I have noticed a slight smoke smell around the front top area of my Fireview since it was new ,,, when burning in the low (.5 -.75) draft opening and cat burning.... Gaskets are all good... Well I called Mike at Woodstock and was amazed when he told me what it was according to my chimney set up... I helped a local chimney guy install my insulated liner down my 22 foot masonry chimney... We then cut open the block about a foot below the tee and installed a clean out door..We also made a shelf right inside the clean out door so all the ash stayed right there... Well, my chimney guy said he leaves the cap off the bottom of the tee so as to allow ash to drop down to the clean out door... big mistake! Even though I had the clean out door closed Woodstock told me that numerous people have done the same thing,, causing cold air to be reversed into the stove on a low setting with the tee uncapped... Well I got the tee closed up on the bottom and what a difference! No more smoke smell and I even get the occasional wispy flames on a .5 draft setting.. Stove now burns 100% better at a very low setting apparently drafting properly... Thanks to Mike a Woodstock for the remedy!
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Very interesting. I wonder if this explains some of the smoke smell folks report with the Progress as well?
Makes sense to me now with the open tee... even though it was behind a clean out door inside the masonry chimney... I believe when I shut the stove draft down the open tee would then take over and cool my chimney flue gases down , just enough to impede the draft on the stove itself... Looked up the stack with an inspection mirror and the pipe looks good,, no real build up.. Woodstock knew what the cause was soon as I mentioned the uncovered clean out cap on the tee. Mike said they never knew about it until enough people had the same problem... A lucky find indeed... Glad I called.
Your chimney is going to suck in air wherever it can. If there's no cap on the bottom of the tee...
I'm assuming this chimney guy isn't exactly 'certified.'
I'm assuming this chimney guy isn't exactly 'certified.'
Chimney guy was recommended by two different places locally,,, one a very large stove shop and another is a wholesaler of chimney products... Certified,, doesn't say so on his card,, but he was up on all the codes... He's been doing it for quite a long time... Maybe he forgot to bring the cap ,,, who knows,, at least I have it right now...Your chimney is going to suck in air wherever it can. If there's no cap on the bottom of the tee...
I'm assuming this chimney guy isn't exactly 'certified.'
Good for woodstock. If you posted on this site that you had left the bottom cap off I'd like to think that a handful of people would immediately have called that improper as well. It might not be an obvious reason for your smoke smell but I think we all know that without that cap your draft will be ruined.
I agree with you 100%... Sad thing is I ran like that for 4 years , now I'm thinking my QuadraFire 5700 that I had for 3 years prior to the Fireview got short changed on how it could have performed... Oh well,,shame on my Chimney guy! He must of thought in his mind that because the tee was inside the masonry chimney behind a clean out door which was closed that it wouldn't be an issue,,,, wrong
fox9988
Minister of Fire
Ashful
Minister of Fire
On the plus side, I think I just figured out why I keep losing in regattas.
Nah... I'm just a sh*tty sailor.
3 years with the Quad and then almost this full season with the Fireview,,almost 4 years.. Yup, kind of pissed me off knowing what I know now... I took the chimney guys word for it that it would not be an issue because it was inside behind the clean out door.. Woodstock said I wasn't the only one that had a masonry liner installed without the Tee cap. Enough were done this way that they started to see an issue with other people have the same issue I had... Mike knew right away at Woodstock what the problem was... My other tee for my Esse on the outside wall certainly has a Tee Cap. I should have known better and just installed one anyways..
Hey, Charley,
The upside is you'll have a whole other exciting year burning with the Fireview for the first time! It'll be just like having a new stove.
Enjoy!
The upside is you'll have a whole other exciting year burning with the Fireview for the first time! It'll be just like having a new stove.
Enjoy!
I always questioned your lack of results from the Quad (its a pretty good sized stove). Makes sense now.
Yes the stove runs even better know..for example leaving the draft setting at 1 in the cat mode,,, it burns like it's set at 1.5 ,,,so now I run the draft setting at .5-.75,, and get a lot longer even heat...I think with the tee uncapped I was drafting the stove heat out into the pipe because of running it at 1 to avoid the smoke smell.. No more,, she's a different stove for sure...
Yes Jags, I believe I lost a lot of heat out of the Quad because I couldn't turn it down and get a long slow burn because of the open tee.. Well as soon as I get a garage here insulated, the Quad will get a second life.. I have a new baffle board , insulation that goes on top and new air control gaskets as well,, so she'll get a fresh start again... Be nice having the blower fan on that stove to throw out some quick heat in the garage...
Bub381
Minister of Fire
I can't set below 1 without back puffs.The air circulates so that i smell the smoke in the livingroom everytime it does it.Saw it happen 1 day.I had set it below 1 when we 1st got it so that there was no flame during the night.We leave a small flame going now at 1.0 or 1.5.Now at 1 i do get alot of black coals in the morning but i just open her a little and burn em off.
Interesting,,, Have you ever figured out why you can't set your draft lower, eliminating the back puffing? Maybe your chimney set up?
Draft issue? Don't recall what Bub's chimney setup is (can see the stove pipe in his avatar pic.)
Right now, I've got my air set at .2 and I can still see the coals glowing. It would run with the air completely cut. 17' insulated liner in an exterior masonry chimney. It's in the upper twenties now, but I can also run the stove like this when it's warmer out.
Sounds like I have the same chimney set up as you Woody, but 22 ft.. 25 degrees here and I'm set at .5.. never tried to go lower then that.. I can see that cat glowing,,, flue gas, internal pipe temp is @325.. Guess as long as the cat's glowing the flue should stay clean at that temp... STT is @ 400.. She's loaded up full of wood for the night,, good size coal bed as well...
Rideau, I read that 325 was a minimum flue gas temp you want to run , so I was a little leery about running the flue gas that low. I normally like 400 as a minimum,, but the cats glowing so I assume I'm not loading up the stove pipe or chimney.. Actually the flue gas has climbed to almost 400 so it's taking care of itself @ .5 on the draft.. I love that I can run my stove that low now since adding the Tee Cap ..
Indeed. Many a poor draft situation has been cured by checking the cleanout door and finding it open or badly sealed.
I don't have the same kind of setup but I'm finding this thread really interesting - it seems a bit scary to me that so many installers would set up the chimney this way. Woodstock's response - they'd seen it many times before, yet as Charly discovered, it's a big mistake. Draft issue aside, what if exhaust / smoke is spilling out the bottom of the tee, inside the chase or old masonry chimney etc., under certain conditions - could this happen (is this what happened to Charly?). Isn't that potentially a real safety issue too? Or am I over-thinking this...? IMHO once you install a liner, the old chimney is not a chimney any more, it's a chase, and there should be no way for any exhaust gasses to escape and get into that (confined) space. Somebody please correct me if I'm out to lunch (which has been known to happen)...
I think you absolutely have a very valid point.. My worst fear now was if I had slight smoke smell before on a low setting,, did I also have low levels of carbon monoxide entering my home,, because the cap was never installed
! I should have had a metered co detector in the stove room when all this was going on... would have really alerted me as to having a serious draft issue...Just glad I inquired about the Tee being uncapped. I guess my thinking was the newly installed clean out door was acting like the cap sealing things up from the bottom. I found out not so.
The chimney caps and screens are known to clog. Sometimes fully clog. When that happens, if your tee (with open cleanout) is at a point above the intake to the stove then your cleanout has become the new chimney cap and smoke will pour out. Prior to complete chimney cap pluggage there will be a period where air is sometimes sucked into the open cleanout and smoke is sometimes puffed out. Most of the time, fresh air will be entering the cleanout and spoiling your draft while it cools your flue and creates creosote.
Thanks Highbeam for the sanity check. Either way (smoke puffing out, or air spoiling the draft) the homeowner loses. This is just sad....
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