Collapsing Wood market article

[peakbagger]

http://www.concordmonitor.com/logging-industry-law-future-nh-new-hampshire-10513758

Not just NH, Maine and VT are in the same shape. Mass has few if any loggers left . With cheap oil and natural gas a lot of folks aren't burning as much firewood.

 

[sportbikerider78]

The best thing you can do if you burn, is buy your own property and selectively log it as needed. Or get to know someone who will let you manage their land.

 

[peakbagger]

That's what I did, but the reality is the opportunity cost for the money paid for the lot would pay for a lot of firewood.

At least my carrying cost is low, $36 a year in taxes for 82 acres as its in current use. I expect there will be far more wood on the ground rotting than I possibly can haul off for firewood.

 

[kennyp2339]

My gut feeling is that the price of natural gas will be higher this up coming winter, with the increase of gas will come electric since most utility generators have converted generation to natural gas. Its sad to say but (in the northeast) there is no real diversified market for electrical generation so the gas companies have us by the bananas.. I other words, get on your (3) year plan for wood, if your thinking of installing solar panels, do it now will rebates are there and labor is cheap.

 

[heavy hammer]

I agree with kennyp2339 what happens when gas prices begin to climb. Low gas prices are great for everyone now but do you really think they will stay low. As power plants convert all generating plants to gas prices are bound to go up. I say keep cutting and stacking, better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it. Just my thoughts.

 

[gerry100]

We heat with oil and the math gets more challenging as prices fall/

My conservative assumption is that a full cord displaces about 100 gals of heating oil. Currently this means that a cord I produce on my lot is worth about $220. My records show it takes me 15-20 hours of hard labor per cord from standing tree to stacked in shed.

My hourly rate has fallen from $20 to around $13.

On the plus side it's tax free and after 2-3 hours in the woods I've got my daily exercise and then some.

So I'll still be out there for at least 3 more seasons and taper off at 70 after 40 years

 

[Bad LP]

IMHO the low energy prices are not going to last long.

I've pumped a lot of money into converting to wood being the primary heating source. It's going to take years to pay off but last year with a secondary home that got a little use it was over $2000 to heat and that was mostly empty at 55. If we were there full time or even 50% more that would be 5K maybe 6K easy in LP.

I have a long way to go to pay off 15K plus wood splitting equipment and saws plus some portion of a tractor but I have never felt I wasted any money along the way. It sure as hell sucked spending it but I can now look at a pile of capital equipment versus a bank statement.

 

[beatlefan]

First year in my home I spent $4,000 on propane. I put my stove in the following summer. Now I get 12 months out of a tank of propane, which is great. But fact is...I'd still heat with wood if the propane was free. I just like it.

 

[lost in the woods]

interesting article. . . don't forget its not all about using lowgrade wood for fuel. . . with the increased popularity of the internet(online magazines, newpapers, electronic payment of bills ect. . . ) we are using way less paper, there for the papermills market for their product is and will continue to shrink. We still need toilet paper though! I can't imagine wiping my butt with this computer monitor LOL

 

[kennyp2339]

interesting article. . . don't forget its not all about using lowgrade wood for fuel. . . with the increased popularity of the internet(online magazines, newpapers, electronic payment of bills ect. . . ) we are using way less paper, there for the papermills market for their product is and will continue to shrink. We still need toilet paper though! I can't imagine wiping my butt with this computer monitor LOL

Or honey locust for that matter

 

[WoodyIsGoody]

We still need toilet paper though! I can't imagine wiping my butt with this computer monitor LOL

Pacific Northwest loggers use moss if they need to take a mid-day dump. Plentiful, gentle and cheap!

 

[Longstreet]

What that article really means is that proper property management is more important than ever. When you have a healthy market for all forms of cellulose, including low grade logs for the chipper, it doesn't matter as much what quality tree you grow - the loggers will be able to sell everything. Getting rid of poor quality trees at a young age is more critical if you will not be able to monetize them at the time of harvest. As much as it sucks for the loggers, I bet the top shelf foresters are more in-demand.

 

[billb3]

We heat with oil and the math gets more challenging as prices fall/

My conservative assumption is that a full cord displaces about 100 gals of heating oil. Currently this means that a cord I produce on my lot is worth about $220. My records show it takes me 15-20 hours of hard labor per cord from standing tree to stacked in shed.

My hourly rate has fallen from $20 to around $13.

On the plus side it's tax free and after 2-3 hours in the woods I've got my daily exercise and then some.

So I'll still be out there for at least 3 more seasons and taper off at 70 after 40 years

From BTU ratings charts ( they don't all agree on precise exact numbers )
one cord of red oak = 24,000,000 BTU
one cord of eastern white pine = 14,300,000 BTU
one gallon of HHO = 138,700 BTU

24,000,000 / 138,700 = 173 gallons of oil equivalent
14,300,000 / 138,700 = 103 gallons of oil


Today, a gallon of HHO is $1.68 here, so a cord of red oak would be "equivalently worth" $290.00
So if you bought that cord of oak for $250, in simplistic terms heating with wood would seem cheaper.
But it's not.
Depends on how many BTU your appliance turns into heat and how much of those BTUs go up the chimney.
If your wood stove is 70% efficient then that $250 cord of red oak nets 16.8 million BTU of heat. $250 / 16.8 = $14.88/ one million BTU
If your oil burner is 70% efficient then one million BTU costs you $17.30
-(oak) wood is cheaper to heat with
If your oil burner is new and 90% efficient then one million BTU costs you $13.50
-HHO is cheaper to heat with

Oak - $14.88
HHO(70%) -$17.30
HHO(90%)-$13.50


For some people, HHO is most certainly a cheaper alternative for heat right now. For some it is a wash, others - not too much more.

I posit that the average person isn't likely to buy and heat with wood unless there is a significant savings to be gained for the extra work involved.

 

[gerry100]

I don't burn any pine, almost all maple and oak with some birch and ash.

I think I just got a raise

 

[osagebow]

Pacific Northwest loggers use moss if they need to take a mid-day dump. Plentiful, gentle and cheap!

I'm a Sassafrass man here in the east. Plentiful, soft, absorbent, and Leaves ya smelling like rootbeer

 

[iamlucky13]

interesting article. . . don't forget its not all about using lowgrade wood for fuel. . . with the increased popularity of the internet(online magazines, newpapers, electronic payment of bills ect. . . ) we are using way less paper, there for the papermills market for their product is and will continue to shrink. We still need toilet paper though! I can't imagine wiping my butt with this computer monitor LOL

Packaging use is increasing significantly, however. At the same time, in the office environment, the ease of printing multiple copies of documents, of flipping back and forth through printed pages compared to on a screen, and of adding notes to printed documents, means the paperless office concept is not in practice anywhere remotely as appealing as it sounds in theory.