Epa to smoke dragon conversion

[Dunmyermowingllc]

Long story short. Our main heat is a vogelzang 3200. We used it from December through spring last winter. Constantly fought overfires almost melted the top. This stove is horribly designed to an unsafe level to meet emissions. This year I am gonna take matters into my own hands. I have found all the hidden unregulated air inlets on this stove and blocked them off. I have removed secondary tubes and the insulation baffle above. So now shes just an old school smoke dragon with a glass door. Did a little test run last night looks to be promising. Has stt of 520 and ext. Flue pipe temp of 270. This was with both air intakes open. As temps drop I expect similar with intakes closed. Let the bashing of my idea begin.

 

[begreen]

Sounds like the symptoms were treated without understanding the causes of the problem.

 

[Todd]

I would at least stick the baffle back in to get a little more efficiency and cleaner burn.

 

[brenndatomu]

Yup, put the tubes and baffle back in...all you need to do is restrict the secondary and maybe the primary air to accomplish your goal...well, make sure the chimney draft isn't too high first...but if its ok then just start experimenting with how much things need to be restricted off to make it burnt controllably.
Who was it that had a stove here last winter that had to do this...they did lots of different tests and had lots of pics...seems to me it was a Pleasant Hearth stove maybe?

 

[begreen]

A common problem with folks burning in a modern stove for the first time is not shutting down the air soon enough. There can be a sudden outgassing (bloom) of wood gases if the air is not controlled well. This can be substantial if the splits are small and can lead to an overfire. Closing off the boost air ports in some cases does help but removing the secondary burn is like tossing out the baby with the bathwater.

 

[Dunmyermowingllc]

Sounds like the symptoms were treated without understanding the causes of the problem.

Begreen, I had a different name on here last winter (I forgot it). You and many others on here helped me diagnose the problem. Which ended up being that this stove has 8 different unregulated air openings. 6 maybe .5" holes on the sides hidden underneath the jacket. And 2 massive 2"+ ports on the bottom. All this air goes straight to the secondary tubes, and causes absolute infernoes. Us stove designed this to meet emissions, it is quite unsafe to load firebox full on this stove in factory form. So I'm trying something different this year

 

[Dunmyermowingllc]

@Todd @brenndatomu this is still in the experimental phase. The way I have it now 0 air gets to secondary tubes. I very well might stick them back in, with the baffles to slow down the smoke. I do have 3 dampers in my pipe ( that's how outa controll this vg3200 gets in factory form). I'm also toying with the idea of a thick steel baffle on top of tubes instead of the roxwool??? One from factory

 

[kborndale]

I would put the tubes and baffle back and try it with just the air inlets blocked. Definitely put back the baffle, it's not making your stove go out of control, if anything the stove is more likely to go out of control without it.

 

[bigealta]

I'd be on craigslist and the like to find a better stove. Seems like you've been bashing your head against the wall to make a crap stove work. Not worth the ongoing hassle.

 

[brenndatomu]

@Todd @brenndatomu this is still in the experimental phase. The way I have it now 0 air gets to secondary tubes. I very well might stick them back in, with the baffles to slow down the smoke. I do have 3 dampers in my pipe ( that's how outa controll this vg3200 gets in factory form). I'm also toying with the idea of a thick steel baffle on top of tubes instead of the roxwool??? One from factory

Even smoke dragons had baffles (the better ones anyways)
There is no advantage to having a steel baffle IMO...other than durability, if you are one of those people that just chucks wood into the stove, instead of stacking.

 

[bholler]

The steel will end up warping anyway just use the stock parts with the air blocked off to a point it's easily controlable

 

[begreen]

Found the thread under Vg3200p but now I am confused. After restricting the primary, the report was that the stove was burning much better with secondary burn going for up to 3 hrs. By the end of the thread, the report was that the stove was running "just the way I wanted." The way it is now it would be better to take it outside and use it as a smoker. (Put a file cabinet on top and route the flue through it.)

Performed surgery on my new stove.

Is running 3 dampers to slow down draft/heavy breathing stove safe?

www.hearth.com

 

[Dunmyermowingllc]

Towards the end of last season I did have it running good, but the holes on the side of the stove underneath the jacket started to smoke a lot. With a new baby in the house I don't want smoke pouring into the house like it was at the end of last season

 

[begreen]

Yes, I was concerned about using silicone in those hot areas. It is only rated at 400-500º. A metal patch would be better.

 

[Dunmyermowingllc]

It's not the silicon. It's the location of the holes drilled into the sides, before the secondary would take off it would puke smoke out until it got up to temp

 

[begreen]

It's not the silicon. It's the location of the holes drilled into the sides, before the secondary would take off it would puke smoke out until it got up to temp

Just a guess. This might be the three dampers restricting draft enough even when open. Once the chimney warms up, the draft is stronger.

 

[Dunmyermowingllc]

That could be. I have high hopes to re engineer this stove to a usable setup, can't really afford a better one this year

 

[begreen]

Sorry you are going through the wringer with this stove. It shouldn't be such a challenge.

On another note, congratulations on the new family addition. Got a picture dad?

 

[Prof]

Begreen, I had a different name on here last winter (I forgot it). You and many others on here helped me diagnose the problem. Which ended up being that this stove has 8 different unregulated air openings. 6 maybe .5" holes on the sides hidden underneath the jacket. And 2 massive 2"+ ports on the bottom. All this air goes straight to the secondary tubes, and causes absolute infernoes. Us stove designed this to meet emissions, it is quite unsafe to load firebox full on this stove in factory form. So I'm trying something different this year

We may need to drop the mic.

 

[Dunmyermowingllc]

Sorry you are going through the wringer with this stove. It shouldn't be such a challenge.

On another note, congratulations on the new family addition. Got a picture dad?

Well, it's taught me next time to save up and buy a real stove not Chinese garbage. I'm very blessed by my children

 

[Dunmyermowingllc]

yall are gonna laugh, but I own a mowing company and work for another landscaper as well so dead beat up mower blades are easy to come by. The 20.5" blades (for 60" mower you use 3) fit perfectly. Gonna put some more in there and try as a baffle.

 

[brenndatomu]

View attachment 315401yall are gonna laugh, but I own a mowing company and work for another landscaper as well so dead beat up mower blades are easy to come by. The 20.5" blades (for 60" mower you use 3) fit perfectly. Gonna put some more in there and try as a baffle.

That might be the most Red Green thing I've ever seen on Hearth.com!
Thanks for the Friday morning chuckle!

 

[EbS-P]

View attachment 315401yall are gonna laugh, but I own a mowing company and work for another landscaper as well so dead beat up mower blades are easy to come by. The 20.5" blades (for 60" mower you use 3) fit perfectly. Gonna put some more in there and try as a baffle.

Do your best to get by. Keep it safe. Save up for a Drolet. IMO it’s be best value out there. Tax credit eligible too. Congratulations on the new addition.

 

[begreen]

yall are gonna laugh, but I own a mowing company and work for another landscaper as well so dead beat up mower blades are easy to come by. The 20.5" blades (for 60" mower you use 3) fit perfectly. Gonna put some more in there and try as a baffle.

View attachment 315401

Nice looking family there.

I think those blades are going to sag without being bolted to a stiffener.

 

[EbS-P]

Nice looking family there.

I think those blades are going to sag without being bolted to a stiffener.

It’s the cooling effect of the secondary air that keeps the tubes from sagging and the SS alloy.