

View attachment 340041

I sold my 2015 Volt over the summer, and will return my 2022 Bolt lease this month. We are an all BEV family now.

First - congrats on your new-to-you vehicle!
Second - Holy cow, that thing weighs more than my fully loaded Explorer (I just had it weighed at the dump the other day).

 

[woodgeek]

Anyone who wants a wayback machine thread... here is my 'got an EV' post from 2014:

Thread 'a 2013 Leaf for the woodgeeks'

May 8, 2014

The wife and I commute in opposite directions, me into Philly on the train, her to the exurbs by car.

We have a new-ish Mazda5 microvan for family roadtrips, and an 11 yo high-mileage Camry, which was her previous commuter car, now retired to 'second car' status. Commuting in the Mazda is a gas-guzzler.

We just traded in the Camry for a Nissan Leaf lease. It will be her new commuter.

Looks like this:

Nissan's 'teaser' lease rate is $199/mo, $2k down, 3 years, 36k miles (about what she does commuting)...

• woodgeek
• Replies: 150
• Forum: The Green Room

• 

11 years later, the Mrs is gone, and I am still buying blue EVs.

 

[DBoon]

Are they that much higher for a BEV than an ICE?

I live in a rural part of NY state. When I bought my Bolt in December of 2019, it was basically replacing a Chevy Sonic with 150,000 miles on it. My insurance for the Sonic was $1000 a year. My insurance for the Bolt was $1200 a year (it was brand new). I think some BEVs can have high insurance costs but mine certainly does not.