I got the insert to save some money and enjoy the fire. It's been a three years since I got it but still learning to use it in a most efficient way. Last year I was trying to use the fan as little as possible. It was fine, the masonry was getting hot and kept house warm. This year I tried to run fan on low constantly and noticed that heat output from stove is increased tremendously.I'm wondering what is estimated cost of running fan on low trough the winter. Does it affect bottom line much and makes wood heat lees feasible? Can't find any specs on blowers in manual. I'm in Northeast . Just wondering what rough $$$$ would be?
Cost of running fan on insert
- Thread starter Dmitry
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I had the same results as you regarding fan speed. Just enough to move air out of the jacket but not so much as to cool down the stove. Anyhow to you question;
(Amps x Volt x hrs/day)/1000 = daily kwh use. A fan is probably around 1.5a and 115v.
(1.5x115x24)/1000= 4.14kwh x30= 124.2. If your paying. 10 cents/kwh your at $12.42/mo. You'd have to get all your specs on the fan to be accurate.
Best way is to get a kill-a-watt. Plug it inline and you can measure all your appliances.
(Amps x Volt x hrs/day)/1000 = daily kwh use. A fan is probably around 1.5a and 115v.
(1.5x115x24)/1000= 4.14kwh x30= 124.2. If your paying. 10 cents/kwh your at $12.42/mo. You'd have to get all your specs on the fan to be accurate.
Best way is to get a kill-a-watt. Plug it inline and you can measure all your appliances.
Is there any possible way to get an amp meter on the circuit supplying the fan? Maybe back at the breaker box if nothing else? Get a few readings with the fan on low, then a few with the fan off. That'll give you some rough data to calculate KWH, then figure cost off your electric bill.
You need to be able to safely work with the breaker box, but it's not too bad as long as you're careful.
EDITED: I see rwhite gave a more complete answer while I was typing. And, yes, if you can plug in a kill-a-watt that is the best way to do it. Leave it in for 24 hours, then read the daily usage right off it.
You need to be able to safely work with the breaker box, but it's not too bad as long as you're careful.
EDITED: I see rwhite gave a more complete answer while I was typing. And, yes, if you can plug in a kill-a-watt that is the best way to do it. Leave it in for 24 hours, then read the daily usage right off it.
Easy Livin’ 3000
Minister of Fire
Great question, Dmitry!
What about using a DC blower? I read that they use less electricity, but know nothing about it.. I'm going to create a new thread on this topic as well.
Back to the original question. Can't use an insert without using the fan. If you are using a gas or oil furnace, you still use a fan. If you use hot water heat, you'll use a pump. If you had a freestanding stove, you'd still need some way to circulate unless the house was designed around the stove (or it just sort of worked out that way).
I say we don't worry about using our fans, but instead worry about making them as efficient as possible. I've considered coupling a DC blower with a deep cycle battery and keeping the battery charging with solar when possible, off the grid when not possible. Feedback appreciated!
What about using a DC blower? I read that they use less electricity, but know nothing about it.. I'm going to create a new thread on this topic as well.
Back to the original question. Can't use an insert without using the fan. If you are using a gas or oil furnace, you still use a fan. If you use hot water heat, you'll use a pump. If you had a freestanding stove, you'd still need some way to circulate unless the house was designed around the stove (or it just sort of worked out that way).
I say we don't worry about using our fans, but instead worry about making them as efficient as possible. I've considered coupling a DC blower with a deep cycle battery and keeping the battery charging with solar when possible, off the grid when not possible. Feedback appreciated!
I never experienced a difference in usage between fan/no fan. The caveat being that if your stove has thermostatically controlled damper using the fan may cause the stove to cool and the damper to open.
mstoelton
Feeling the Heat
The clydesdale fan draws between 25 and 70 watts. Normal usage for me is closer to 30-35. So that is between .25 and .29 amps.
.29 x 115 x 24 / 1000 = 0.80 KW per day x 30 days per month = 24 KW per month @ $.10 / KW that is $2.40 per month not including all of the miscellaneous fees for the power company.
.29 x 115 x 24 / 1000 = 0.80 KW per day x 30 days per month = 24 KW per month @ $.10 / KW that is $2.40 per month not including all of the miscellaneous fees for the power company.
No reason why it wouldn't work. I just used an inverter when my power went out. Not sure what the draw is on a small inverter but with an 80 amp/hr battery should last at least a day with no recharging. I only ran mine about 10 hrs at most.
I'm sure the 1.5a that I used as an example is probably max start up draw. Using the killawatt is going to be the most accurate.
My insert didn't put out much heat without the blower, so it mainly ran on high all the time. But about the efficiency question, I'd say if we are talking about a fireplace insert then you'd want to pull as much heat off it as you could. By turning the blower down the temperature might go up on the stove but that is also going to increase the temperature of the flue gasses I would assume, so you're probably wasting as much or more heat up the flu than you're saving on electricity for a fan.
In my application my insert uses about $10 per month in extra electricity and that is toggling between high and low on the fan speed. High heats up the house very quickly, and i notice that the coldest spot in the house climbs in temperature much quicker, before the house reaches an equilibrium in temperature disbursement.
On my fan, the difference between running it on low and off is roughly .032 kWh, which over 30 days is $1.87 for me.
Niko
Minister of Fire
Ok, so having built and lived in our off-grid home with photovoltaic panels and a large battery bank for 35+ years, your idea is feasible. No problem.
However, it will turn out to be something you do just because you want to, not to save money, in the long run. I mean, you go from having a wood stove with an AC fan, period, to a deep-cycle battery, a DC motor [if you have one lying around, free, if not, gotta buy one of the proper size to run that particular fan], a solar panel, a solar controller to keep the battery healthy and not overcharged. The deep-cycle battery will have to be replaced every few years and must be kept charged properly during the off season for burning, like all summer. Which all means a lot more tending-to and owner involvement than a simple wood stove. Not that I think it's dumb or anything; after all, my entire home is solar electric with a mix of both DC and AC things operating.
Just to keep it in perspective.
My electric bill fluctuates about 2-3 dollars a month in LIPA's favor, when I am using the insert, which is at least 90% of the time in colder months (October to April, atleast ! ) .
That's all I need to know
That's all I need to know
Poindexter
Minister of Fire
I run the convection deck fans on bk stove constantly. Yes it shortens burn time. But i get better heat distribution throughout the house.
In the rigjt weather i can run the stove without the fans, keep the stove room at 85 and the back bedrooms on the same floor at maybe 60dF with 24 hour burns.
Same weather with the deck fans and a box fan in the hall i can keep the stove room at 85, the back bedrooms at 78 and still have 12 hour burns.
So yeah, sure, i am burning twice as much wood, but i am heating a lot more volume with the same stove.
I add up the current draw listed on the ul tag, plan on 24 hours per day, look at my electric bill and come up with something like 2 bucks a day in electric to feed one stove twice instead of two stoves once. New second chimney $2500, new second wood stove $4200, still burn 8 cords annually either way, i am running the fans and liking it.
In the rigjt weather i can run the stove without the fans, keep the stove room at 85 and the back bedrooms on the same floor at maybe 60dF with 24 hour burns.
Same weather with the deck fans and a box fan in the hall i can keep the stove room at 85, the back bedrooms at 78 and still have 12 hour burns.
So yeah, sure, i am burning twice as much wood, but i am heating a lot more volume with the same stove.
I add up the current draw listed on the ul tag, plan on 24 hours per day, look at my electric bill and come up with something like 2 bucks a day in electric to feed one stove twice instead of two stoves once. New second chimney $2500, new second wood stove $4200, still burn 8 cords annually either way, i am running the fans and liking it.
A friend of mine gave me a 'Kill-a-watt'. You plug it in the wall then plug the device in and done.
Guys, thank you for great responses. Now , when we established that using fan is not going to break the bank i want to know what is the best way to use it depending on burn circle etc. I'll start separate thread. Please, chime in.
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/best-way-to-use-insert-fan.160258/
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/best-way-to-use-insert-fan.160258/
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Easy Livin’ 3000
Minister of Fire
Excellent points, SteveKG, and you are right, probably not going to break even on the setup for many years (or never). That said, it would also serve as a backup when the electricity goes out for a day or more, which tends to happen around here at least every year or two, and this also happens to be when the stove really earns its keep. What do you think the appropriate size solar panel, controller, and battery would cost, all sized just for the blower?
Batteries are $80-100 for a run of the mill deep cycle. My solar panel is an old fence charger it about 1'x2' and charges 1/2a. This is just a WAG but I'd think you need to calculate your draw and add at least a 1/2a for charging. I only use my charger for the camper. Running a few leds, water pump, and heater a few hrs a night. If all you would use it for is stove fan in emergencies a few days every year or two I'd just get a battery and a battery tender and just keep it charged. Bad part is , I'd think you'd find you will use it once or twice over a 4-5yr period and need a new battery. I only do it because I have boats/campers that already have batteries.
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