Flat roof

[vinny11950]

The neighbor decided to redo her roof completely. So I went up there and checked it out.

They spent the morning ripping out the old stuff down to the framing. You can see some wood rotted out.





The new skylight and gutters waiting to be installed. Beautiful copper.





Installed skylight, finished roof.






They talked my landlord into repairing the flashing around his skylight and vent pipes. They used fabric and a rubberized flashing cement.









Then they painted everything with an aluminum paint to reflect the sun and make the roof last longer. Does this make sense?

Will it extend the life of this old roof, which is about 20 years old?

I took a picture of the cut up between the neighbor's roof removed and my landlord's roof. It looks like layers of asphalt or something like it, about 1.5 inches thick.

 

[saewoody]

I’m not a roofing expert, but that makes sense to me


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Hogwildz]

They tore up hot roofing. Which it heavy felt with hot tar coating between the layers(with 3 or 4 overlapping each other 1/3 to 1/4 each run) & on the top. Looks like they installed modified bitumen. Either hot tar applied or torched down. About a 10 year lifespan.
On your roof, what they are calling rubberized roofing cement, is roof cement with fabric laid between the bottom & top layers of roof cement( referred to as muck in the roofing world). The paint you're referring to is alumacoat. It does help reflect and will also extend the life of the roof. May last a few years to a couple years depending on how well it was applied, and if they used the fibered or non-fibered type.
That chimney should have a reglet cut into it and a reglet flashing installed over the top edge of the flashing.

 

[vinny11950]

They tore up hot roofing. Which it heavy felt with hot tar coating between the layers(with 3 or 4 overlapping each other 1/3 to 1/4 each run) & on the top. Looks like they installed modified bitumen. Either hot tar applied or torched down. About a 10 year lifespan.
On your roof, what they are calling rubberized roofing cement, is roof cement with fabric laid between the bottom & top layers of roof cement( referred to as muck in the roofing world). The paint you're referring to is alumacoat. It does help reflect and will also extend the life of the roof. May last a few years to a couple years depending on how well it was applied, and if they used the fibered or non-fibered type.
That chimney should have a reglet cut into it and a reglet flashing installed over the top edge of the flashing.

Thanks, Hogz. It does look like they took some shortcuts with the flashings.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

I had a rubber roof put on a commercial bldg about 25 yrs ago, still good. Dont know anyone(roofers) wasting time with asphalt or double coverage roofs these days ,they just dont last. Back in the 90 s i had a Double Coverage roof put on ,lasted 7 years. The torch down type seems to last longer but still not as long as rubber.

 

[Hogwildz]

I had a rubber roof put on a commercial bldg about 25 yrs ago, still good. Dont know anyone(roofers) wasting time with asphalt or double coverage roofs these days ,they just dont last. Back in the 90 s i had a Double Coverage roof put on ,lasted 7 years. The torch down type seems to last longer but still not as long as rubber.

The main field of a rubber roof will last indefinitely. surely longer than all of us. It is the flashings that will fail in time, as they are not made of the same materials.

Hot roofs last a very long time if properly installed. Hot roofs are a dying trade/art, and have since been replaced with several new systems. We were still doing hot roofs back in 99 when I decided to retire from roofing.

Roofing is a young mans job, and many folks don't realize how chitty hard the job is. To many, roofers are scum, but not many people are cut out to be a roofer. It truly is a thankless job that beats the hell out of one's body, which you pay for the rest of your life. Great experience, but the new pains each day make me wonder if the pay was worth the long term effects. Oh well, too late now.

Inspect your roof once a year, paying attention to the details work & flashings, as they are the only real parts that can deteriorate and fail over the years. But they can always be redone, or gone over with new flashing. As long as the field rubber isn't punctured, it will last forever. Punctures can be patched also.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

I always wonder why a rubber roof dont dry rot from sun exposure like yur tires. I guess i does slowly,probably a different kind of rubber.

 

[Hogwildz]

I always wonder why a rubber roof dont dry rot from sun exposure like yur tires. I guess i does slowly,probably a different kind of rubber.

Different manufacturing process. Not the same rubber compound.
I know for a fact that tires can be made to last a very long time.
I had an account with a large trucking company I handled their loss claims, and they were given a test set of tires from a large tire manufacturer, the one with the blimps, for some of their rigs, The owner showed them to me, they had 400,000 miles on them, and no wear. He said they told the manuf. they wanted a bunch more, the manuf. said "these will never hit the market".

 

[BrotherBart]

First job out of high school was hot roofing. It took 25 years for the burn marks on my left arm to go away after getting splashed with hot tar. After we lost a guy doing a coliseum barrel roof I decided to go sell sewing machines for a while.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

It took 25 years for the burn marks on my left arm to go away after getting splashed with hot tar. .

Now you get burn marks on both arms just loadin the stove.

 

[jatoxico]

Roofing is a young mans job, and many folks don't realize how chitty hard the job is. To many, roofers are scum, but not many people are cut out to be a roofer. It truly is a thankless job that beats the hell out of one's body

I worked in construction as a kid while I was figuring things out then for a while getting through school. In a generally rough crowd the hot tar roofers were a different breed altogether for sure. Did a lot of commercial sheet rock and residential carpentry including some roofing and other demanding work but standing in the sun tarring a roof every day definitely has to be tough. Good you were able to change up before the job took too much from you.

 

[BrotherBart]

Now you get burn marks on both arms just loadin the stove.

Finally bought a really long pair of gloves that have fixed that for N/S reloads.

 

[semipro]

Roofing is a young mans job, and many folks don't realize how chitty hard the job is.... It truly is a thankless job that beats the hell out of one's body, which you pay for the rest of your life. Great experience, but the new pains each day make me wonder if the pay was worth the long term effects. Oh well, too late now.

I've come to realize this as I'm doing some deep energy upgrades and roof/siding replacement on our house. Standing seam steel is planned over the Grace underlayment shown.
Asphalt shingle tear-off seems particularly onerous to me now. I think the original installers drove 3 times as many nails as were needed.
Working by myself, I'm spending many week nights and most weekends on the roof and while I enjoy being outside and the workout, its really hard on my body. The side of the house I'm working on now is only a 3/12 pitch so not too bad. The pain will only increase when I start working on the 7/12 pitch side of the house.

 

[vinny11950]

I've come to realize this as I'm doing some deep energy upgrades and roof/siding replacement on our house. Standing seam steel is planned over the Grace underlayment shown.
Asphalt shingle tear-off seems particularly onerous to me now. I think the original installers drove 3 times as many nails as were needed.
Working by myself, I'm spending many week nights and most weekends on the roof and while I enjoy being outside and the workout, its really hard on my body. The side of the house I'm working on now is only a 3/12 pitch so not too bad. The pain will only increase when I start working on the 7/12 pitch side of the house.
View attachment 216214

That looks like some project. Good luck and stay safe.

 

[peakbagger]

One important thing with "rubber" roofs is if you need to patch it, standard roofing tar will probably damage it voiding any warranty There are special products specifically designed for different roofing systems and you need to make sure you use the right stuff.

EPDM roofing systems do come in different thicknesses, the thicker versions usually have a longer warranty. Generally roofs fail from abuse or bad detailing, folks drag stuff over them or cut in new openings incorrectly. If there is any traffic on the roof, make sure there are traffic pads adhered to the roof. If its large complex of buildings standardize on one system and pay to have the installer stop by every couple of years to touch things up.

A definite dumb idea is use a torch on overlay on top of a deteriorated membrane. It looks good initially but give it a few years and its going to delaminate from the old membrane usually in a wind storm.

 

[Hogwildz]

I've come to realize this as I'm doing some deep energy upgrades and roof/siding replacement on our house. Standing seam steel is planned over the Grace underlayment shown.
Asphalt shingle tear-off seems particularly onerous to me now. I think the original installers drove 3 times as many nails as were needed.
Working by myself, I'm spending many week nights and most weekends on the roof and while I enjoy being outside and the workout, its really hard on my body. The side of the house I'm working on now is only a 3/12 pitch so not too bad. The pain will only increase when I start working on the 7/12 pitch side of the house.
View attachment 216214

You can try tearing the shingles off from the top down. It is easier to work downward, and if they aren't too deteriorated, they may roll down in big sections. Easier to get underneath them also. Hope you're at least using shingle rippers, makes for an easier time.
Standing seam is the way to go. Much better than the crap barn roof metal most use.

Are you installing a plywood over the insulation? You will need a stiff substrate to fasten & support the new standing seam panels.

 

[Hogwildz]

One important thing with "rubber" roofs is if you need to patch it, standard roofing tar will probably damage it voiding any warranty There are special products specifically designed for different roofing systems and you need to make sure you use the right stuff.

EPDM roofing systems do come in different thicknesses, the thicker versions usually have a longer warranty. Generally roofs fail from abuse or bad detailing, folks drag stuff over them or cut in new openings incorrectly. If there is any traffic on the roof, make sure there are traffic pads adhered to the roof. If its large complex of buildings standardize on one system and pay to have the installer stop by every couple of years to touch things up.

A definite dumb idea is use a torch on overlay on top of a deteriorated membrane. It looks good initially but give it a few years and its going to delaminate from the old membrane usually in a wind storm.

No asphalt or petroleum products on EPDM ever.

 

[semipro]

You can try tearing the shingles off from the top down. It is easier to work downward, and if they aren't too deteriorated, they may roll down in big sections. Easier to get underneath them also. Hope you're at least using shingle rippers, makes for an easier time.
Standing seam is the way to go. Much better than the crap barn roof metal most use.

Are you installing a plywood over the insulation? You will need a stiff substrate to fasten & support the new standing seam panels.

Right on all counts. I'm using a shingle ripper working top down. Trying to get shingles, roofing felt, and all at once. Everything is breaking apart. I'm amazed how friable the heavy roofing felt is.
I am installing 1/2" plywood over 3" of foam board. I'm very impressed with the Grace Tri-flex underlayment, not so impressed with the cap nails I'm using as the plastic cracks easily.
Thanks!

 

[Hogwildz]

Regular ol roof

Right on all counts. I'm using a shingle ripper working top down. Trying to get shingles, roofing felt, and all at once. Everything is breaking apart. I'm amazed how friable the heavy roofing felt is.
I am installing 1/2" plywood over 3" of foam board. I'm very impressed with the Grace Tri-flex underlayment, not so impressed with the cap nails I'm using as the plastic cracks easily.
Thanks!

Regular ol roofing nails or a hammer tacker stapler will do just as well at the cap nails, and no thickness of the caps to deal with. You want the metal to sit flat against the surface, the caps may cause oil canning in the metals panels.

 

[semipro]

Regular ol roof

Regular ol roofing nails or a hammer tacker stapler will do just as well at the cap nails, and no thickness of the caps to deal with. You want the metal to sit flat against the surface, the caps may cause oil canning in the metals panels.

Grace specifies cap nails. I would have preferred to use roofing nails. I plan to use either striated or pencil ribbed standing seam panels to help prevent oil canning and telegraphing of the cap nails through the metal. I've also seen where some place foam backing rod under each panel the full length of the panel to prevent oil canning. It creates a small ridge in the center of each panel.

 

[Hogwildz]

Grace specifies cap nails. I would have preferred to use roofing nails. I plan to use either striated or pencil ribbed standing seam panels to help prevent oil canning and telegraphing of the cap nails through the metal. I've also seen where some place foam backing rod under each panel the full length of the panel to prevent oil canning. It creates a small ridge in the center of each panel.

Have you ever tried laying backing rod at length, and try and keep it straight? You'll have to nail it to try and keep it straight, defeating the purpose, and it won't go that straight anyway. Skip the backing rod. If you are using true real standing seam panels, you're better off laying them down and going. Hopefully you're not using the cheap barn roof metal panels everyone is using these days. Stuff is junk, thin, and paint fades quickly. The commercial grade panels have a 50yr Kynar paint finish or equivalent, and no exposed fasteners. Great roof system.

 

[semipro]

Have you ever tried laying backing rod at length, and try and keep it straight? You'll have to nail it to try and keep it straight, defeating the purpose, and it won't go that straight anyway. Skip the backing rod. If you are using true real standing seam panels, you're better off laying them down and going. Hopefully you're not using the cheap barn roof metal panels everyone is using these days. Stuff is junk, thin, and paint fades quickly. The commercial grade panels have a 50yr Kynar paint finish or equivalent, and no exposed fasteners. Great roof system.

Good thoughts on the backing rod.
I plan to use something like this roofing: http://www.unioncorrugating.com/AdvantageLokII.html
Agreed: I have the exposed fastener stuff on my barn but wouldn't install it on my house.

 

[peakbagger]

I have said it before, all the local installers put a storm shield underlayment (or equivalent) under standing seam roofs as chasing leaks without it is a PITA. With it any leaks just come out the soffits and no ones the wiser.

 

[Hogwildz]

Good thoughts on the backing rod.
I plan to use something like this roofing: http://www.unioncorrugating.com/AdvantageLokII.html
Agreed: I have the exposed fastener stuff on my barn but wouldn't install it on my house.

Good stuff, easy to install, screws down along the side with the pre-sloted nail slots, then snap the next pc on and go. The biggest thing is getting it started square. That will outlast you.
Make sure you use panhead screws, so they don't ding the next panel from underneath.