Demand for Pucks or Bricks?

[SJK1]

My firm produces from 2000 to 2500 tons per year of DRY (kiln dried) hardwood sawdust. We are exploring the possibilities of putting in compression equipment to manufacture either pucks or bricks. I believe the pucks would go more for boilers and larger industrial users for boiler type applications. I think the bricks are used more for wood stoves and retail uses.

Can anyone give me advice as to what is being consumed? Is there a good demand for these types of fuels? Can anyone help with current market pricing? Does anyone know of a firm or firms who may be interested in an arrangement to help us get the project off the ground in return for less expensive fuel?

 

[webbie]

I'm not sure that is enough raw material to make an entire effort worth while.

Do you already use this material in every way you can in your process and heating your building, etc.?

I think the basics are this - folks using it for boilers will have to get the materials for LOT less than a residential customer. Biobricks and similar fuels sell for $230 a ton approx at retail, but an industrial user would have to really compare BTU to BTU.

There appears to be a decent market for the consumer product - for woodstoves. None of our boiler users, to my knowledge, uses fuels like this...mainly due to price.

The guy at biobrick also sells the machines, which sounds like what you would need.....and he definitely would have experience with the business model. Good luck with your endeavors.

http://biopellet.net/aboutus.html

 

[SJK1]

Thank you for the reply webmaster. Do some boiler owners use pellets or are they too expensive? Do you know if the compressed pucks compete with the pellets. I think most of this technology is European. The brick machine noted above is actually one of the options I am looking into.

 

[webbie]

A small market in pellet boilers opened up over the last couple of years, but really mostly in the last ONE year. I suspect it will close (meaning sales will drop greatly) this year because oil and gas are dirt cheap. As I said, in the end...when it comes to central heat and commercial you are competing BTU to BTU. I just read in the paper that Nat Gas is down to about $4 or less per million BTU. That is a really difficult price to compete with.

So the answer is really that the biobricks, etc. compete well only when it comes to space heater (wood stoves, pellet stove), because that is a consumer purchase and use and therefore the view of the fire and the convenience give it a higher value.

 

[DaveBP]

These folks import some German industrial wood boilers and have several models of "briquette press."

http://www.finkmachine.com/briquette_press.html

 

[SJK1]

These folks import some German industrial wood boilers and have several models of "briquette press."

http://www.finkmachine.com/briquette_press.html

Thanks but I think these are a little small for our needs. The big one only does about 400 lb. per hour. We will produce about 1 ton per hour.

 

[Duetech]

SJK1,
I use an EKO40 and have burned small chunks of wood in my boiler (3"-5"cubes). I cannot use pellets in my boiler but I have used charcoal briquets with great success. Processed pucks/bricks would work in the gasifier models like the EKO and Econoburn etc. The problem though has already been mentioned as being price. Many people get their fire wood by the cord (4'x4'x8') and a cord weighs in at a rough average of 1.5 tons. Obviously some weigh more some less. Cord prices vary greatly depending where you are at and by wood type. Wood collection, handling and processing is not for the feint of heart but generally speaking all these manipulations of the wood are to get it to a manageable and useful fuel source. Not all wood handlers are husky men and even the husky may one day appreciate a ready to go load for their wood heating appliance. Many buy "ready to go" cut, split and seasoned wood because of time constraints. If you can produce, and make available, an environmentally safe product that is ready to go and doesn't knife the consumer with a reflection of the fossil fuel industry you can probably make a go of it. Tonnage prices will have to resemble firewood as we know it or we will not have an interest with one primary exception being convenience of a back up wood source. So the question would seem to be "Do you want to sell a little bit at a high price in a competitive market or do you want to sell more to a broader market at a lower price?" Blocks/chunks/briquets/bricks and pucks will not work in pellet boilers.

 

[heaterman]

A small market in pellet boilers opened up over the last couple of years, but really mostly in the last ONE year. I suspect it will close (meaning sales will drop greatly) this year because oil and gas are dirt cheap. As I said, in the end...when it comes to central heat and commercial you are competing BTU to BTU. I just read in the paper that Nat Gas is down to about $4 or less per million BTU. That is a really difficult price to compete with.

So the answer is really that the biobricks, etc. compete well only when it comes to space heater (wood stoves, pellet stove), because that is a consumer purchase and use and therefore the view of the fire and the convenience give it a higher value.

What you say about the cost of fossil fuel is true in that it is less expensive right know. I've been wondering how that is going to effect sales of wood burning equipment and asking customers what their thinking is. To a person, nearly everyone is saying "never again". Nearly all of them realize that current price levels are a temporary situation caused by a worldwide economic downturn and when things even start getting back up to speed the fuel prices will climb steadily once more. I'm not seeing any breakdown in demand for wood burning products here because of fuel prices. On the other hand, I am running across customers who want a wood burner of some type but can't get financing or don't have the funds in hand due to the loss of a job. Unemployment here in Northern Michigan is far far above the government stated 8.5%. That figure is a joke.

My gut feeling on manufactured wood products is that we'll see an increase in demand over the years to come. Many people will want to use alternative energy but will want greater convenience and/or less effort than cordwood affords. I know the guys at Garn have been testing various configurations of bricks in their unit and they are very pleased with the results. There's a sawmill here locally that installed a pellet manufacturing line and they can't keep up with demand. They added another entire production line this past fall and were still short.
I'd advise the sawmill guy to do his home work on production costs, equipment costs, delivery costs and/or methods as well as what market is available locally and make his decision from there.

 

[webbie]

"never again"....


Sorry, I have heard that too many times over my 30 years in the biz.
Look in the pellet forum right now - LOTS of people who are stocking up on oil or, all of a sudden, who don't like their pellet stove.

Price - not patriotism or ethics/morality, was the #1 driver behind the (false) increase in sales after 2006 and in 2008.

Hey, everything is a temporary situation, but that doesn't mean temporary can't be a long time. As I mentioned, take a look at the price of NG (more homes use this than anything else). - Heck, AVERAGE that price over 20,30,40 years. That's a long temporary time.

In short, the solid fuel market will continue to be regional and local based on fuel costs and availability to pellets or wood at a good price.

 

[flyingcow]

The most effective way to get people to burn less dino fuel, is the alternative has to be cost effective. It has been about the $$$'s and always will be.

Wish you well SJK1, I'm assuming you've looked into using this as a source of biomass heat for yourself? Kiln dried hardwood sawdust is the good stuff, especially if you can keep it covered until use/sale. Some wheres I seen a midsized boiler that used sawdust. Also my cow farmers would jump thru hoops to get that stuff for bedding, but not much $$$'s for you.

 

[Jim K in PA]

I have to agree with Craig. Unless someone is already committed to convert to a non-petro based fuel for heating, it will continue to be harder to actually sell them when the price of oil/propane/NG is low.

SJK1 - look for a PM - I know of a possible solution for your output requirements.