Fire Danger - The Dark side of the modern synthetic world

[jharkin]

This came up on my old house owners web board. Those of us living in those "creaky old drafty houses" - especially ones furnished with antiques and all traditional fabrics/materials - are a lot more likely to survive a house fire.

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

http://newscience.ul.com/articles/modern-residential-fires


Turns out that everything touted as 'good' in modern construction - open floor plans, engineered lumber, double pane windows, vinyl siding, windows, doors, plastics, no maintenance materials are all combining to cause house fires to spread nearly 8x faster than traditional materials and methods. Sometimes spreading faster than the fire department can get to you.

 

[begreen]

Plastics! That's the future my son.

 

[Swedishchef]

Wow. Impressive!

I guess trying to make better profit margins has it's consequences after all eh? And this is one consequence I would not think of....

Nice vid

Andrew

 

[DougA]

Modern = more flammable + more disposable + more profitable

 

[begreen]

Modern = more flammable + more disposable + more profitable

Not always, sometimes modern means more efficient and better designed. Modern stoves being an example, cell phones another. I really like my modern car. It's much more efficient, way lower maintenance, much cleaner emissions, safer, more economical too as well as more fun to drive.

 

[Swedishchef]

I got to agree with Doug on this one BG. I think it's more a rule of thumb. For example, ovens now have motherboards. My friend's oven's MOBO when on the blink. $450 to replace it. My dishwasher pump seal started leaking:`it's a whole unit (can't replace parts) and it's $343 + install fee. New front loading washers/dryers: disposable. Ya get the drift. Who fixes TVs anymore?

A

 

[bholler]

Who fixes TVs anymore?

2 different repair shops by us fix them all the time. If you shop for it there are still plenty of products made that are serviceable. New homes i am sure are worse in some ways in a fire but old homes are worse in others and many times have more potential fire risk due to lack of codes when they were built. I am not saying new is better in all cases but it is in some for sure. And old is better in others

 

[Swedishchef]

You're lucky where you live..I had to travel 450 KMs to bring my $300 samsung TV to get it fixed: it wasn't working out of the box. lol.

I understand where you're coming from. But , from my what I observe and take note of, we toss alot more stuff today than we did back in the day. INcluding husbands and wives

Andrew

 

[begreen]

I hear ya, but the original post is that modern = more dangerous. I don't think that is always the case. Cars and stoves are examples. No doubt that there's a disposable mindset, but that doesn't mean the product was designed to be disposable. FWIW, a while back we had a new TV fail on warranty. Took it into a repair place and they had it fixed a few days later. Yeah, the repair shop was about 20 miles away, but I was happy with the fix.

 

[jharkin]

Not always, sometimes modern means more efficient and better designed. Modern stoves being an example, cell phones another. I really like my modern car. It's much more efficient, way lower maintenance, much cleaner emissions, safer, more economical too as well as more fun to drive.
View attachment 163551

Cell phones are certainly disposable... The new trend of non-user replaceable batteries guarantees obsolescence every 12-18 months.

The amount of toxic wast all those thrown out electronics generates prompted environmental rules like RoHS to remove all te toxic stuff, which in turn reduces livespans even more. Its a vicious circle.

Im not being a luddite and not eschewing all things modern. I would not want to commute in the first car I learned on 25 years ago... But I watch the video above and get a smile when I look at these old timer framed walls, the wool rug on the floor and the real cotton upholstery on grandmas hand me down couch and its nice to thin they are less likely to kill us that the modern synthetic garbage at Ikea.And that the real glass "glass" Im drinking out of is less likely to give me cancer than the BPA laden plastics that where all the rage up until a few years ago.

 

[begreen]

No doubt with electronics the industry is guilty of creating a real mess. Still my cellphone is 2.5 yrs old. Is it going to self destruct? Battery life is still ok.

We live in an old house and have avoided using plastics and vinyl for siding and windows, but I have used MDF for some trim. Does MDF burn faster than real wood?

 

[BrotherBart]

Guess we don't talk about my 2005 cell phone... Took the box out last year and replaced the black fascia with the silver one and told my wife we got a new phone.

 

[firefighterjake]

One word: plastics.

 

[firefighterjake]

As mentioned it is not always a matter of older being better . . . even in a home. Add in a modern residential PVC sprinkler system for example and you would see a whole new video.

 

[jharkin]

But how many homes have a residential sprinkler system? Seems like a band aid solution to me, and one that wont help the millions of existing houses out there full of plastic without such systems.



I guess we will have to all agree to disagree on this. I just dont buy the modern is always better viewpoint. Call me a luddite

 

[velvetfoot]

There was a firebug in my old neighborhood years ago. Lit up my car in the driveway and the neighbor's truck. It's amazing how well the car interior burned. The exterior paint was mostly gone, as I recall, and quite oxidized from the heat. For some reason, the burning car rolled forward and stopped against the garage door. Luckily, the garage door was steel, as opposed to the fiberglass doors then in vogue, or even perhaps an old fashioned wood door.

 

[Jags]

real cotton upholstery on grandmas hand me down couch

Ever see a newer style couch burn? The amount of smoke it creates is crazy. That happening inside of a home is a disaster. Its been a long time ago, but I have been inside of homes (practice fires) when visibility was virtually zero even though a raging fire was 20 feet away.

 

[bholler]

But how many homes have a residential sprinkler system?

It was code in pa for about 6 months till contractors who couldn't understand the systems threw a fit and lobbied to have the code removed. I think it was a great idea but oh well. I dont think old or new is better each has their strong points

 

[begreen]

Yes, that was my point. There are good and bad things about old and new. I for one think that indoor plumbing and toilet paper are marvelous improvements, even if TP is flammable.

 

[jharkin]

Yes, and like I said I dont think all modern things are bad (somebody up thread thought that was my point - it is not). I think this specific example shows that sometimes we take the cheap/disposable/no maintenance thing to far.

Modern efficiency standards are good. Modern woodstoves are good. Very reliable modern cars are good. HD television and high speed internet is good. The plastic gas tank in my truck that will never rust and leak is good.

BUt there are things I dont like - synthetic materials for furnishings and clothes. Vinyl siding/windows. Water based paint with only a fraction of the durability of hte old oil formulas making me paint the house every 5 years instead of every 30. Engineered lumber and particle board sheathing that wont last a fraction of the lifespan of traditional materials. lawnmower engines with so much plastic in them (I mean they even make plastic timing gears in the engines now for #$(&*#$*( ) they fall apart in 5 years. "High end" appliances that fall apart in just a couple years because all the computers burn out. People destroying antique furniture with chalk paint (grrrrr). and so on.

 

[velvetfoot]

making me paint the house every 5 years instead of every 30

That's a good reason for vinyl siding, which I like.
A slogan related to polypro undergarments is "cotton kills".

 

[Isaac Carlson]

vinyl siding is a horrible industry and a terrible product. I used to install it. It may look "nice" if you like a house that looks like tupperware, but what happens when it burns or gets removed, then what? nobody recycles it because it gets brittle and faded. We just filled a dumpster with it last year and we hated to do it, but what else do you do? I like a wod house with wood shingles and no drywall, no plastic. My great grandfather build the farm house from local trees and it is still as solid as the year he built it. Lets see modern houses last 200 years. I prefer vehicles from the 80's and 90's, because they had some of the newer technology, but were still simple, easy, and inexpensive to repair when they did eventually need it. I like my 1991 f250 over the newer trucks.

 

[begreen]

Yes, I don't like plastic and synthetic food either. The closer it is to our local garden the better.

making me paint the house every 5 years instead of every 30

That's a good reason for vinyl siding, which I like.
A slogan related to polypro undergarments is "cotton kills".

Some paints are good. Our house was painted 10 years ago with Benjamin Moore paint and it is standing up well so far.

 

[bholler]

My great grandfather build the farm house from local trees and it is still as solid as the year he built it. Lets see modern houses last 200 years.

There will be plenty of houses built now that will last 200 years if they are maintained properly and there were many houses built 200 years ago that failed for many reasons. I live in a 100 yr old wood sided house and i love it but it takes allot more work that a modern house. And if you are painting every 5 years you need to do better prep or buy better paint i am going on 9 years on my last paint job and it is just starting to need some touch up in spots.

 

[bholler]

And as far as fire danger goes my house is balloon framed like many in this area. And if a balloon framed house catches fire look out they go up really quick