Drolet 1800 temps and overnight burns.

[No Gas]

Good Day! I installed my Drolet 1800 insert, approx 23' insulated flexible liner, and key damper in the adapter last weekend (there's another thread with pics of the install). I did a couple small fires and it's basically been running ever since. Installed last Saturday with temps in the 50's- since then day time highs of around 30 and teens at night- perfect timing. Anyway I bought this stove with the intention of supplementing my furnace but now it seems to be an obsession to not let the furnace kick on. I'm new to stoves and need some help fine tuning/ running it efficiently. I seem to be tearing through my wood supply and I'm not sure I'm running this stove correctly.

At night time I do full e/w loads on hot coals. I leave the door cracked to get it going for about 15min. Then close door for about 15min then start cutting the air supply. Last night I hit 600 stove top temp with infrared gun and had an inferno going. After about 25min I was able to close the air supply fully with flames and secondary's still going. It was burning so good and hot that I had to throw 2-3 more pieces on before I went to bed- that was probably about 12am. Prior loads to that I know I've been shutting the door and attempting to damp it down way to early. Anyway I woke up at 5:30am to hot coals buried in ash with a stove temp of under 200. In the morning I only throw about 3 pieces on to get it going again because I don't have time to baby sit it for an hour and mess with a full load. Then through out the day I throw 2-3 pieces on at time. With that approach I can get stove top temps around 500-550 then they start dropping off. Should every load be a full load? I can't really do n/s loads at this time because the wood is too long.

I guess my main question is- is the ultimate goal to get the damper closed? Then at the same time how do I know if its damped down too much? Is no flames and and glowing logs acceptable? My glass is fairly clean except for the bottom corners. Then to throw another wrench in the mix is when do I mess with the key damper? I haven't even touched that yet- that's running wide open. Any info is appreciated.

 

[EbS-P]

Read through my thread here. There is a lot in it.

Dialing in the Drolet Escape (1500, 1800 and inserts)

The great value of these two stoves means lots have been sold. The intent of this tread is to help owners figure out the best/ most efficient way to run their stoves or inserts. I think the simple design is great but I am wondering if the easy breathing nature of this design results in an over...

www.hearth.com

My two cents. You need active secondary combustion to have a clean burn. For me that’s about 450-525-450. L C R location. I have no need to leave my door open. Built a top down fire open damper to 45 degrees, open air all the way, light and close the door.

Your air control should as closed as you can to keep a clean burn and get enough heat out f the stove.

I am guessing you are over drafting leaving the door open too long both will burn lots of wood with less heat into the house.

To dial in really well you need to measure flue temps.

So try this. See how fast you can turn down the air on a cold start or reload. Leave the damper open. If / when you get t full closed start closing the damper. Secondary combustion should not be full on blow torch but to don’t want them too lazy. I can get smoke to stay at the bottom of the stove just lazily swirling around on a cold start.

 

[No Gas]

Read through my thread here. There is a lot in it.

Dialing in the Drolet Escape (1500, 1800 and inserts)

The great value of these two stoves means lots have been sold. The intent of this tread is to help owners figure out the best/ most efficient way to run their stoves or inserts. I think the simple design is great but I am wondering if the easy breathing nature of this design results in an over...

www.hearth.com

My two cents. You need active secondary combustion to have a clean burn. For me that’s about 450-525-450. L C R location. I have no need to leave my door open. Built a top down fire open damper to 45 degrees, open air all the way, light and close the door.

Your air control should as closed as you can to keep a clean burn and get enough heat out f the stove.

I am guessing you are over drafting leaving the door open too long both will burn lots of wood with less heat into the house.

To dial in really well you need to measure flue temps.

So try this. See how fast you can turn down the air on a cold start or reload. Leave the damper open. If / when you get t full closed start closing the damper. Secondary combustion should not be full on blow torch but to don’t want them too lazy. I can get smoke to stay at the bottom of the stove just lazily swirling around on a cold start.

Good Info! I will read through that.

Yes leaving the door open makes sense that it is really over drafting- it was literally like blow torch flames. I did that because i read somewhere to leave door cracked open to get flames ripping and shut the door once stove top hits 400. By that time alot of my wood is burnt . Hope i didn't damage my liner.... On the cold cold nights I could hear the air whistling with air control shut. Even outside i could look at the chimney and see the wavy heat coming out. That's over drafting?

Right now I'm a couple hours into a hot reload of 3 pieces. I just fully closed the damper. Air all the way open. Stove reads 350/420/350. I can get the temp gun on the liner about 6" above adapter- reading like 320.

Tonight I'll do a full reload on hot coals. I should have but didn't write anything down on prior starts. I'll leave the damper all the way open, load it up, and shut the door. I'll bet it's an hour before I can start shutting down the air. Sometimes I can't even get to full closed. Is that because I didn't wait long enough for everything to heat up and catch fire? What should i be looking for when closing the damper?

 

[EbS-P]

23’ of liner and not being able to turn it down for an hour seems odd. Do you have moisture meter an have you checked moisture on a Room temp fresh split face? This what a cold start looks like got me. I pack it tight and use lots of kindling. It will cruise at 500 for several hours 4-5. With the air closed and and the damper mostly closed.

 

[No Gas]

Interesting. Yeah have a moisture meter. Reading 10-15% depending on the piece although I didn't re split to measure the inside. They are somewhat room temp- logs been sitting in the house for a few hours near the stove. I don't store a lot of wood in the house because I don't want bugs and what not crawling out if there is any. 99% of my fires are hot restarts. I just pack it full and let the fire start from the bottom with the hot coals. Seems to take forever...

right now it's almost down to coals. i'll retry a full load when i get back from lunch break .

 

[EbS-P]

Interesting. Yeah have a moisture meter. Reading 10-15% depending on the piece although I didn't re split to measure the inside. They are somewhat room temp- logs been sitting in the house for a few hours near the stove. I don't store a lot of wood in the house because I don't want bugs and what not crawling out if there is any. 99% of my fires are hot restarts. I just pack it full and let the fire start from the bottom with the hot coals. Seems to take forever...

You really have to measure a fresh split. I’m guess your wood is over 20%. If it’s truly in the teens it will take right off.

I always add 2-3 pieces of kindling on the bottom and another up to. I don’t want to wait. I have lots of neighbors so the faster I get to a clean burn the better.

 

[No Gas]

You really have to measure a fresh split. I’m guess your wood is over 20%. If it’s truly in the teens it will take right off.

I always add 2-3 pieces of kindling on the bottom and another up to. I don’t want to wait. I have lots of neighbors so the faster I get to a clean burn the better.

Ok- i'll split some and remeasure. The wood the other night could very well have been 20+%. I grabbed some I had and mixed it in with the wood i just bought and put it in the stove. Luckily that wood is now all used up. Not in the teens now but will be this weekend overnight. Like 29 degrees now.

 

[Gearhead660]

Do you have a block off plate installed? Assuming you have the blower running?

 

[No Gas]

Do you have a block off plate installed? Assuming you have the blower running?

Yes. block off plate with insulation above it and blower running. Blower is kicking on and off right now as the coals are cooling down. i'm going to reload it in a little bit.

 

[No Gas]

You really have to measure a fresh split. I’m guess your wood is over 20%. If it’s truly in the teens it will take right off.

I always add 2-3 pieces of kindling on the bottom and another up to. I don’t want to wait. I have lots of neighbors so the faster I get to a clean burn the better.

Hot reload with wood from the 1/2 cord i bought last weekend.

4:07pm- Kindling on bottom and 3 decent sized pieces loaded e/w. Air and damper wide open
4:10pm- Wood caught fire. Air and damper wide open
4:20pm- Air is 1/4 shut.
4:27pm- 1/2 shut air. SST 485 dancing flames.
4:30pm- flames out SST485- Air back to wide open
4:39pm - Air back to 1/2 shut. SST 530
4:43pm- 3/4 shut
4:46pm- Full shut. SST 500
4:53pm- Full shut. SST 442- small flames left side and middle
5:01pm- minimal flames. SST 379 smoke out the chimney.
5:11pm- Air back to 1/2 shut. SST 410.
5:26PM- Air at 1/2 shut. SST 426.

I didn't even mess with the damper because i couldn't even get it running with the air shut down. Will closing the damper make the stove hotter? Temp outside is 28 house is fine at 69. I grabbed more wood from outside so that's warming up for tonight. Need to go back and get my axe to try and split some in half in the house to measure moisture. (wife is going to love this). Next reload tonight i'm going to pack it completely full and retest. I know this isn't rocket science but i tend to over complicate things trying to make them perfect.

Is the purpose of the air control to try and control the temp and maximize burn times? The damper just slows the amount of heat going up the chimney? How do i know if its dampered down to much? Sorry but i'm new to woodstoves.


***Edit***. So this is weird. I closed damper to like 3/4-7/8 shut. Air is fully shut. SST 420. The secondary's are burning just above the logs.

 

[Caw]

I have an Osburn 1600 insert which is a very similar stove to yours. Just a few observations:

- You don't need to leave the door open so long. Just looking enough for the fire to get doing and stay lit and progressing. I rarely have mine open for more than a minute or two.

- You shouldn't really ever need to shut the air down 100%. Why do you keep trying to do this? Just shut it down to the point where it's burning nicely and leave it there. Aggressively turning it down is good, you can always open it back up, but most stoves don't want the air fully shut down (fully meaning the control all the way in. EPA stoves can't truly be fully shut down).

- What are you targeting for STT? You were at 530 3/4 shut and shut it down even further. That stove you have is very easy breathing and wants to run hot. You're not going to get good clean full burns at 500 STT. It wants to be closer to 600-700. You have to get the box and tubes up to temperature to function properly.

- When you over shut everything down the stove pulls air from the tubes and you'll get nothing but secondaries for a brief moment before it chokes out.

I know you're new and that's great, welcome, we've all been there. You're in the right spot to learn. I think you're simply not being aggressive enough with your stove. It's a beast, let it do it's thing. I'm also suspicious of your wood. It should be really easy to get the stove up to temp and you are having trouble. Split a room temp split and measure the fresh face. If your wood is all 20% or higher grab some bio bricks or scrap non pt 2x4 lumber to augment it.

I'm cruising along at 700 STT right now about to go to bed. Took about 15 minutes to get here from 250 STT reload on good coals with good wood.

Report back tomorrow with your findings! Good night!

 

[No Gas]

- You don't need to leave the door open so long. Just looking enough for the fire to get doing and stay lit and progressing. I rarely have mine open for more than a minute or two.

Yes that I stopped doing- it was like a jet engine and the wood i was using was suspect. Since I'm doing hot reloads I throw some kindling on the bottom, load it up, and close the door.

You shouldn't really ever need to shut the air down 100%. Why do you keep trying to do this? Just shut it down to the point where it's burning nicely and leave it there. Aggressively turning it down is good, you can always open it back up, but most stoves don't want the air fully shut down (fully meaning the control all the way in. EPA stoves can't truly be fully shut down).

I don't know why I try to shut down to 100%. I thought that's what everyone tries to do for a long overnight burn? I gave up and left it 3/4 shut last night.

- What are you targeting for STT? You were at 530 3/4 shut and shut it down even further. That stove you have is very easy breathing and wants to run hot. You're not going to get good clean full burns at 500 STT. It wants to be closer to 600-700. You have to get the box and tubes up to temperature to function properly.

I don't know what I'm targeting because I don't know what is too hot. I've had up to 620 before with my infrared temp gun. Tonight i'll shoot for high 600's.

- When you over shut everything down the stove pulls air from the tubes and you'll get nothing but secondaries for a brief moment before it chokes out.

Yes- that i've noticed and then the heat output begins to dwindle- been adding more air then.

I know you're new and that's great, welcome, we've all been there. You're in the right spot to learn. I think you're simply not being aggressive enough with your stove. It's a beast, let it do it's thing. I'm also suspicious of your wood. It should be really easy to get the stove up to temp and you are having trouble. Split a room temp split and measure the fresh face. If your wood is all 20% or higher grab some bio bricks or scrap non pt 2x4 lumber to augment it.

You're right I'm cautious with getting it too hot and running away- don't want to hurt the stove or liner because I really didn't know what safe temps were. I've read a lot on this site then over analyze everything, I don't think I will have trouble getting it up to temp. I just start turning it down way too early because I didn't know. I did have trouble when I was using junk wood that i thought was seasoned- that's all gone now though. I just split some of my wood-19%. Bought wood was 15% and less.

I'm cruising along at 700 STT right now about to go to bed. Took about 15 minutes to get here from 250 STT reload on good coals with good wood.

Since you have an insert where do you measure and what do you measure your temps with? Are you running a key damper? I don't know but i'm pretty sure mine was over drafting. It was 17 last night. I have key damper at like 3/4 closed once it gets hot.

 

[Caw]

Since you have an insert where do you measure and what do you measure your temps with? Are you running a key damper? I don't know but i'm pretty sure mine was over drafting. It was 17 last night. I have key damper at like 3/4 closed once it gets hot.

No key damper. 24' external chimney with an uninsulated liner. It's 15 degrees out right now and I'm cruising along at 700 STT with good secondaries and a nice burn. Air is 90% closed. Blower on low. It took 20 minutes on a 300 STT reload to get this steady state. I'd say this is a perfect burn setup for my stove. If I did this at 11 pm with a full load I'd have coals at 7 am to reload no problem and it's only a 1.85 cu ft stove.

First pic is usually the hottest part of the stove and where I like to measure. I'm shooting just under the convective jacket with an IR gun. You'll notice if I go a even few inches in either direction it'll be 30-50 degrees cooler. I like using an IR gun because it gives me real time readings and I can check multiple places. Magnetic thermometers are fine but can have some lag and only work in one spot. To be honest I really don't check STT much anymore I just go by visuals and sound but when I was newer at this I checked constantly.

Feel free to ask any questions you'd like!

 

[No Gas]

No key damper. 24' external chimney with an uninsulated liner. It's 15 degrees out right now and I'm cruising along at 700 STT with good secondaries and a nice burn. Air is 90% closed. Blower on low. It took 20 minutes on a 300 STT reload to get this steady state. I'd say this is a perfect burn setup for my stove. If I did this at 11 pm with a full load I'd have coals at 7 am to reload no problem and it's only a 1.85 cu ft stove.

First pic is usually the hottest part of the stove and where I like to measure. I'm shooting just under the convective jacket with an IR gun. You'll notice if I go a even few inches in either direction it'll be 30-50 degrees cooler. I like using an IR gun because it gives me real time readings and I can check multiple places. Magnetic thermometers are fine but can have some lag and only work in one spot. To be honest I really don't check STT much anymore I just go by visuals and sound but when I was newer at this I checked constantly.

Feel free to ask any questions you'd like!

Ok did a full hot reload at like 11pm on thick glowing coals. It lit fast, I ran it up to almost 700 then started turning the air down to control the temp. I think I have that part figured out. In prior reloads I know I was not getting it up hot enough, questionable wood, and then trying to turn it down way too early. In the 2 vids below you can see the flames are quick and jumpy in the first vid. The second i closed the damper and it slowed the flames way down. Is that what over drafting looks like? It's about 22 degrees out, 23-24' insulated liner. In the 3rd pic you can see my nice stainless liner and adapter are now a golden color. I don't know if that's from running it to hot or when closing the damper it concentrates heat in that area due to my damper opening that way. The stainless L brackets that hold the adapter are now blue too. It's like they colored like Harley pipes that was running too lean. So that leads me to ask am i always over drafting with the flames quick and jumpy like that? Is it possible to have to run the air control at 1/2-3/4 closed and the flue damper 3/4-7/8 shut? If i turn the air all the way down-only the secondary's fire and then they go out and the wood just glows. I just don't want to damage anything- liners aren't exactly cheap. I can only measure temps on the liner with my temp gun up to my block off plate- that's about 6" above the stove adapter. Lastly i got out my file and made the notches in air control lever so i know where its at now- brilliant idea i came across on this site.

Air 3/4 shut. Damper open 595sst flue 400. blower on high.

Air 3/4 shut. Damper shut. Sst 630 flue 409. blower on high.

This was from the prior reload around 5pm give or take and hour. Box fan at the bottom of the stairs blowing towards the stove. I have a nice convection loop going with hot air blowing up the top of the stairs.

 

[Caw]

I ran it up to almost 700 then started turning the air down to control the temp.

This isn't what I meant by getting the stove hot enough. You definitely don't want to wait until 600-700+ THEN turn down the air. That is definitely going to be an over fire situation most times and probably why your liner looks like that. You were blasting extremely hot air up the liner for a while. My liner has a golden hue also from a time I reloaded and forgot about it my 2nd year and it got to like 900+ for 20 minutes. The liner should still be fine but it will look like that now. Chimney sweep can confirm when you get it cleaned just to be sure.

The idea is to TARGET a nice 600-700 STT. I'll elaborate more on my process shortly when I get a few minutes!

 

[Caw]

So when I say I'm cruising along at 700 STT it took me a little while to get there. The idea is to turn down the fire as soon as it'll support being turned down without going out while still allowing the temps rise to and at a steady state of fire around 600-750 STT (in my stoves case). I don't want to let it get nuclear then try to rein it in. That'll get way too hot and often run away.

7:45 am - I'll go through my am reload with you. STT 140 reloading on coal. I'll have the door shut within 1-2 minutes:

7:48 Door shut, good flames:

7:55 - first air turn down to about 50%. Flames going nicely STT about 300. 2nd pic after the chit down

7:59 - turned down to 3/4, secondaries starting, 450 STT. Blower on.

8:04 - was too aggressive and it died down. Opened the air a tad to let it keep progressing. Now it's back on track.

8:07 - fire going strong, 620 STT, air shut down to 90% closed. This is likely where it will live. Maybe one more small adjustment before I leave

8:13 - tiny adjustment and its cruising along at 650 STT with nice secondaries. I'm heading to work, this will run for hours and the wife will reload probably around 12-1. I didn't jam it full this load. Knowing her she'll just 2-3 log it at a time until I'm home.

8:20 - one final check. STT stable at 700, good secondaries, air is 90% closed. My wife is home today but even if she wasn't I'd leave it like this and go to work.

So that was a full reload cycle from a 150 degree STT on coals with 4 year old dry wood. Took about 30 min to get perfect. It would have been faster with a full load but I only did 3/4 the firebox this morning. It'll take longer with lesser wood and not get as hot. This is the time where I'd consider using the damper if I wanted more control, once I've exhausted the function of the primary air.

Next time you reload your stove give this method a try. Quick shut downs that still allow the flames to progress. Then once you get to steady state around 90-100% air closed then start to work the damper if you need more control. You should be able to get a nice fire cruising at 600-750 STT.

 

[No Gas]

This isn't what I meant by getting the stove hot enough. You definitely don't want to wait until 600-700+ THEN turn down the air.

I had a feeling I wasn't doing it correctly- thinking man this is hot... I've seen pics online of liners glowing. Thankfully mine was not glowing and hope it's ok.

So when I say I'm cruising along at 700 STT it took me a little while to get there. The idea is to turn down the fire as soon as it'll support being turned down without going out while still allowing the temps rise to and at a steady state of fire around 600-750 STT (in my stoves case). I don't want to let it get nuclear then try to rein it in. That'll get way too hot and often run away.

Sorry I still have a million questions but this makes much more sense now and I thank you a ton for your reload process.

Rather than create an inferno, I just need to get it going then start turning down the air while fire and temps slowly rise to desired sst.

I woke up at 530am to ash and some buried semi hot coals-sst was like 195. I cleaned out the excessive ash and left the coals, finally got around to reloading the stove 3/4 full around 730am ( this time i had enough smaller pieces to load n/s) but could have fit a few more if i more smaller ones. N/S seemed to ignite easier but maybe because there was more space between the logs. I still had to throw some kindling in and use some propane torch persuasion to get it going though. Once it got going, I was all over the place messing with the air and the damper- probably not giving it enough time to compensate and see the changes. It was 10 degrees this morning, blow torch like flames all over the place and I could hear it sucking air. I stopped messing with everything and let it be until i could turn the air down in increments. I turned the damper down when i got the air like 3/4 shut. Flames slowed down to a roll but i don't know if that's right.

I let this mornings reload run down to about 300-350 degrees and threw 3 more pieces on. It eventually started but I had to give it full air and then back it down. Those pieces lasted an hour or 2 and were down to charcoal with air 3/4 shut. It's 36 out right now so I don't need a lot of heat. Just threw 3 more on ...

When your wife adds wood through out the day does she mess with the air control or just throw a couple logs in when it's ready and leave it be?

Most likely user error and I have nothing to compare to but I seem to be ripping through a good amount of wood. Granted it's been cold and the stove has been running damn near 24/7. I'm just curious if overdraft is what burning up my wood so fast. I will try your method tonight. Full reload before bed. I wont touch the damper until or unless i'm out of air adjustment. Again sorry for the newbie questions but i'm determined to get this fine tuned.