Giving up

[Mainewoodchucker]

Have been fighting with to high of temps with my stove. Using IR have gotten 700+ stove top and 400+ stack ( 3 feet up from stove) . Seems that no matter if I close the damper all the way down , I still get really high temps . Using pretty dry wood and even went to BIG splits to try to calm the fire . My secondaries seem to actually increase with cutting back the draft. And even tried to not refill till 150/200 degrees , raking coals forward , and cutting draft at 350/450/550 .

So , it is gonna run the way it wants to run . Not fighting with her anymore . Maybe she will straighten out when I tell her I am looking at a BK Princess to replace her .

Btw, no air leaks . You can see the secondaries really kick in when you close the draft . Trying to figure out where the secondary air come in to maybe cut that back some .

 

[jolby]

Maybe try cutting your air back sooner, so that you are fully closed at 400

 

[blueguy]

What stove? The temps you're describing are very similar to what I would get on a regular basis with my Napoleon 1450 as well as the temps I have heard / read from NC30 owners.

 

[tarzan]

You say your wood is pretty dry. Have you checked it with a moisture meter?

 

[Chuck the Canuck]

Have been fighting with to high of temps with my stove. Using IR have gotten 700+ stove top and 400+ stack ( 3 feet up from stove) . Seems that no matter if I close the damper all the way down , I still get really high temps . Using pretty dry wood and even went to BIG splits to try to calm the fire . My secondaries seem to actually increase with cutting back the draft. And even tried to not refill till 150/200 degrees , raking coals forward , and cutting draft at 350/450/550 .

I've been having the exact same problem with my stove running too hot, and it sucks to have to sit and worry constantly that the stove is going to overfire if you walk away from it for 5 minutes..... I think it's a case of an overactive draft on the flue, and I'm going to test that hypothesis by putting a key damper in the flue to try and gain a bit more control over it.....

 

[Xikar]

My PE Summit insert runs 700+ daily if I load her up. If I let the stove temp get above 400 - 450 before shutting the air down the son of a gun will easily shoot up to 800 plus! The first few times it happened I stressed about it and then just ran with it.

 

[Mainewoodchucker]

Stove is a Sierra 2100 . I cut my draft 1/2 , then less than 1/4 , then fully closed . Have tried cutting back sooner but still get crazy temps on a full load once the secondaries really take off . Measured pieces from different parts of my pile awhile back , after it had been in the house for a bit . Got 14-16% on most of it . 14 was just a few , the rest were 15-16 with an occasional 17 .

It isn't the high temps that bother me . I can deal with 700 . Its that she wants to continue to climb . I pulled my IR out and checked temps all over the stove , and while I had the door open trying to get the temp to drop I pulled 800-900+ around the door , 700+ on stove top , and 450+ for the first 3 feet of flue with around 350 by the cieling box . The flue temp does not bother me since it ran higher with my old stove . But the stove temps seem a bit high .

I did have a friend who installed stoves/boilers check my setup . He said I am getting an extremely good draft . From a stone cold stove it takes just a few minutes to get it roaring and secondaries will light off within 5 minutes .

Btw , I do have a key damper . Was never removed from my last stove setup . And have used it a few times to calm the fire down . Just hate using it with a stove that should not need it .

 

[tarzan]

If it were me I would use the key damper if that's what it took to control the fire with very dry wood and a strong draft. I know it is not usually recommend but in your case...

 

[HotCoals]

Btw , I do have a key damper . Was never removed from my last stove setup . And have used it a few times to calm the fire down . Just hate using it with a stove that should not need it .

All flue setups are not created equal.
If you have a very strong draft you may need it. Add really dry wood and the need becomes stronger.
I must add that my key damper seems to have very little effect on my setup which I believe would work fine without it.
You may end up having to slow the secondary air down some.
Have you tried burning e-w?

 

[begreen]

http://www.gulland.ca/florida_bungalow_syndrome.htm

 

[Mainewoodchucker]

All flue setups are not created equal.
If you have a very strong draft you may need it. Add really dry wood and the need becomes stronger.
I must add that my key damper seems to have very little effect on my setup which I believe would work fine without it.
You may end up having to slow the secondary air down some.
Have you tried burning e-w?

Haven't found where the secondary air enters yet . And it IS by burning e-w . My wood is to long for n-s .


And thanks bg , I read that before and wonder if the really low temps and dead on stack size may be adding to my excessive heat . I know the draft is really strong . Pulls like a freight train . My buddy watched me start a fire from stone cold stove and was surprised at how quick it got going and how good the draft was , and that is when it was 40 degrees out .

 

[HotCoals]

Well a draft can't be real strong unless it can pull the air that it needs.
I do feel you have too much air entering that stove.

 

[Mainewoodchucker]

Well a draft can't be real strong unless it can pull the air that it needs.
I do feel you have too much air entering that stove.

I have no doubt that there is to much air entering . But it seems to be a vicious cycle .....stove get hotter , draws more air , which creates more draft , which gets stove hotter , etc etc . I prefer not to use the key damper and would rather find where the intake holes are so I can do as some have on the NC30 by covering some of the holes .

 

[begreen]

A key damper is going to give you the most control the quickest. Otherwise get a shaving mirror and a flashlight and investigate the underside of the stove. Figure out its design. Look inside front to see if it has a boost manifold. If so, where it that air supplied? Where is the secondary intake?

Solved Canuck's issue:
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/stove-burning-too-hot.125259/#post-1681610

 

[iceman]

Just wondering if you have checked your gasket? Also, please don't jump on people for saying this but.....
Your wood is prolly a bit better than perfect. Its so dry that I would expect those temps. You have a great draft with perfect wood = hot temps.

Depending on your situation I would put less in and not open the air much at all when reloading. The draft alone will get it going and eventually it will roll along. Again, don't start at half start at a quarter or less and leave it... Just make sure the coals are forward and warm enough so it will smoke. You may have to tinker but you get the idea.

After you get the hang of it go back to filling it up. Your stove will still get hot but this should help you a bit.

Again, if your door gasket is fine and you have incredible draft, your wood is the culprit. We love our wood where yours is but if yours was a few % more you prolly would see a difference. I am not sure how you process your wood but larger pieces than what you have will also help.

I had a similar problem, in my draft was OK not great but my wood was bone dry which made my summit soar. Now, I split some fresh wood in the spring into smaller pieces so that they will burn but might sizzle.. I keep those separate just in case my wood is to dry so that I can mix it in. I still get great temps but i can control it. I only use those if my oak is around 14-16%. I also stopped bringing so much wood in the house.
If it 18-20% and sits for a week or 2 in a dry 70 degree environment..… it will lose more moisture so I only bring it in for 2-3 days now.

Good luck!

 

[Mainewoodchucker]

Iceman , I did check my door gasket . I actually put a new one on when I first brought the stove home . Has a nice tight seal .

I sat last night and figured out the actual age of the wood I am burning . It came in at 4 years of summers . So fairly well aged ( that is c/s/s ) . One problem I have is that it was split to small . I can only fit 4 pieces of the stuff I split 2 years ago vs 7-10 of the older stuff . I have been bringing in a weeks with at a time , and it sits about 6 feet from the wood stove , so yes it probably is drying out even more .

With all that said , I experimented last night with good results . I packed 3 large splits of my 2 year maple in the back with no air gaps . Loaded the rest with the 4 year old stuff . Packed to the door and maybe 2" from reburn tubes . The coals were also raked forward as usual . But this time I cut my draft to half at just over 200 degrees and all the way at just over 300 . Didn't wait for secondaries to really kick in like I normally do .

Results:
Ran 450-525 with no abrupt peak or low . Secondaries were there but slower and smaller . Zero smoke from my stack . And 9 hours later stove top was a bit over 150 with enough coals easily for relight .

Overall , I am guessing I need to cut my air back much sooner as well as try to get some good size splits in there to keep it from running away . Hate dipping into my good maple this year but if it will keep the stove running more level I will just have to do it .

I do appreciate the help and feedback from everyone . Being the first year using an EPA has had a learning curve , but am getting there with the help of the great members here . Thanx again everyone for bareing with me and giving me some great ideas and info .

 

[begreen]

Well done! There is a learning curve with any stove and a bigger one when going from an old stove to a modern one. Once you get the hang of it it becomes quite routine. Enjoy the warmth!

 

[Mainewoodchucker]

Yup bg ,have been so used to getting my fire roaring before shutting the damper down in my old air tights and tried doing that with the EPA . Realize now that since you can't truly shut the air down like the old stove , she WILL run away if you don't start early enough .

Happened to look back through a thread of loaded stoves and had a duh moment when the common remark was just charring the wood before closing the damper . Seems I let mine get past that "char" point a bit to much .

 

[Bigg_Redd]

Not fighting with her anymore .

What's the problem? Is your house too warm? Using too much wood? Eh?

 

[Mainewoodchucker]

What's the problem? Is your house too warm? Using too much wood? Eh?

Lol, not to warm . Yes have gone through more wood than I wanted , but has been extremaly unseasonably cold . So the wood has not been the issue . Stove flying past 700 degrees and not stopping was my concern . But thanks to a little insight by others and good info , I think it is under control .

 

[MishMouse]

I wish I lived near you, I would swap a cord of my soaked wood with a cord of your dry stuff.
I can guarantee you that you would not have a run away fire with the stuff I have.
I cut a piece in two and the outsides are paper dry while the insides are soaking wet.

 

[iceman]

Glad you figured it! No need to stop experimenting now. Use your old stuff but close the air sooner. When I use small splits on a reload often times I barely open the air to get it started and turn it down right away. The little flame I see usually results in a top down fire. That's what I call it when just secondaries are the only flame. Sometimes my window gets dark but by the time its done its clear.

Take the time to experiment with your stove to better understand it. Just be careful how much fuel you put in it... Or in your case WHICH fuel you put in it lol

Have fun and please post your findings

 

[Kosmik]

I can deal with 700 . Its that she wants to continue to climb .

Just found out for me (VZ Durango) that was usually caused by my door not being fully closed, I had to really crank it a last 1/16 and could see the door seat. Sometimes if I got some really small pieces of pine it will jump and need a little foil shoved up the secondary inlet.
If its real windy, I try smaller loads if still problems. (I have non-min chimney height and steep pitched roof)

But if I get it shut down too late, I think I get your same problem too. Vicious cycle till it's offgassed.
So far I've been alright by keeping a careful eye on how much I put it and really watching it till it's shut down as far as it will go.

 

[mstoelton]

I would still find out where your secondary air enters and make the opening smaller. You may need it in the future. I don't like the concept that I need to damper the stove at a certain point or there could be an overfire.

 

[Kosmik]

I think the only time I've needed to put foil in is because I let it get too hot in the first place.
EDIT: Door seal could be tighter. May be my culprit.