Cold Air Return

[mass_burner]

I know there is info on this scattered among numerous threads, but I wanted specific info. I'm intrigued with the idea, but I'm not sure it will work for me. I have a 1 story ranch with a full basement footprint (8 foot ceilings).

1. Would I cut vents with an inline fan from the cold bedrooms to the stove room (living room- LR).
2. Could the vents on a closet floor? We have two bedrooms (at the end of of the hallway) where the closets are back-to-back.
3. Would the door between the stove room (LR) and the "cold rooms" need to stay open for this to work?
4. How big are these vents? 8"?
5. Would just 1 vent do the trick?


Thanks.

 

[mass_burner]

Do I need to provide additional details here?

 

[tcassavaugh]

probably a little more info would help. is it going to be an insert or free standing......where are you going to put it...upstairs or downstairs. I have a ranch that is about 1200 sq feet upstairs and about the same below with a full basement. I have my primary setup in the basement and a secondary smaller stove upstairs most of the time I heat the whole house with the basement stove. natural convection without any return vents or openings in the floor or ceiling brings the house up to temp of around 70-75. during the last cold snap, I had both stoves going and it stayed between 75 and 80. I would try it for a couple of weeks without modifying my rooms, walls or ceiling and see what happens. you can always cut the holes and put vents in later if you need to. who knows, you might find the natural movement adequate to meet your needs and expectations. just an opinion....good luck

 

[mellow]

I remembered this thread from years ago since what your looking to do is similar, check it out: Moving the heat!

 

[mass_burner]

probably a little more info would help. is it going to be an insert or free standing......where are you going to put it...upstairs or downstairs. I have a ranch that is about 1200 sq feet upstairs and about the same below with a full basement. I have my primary setup in the basement and a secondary smaller stove upstairs most of the time I heat the whole house with the basement stove. natural convection without any return vents or openings in the floor or ceiling brings the house up to temp of around 70-75. during the last cold snap, I had both stoves going and it stayed between 75 and 80. I would try it for a couple of weeks without modifying my rooms, walls or ceiling and see what happens. you can always cut the holes and put vents in later if you need to. who knows, you might find the natural movement adequate to meet your needs and expectations. just an opinion....good luck

Sorry, I should have mentioned. I already have 2 inserts upstairs in the "common area". I call it that because there are no walls between the LR/Dining Room/Family Room/Kitchen, only a 13' wide floor to ceiling double sided chimney/hearth in the middle. My issue is getting heat into the half of the house where the bedrooms are.

 

[mass_burner]

probably a little more info would help. is it going to be an insert or free standing......where are you going to put it...upstairs or downstairs. I have a ranch that is about 1200 sq feet upstairs and about the same below with a full basement. I have my primary setup in the basement and a secondary smaller stove upstairs most of the time I heat the whole house with the basement stove. natural convection without any return vents or openings in the floor or ceiling brings the house up to temp of around 70-75. during the last cold snap, I had both stoves going and it stayed between 75 and 80. I would try it for a couple of weeks without modifying my rooms, walls or ceiling and see what happens. you can always cut the holes and put vents in later if you need to. who knows, you might find the natural movement adequate to meet your needs and expectations. just an opinion....good luck

I assume your basement ceiling is unfinished? If so, what happens if a glowing spark/ash somehow floats up to the ceiling and lodges against a wood joist?

 

[tcassavaugh]

nope, finished basement, drop ceiling, never had a spark ash or coal go up....had a few go down to the protector over the tile floor. never worried about it.

 

[mass_burner]

nope, finished basement, drop ceiling, never had a spark ash or coal go up....had a few go down to the protector over the tile floor. never worried about it.

how does the hot air get through the drop ceiling? do you have insulation between the joists?

 

[tcassavaugh]

I have one adjoining furnace room that is unfinished and open joists. I leave the door open so the heat migrates to that room. it in turn gets between the ceiling and floor and heats that area. I also pull one or two tiles about mid house to allow the heat to get between the ceiling and main house floor. the kids aren't home anymore and we seldom use the basement so having a couple of the tiles out for the winter season doesn't bother me. over the course of a day or so, all the floors are heated and it starts to heat the rooms. cold air travels down my stairs while warm air comes up. I used to smoke, and I would hold up a cigarette just to see the air flow I could see travel both ways. I have a blower on the summit, at the opposite end of the house from the stairs. I used to have some corner fans for doorways or along the hallway but they didn't seem to help that much and while I still have them, I don't use them anymore.

 

[mass_burner]

I have one adjoining furnace room that is unfinished and open joists. I leave the door open so the heat migrates to that room. it in turn gets between the ceiling and floor and heats that area. I also pull one or two tiles about mid house to allow the heat to get between the ceiling and main house floor. the kids aren't home anymore and we seldom use the basement so having a couple of the tiles out for the winter season doesn't bother me. over the course of a day or so, all the floors are heated and it starts to heat the rooms. cold air travels down my stairs while warm air comes up. I used to smoke, and I would hold up a cigarette just to see the air flow I could see travel both ways. I have a blower on the summit, at the opposite end of the house from the stairs. I used to have some corner fans for doorways or along the hallway but they didn't seem to help that much and while I still have them, I don't use them anymore.

got it. my basement is open, one big room. i want to keep it that way. i'm planning on spray foaming the first 2' in all the way around the perimeter ceiling and keep the rest unfinished. I also want to put an insert in the fireplace.

 

[begreen]

If I understand your desire I think you could run an insulated 8" duct from the bedrooms (tee off into 2 - 6" branches., one per br). If you want to close the door you will need to put vents or louvers in the doors to permit air flow. Same goes if in the closets. Put a 150 cfm inline, quiet fan in the duct and terminate it in the stove room. Suck cooler air out of the bedrooms and blow it into the stove room. That will set up a good convection pattern and should even out temps nicely.

 

[Motor7]

I assume your basement ceiling is unfinished? If so, what happens if a glowing spark/ash somehow floats up to the ceiling and lodges against a wood joist?

what? Not only have I never experienced this, I have never heard it happening. Hot coals on the hearth/floor?...Yes. Airborne inside the house?...No

I guess a back puff could do it, but to get one to stick on the ceiling would have to be a perfect storm scenario. But, then again I have never had a back puffer.

 

[mass_burner]

what? Not only have I never experienced this, I have never heard it happening. Hot coals on the hearth/floor?...Yes. Airborne inside the house?...No

I guess a back puff could do it, but to get one to stick on the ceiling would have to be a perfect storm scenario. But, then again I have never had a back puffer.

Well, if the stove door is opened quickly at the wrong time a hot ash could float out and rise to the ceiling. Low probability yes, but could happen.

 

[begreen]

Not going to happen unless you are burning garbage or cardboard carelessly in the stove. FWIW, the same thing could happen in a living room. It def won't happen burning those NIELs.

 

[mass_burner]

Not going to happen unless you are burning garbage or cardboard carelessly in the stove. FWIW, the same thing could happen in a living room. It def won't happen burning those NIELs.

I guess it just looks more scary than it is, the open joist bays. I'll drop it.

So if I'm going to
Install an insert anyway in the basement, would doing the air movement be superfluous?

 

[Motor7]

So if I'm going to
Install an insert anyway in the basement, would doing the air movement be superfluous?

No, not at all. Yes basement to main is convection, but that hot air rising I have found gets pretty much trapped undert the main floor. I do not have a ceiling in my basement, and very little heat makes it onto the main unless I help it with fans. I was running 3 high volume computer fans, one on each floor register under the great room(directly above the stove). After experimenting, I found that only two on the far wall worked better so that's all I am running right now. Even with that air moving, I still have about a 10 degree difference in temps from basement to main, so even more air could be moved. But, I'm happy with it now, so I am leaving it alone.

 

[begreen]

I guess it just looks more scary than it is, the open joist bays. I'll drop it.

So if I'm going to
Install an insert anyway in the basement, would doing the air movement be superfluous?

Maybe. A 5th stove?! Are there 5 chimneys in the house?

 

[mass_burner]

Maybe. A 5th stove?! Are there 5 chimneys in the house?

The basement insert would replace the US stove, its a cheap steel box stove.

But yes, five: 2 inserts, hearth oven, basement fireplace, furnace exhaust.

 

[mass_burner]

If I understand your desire I think you could run an insulated 8" duct from the bedrooms (tee off into 2 - 6" branches., one per br). If you want to close the door you will need to put vents or louvers in the doors to permit air flow. Same goes if in the closets. Put a 150 cfm inline, quiet fan in the duct and terminate it in the stove room. Suck cooler air out of the bedrooms and blow it into the stove room. That will set up a good convection pattern and should even out temps nicely.

Would the inline fan go in the cold room or stove room?

 

[begreen]

I would put it the basement where the duct is running, probably closer to the stove room to reduce noise in the sleeping area.

 

[Lumber-Jack]

I assume your basement ceiling is unfinished? If so, what happens if a glowing spark/ash somehow floats up to the ceiling and lodges against a wood joist?

If you have loose sparks like that flying around your house it's only a mater of time until your house burns down anyway.
I wouldn't be worried about a glowing ash catching an exposed wooden floor joist on fire, but most people have things like upholstered fabric furniture, fabric curtains, clothing, paper products, kindling, matches, and who knows what else, that would be a heck of a lot more flammable than a "floor joist", in their stove rooms. I know I do.
What happens if a glowing spark/ash floats over and lodges against any of those things?

 

[begreen]

I have never had a glowing spark "float" out of the stove. They shoot out when an ember pops or when burning particularly sparky wood.