Harman Accentra 52i paddle broke off/other issues

[Nepa]

Hey guys, I'm looking for some advice on my Harman. Its just over two years old and have been having some problems. I'm hearing intermittent screeching, squealing sounds. It has to be one of the fans, not sure which one yet. Also, when I adjust the blower knob all the way to high, it doesn't blow full force, I have to back it down a pinch to get it to go on full. I've tried unplugging the unit, moving the knob all the way to test and then back on full to make sure its set right. (I read that somewhere else as a trouble shooting step) It doesn't even seem to blow as well as it used to so I took it apart to give the fans a good cleaning.

The distribution fans did have a buildup of ash/dust on them so I blew it of with a compressor. Heck, I blew everything off with the compressor in the back of the unit to make it look like new. I thought I would try to remove the combustion blower impeller (paddle) to give that a good cleaning as well. I managed to get the set screw off without too much trouble. The paddle however wouldn't come off so easily so I sprayed it with some graphite and gave it a pull. This thing broke off in my hands like it was clay. Every pull I gave it and another part of the blade just cracked off. Ridiculously cheap. I don't get it. I thought Harmon was supposed to be one of the better brands.

I hit it with some PB blaster and I'll let it sit and hopefully I can pull it off with vice grips or something. Any tips or advice for removal?

Also, can you guys recommend a site where I can get oem or maybe better made aftermarket parts at a decent price? I want to order and have on hand a combustion blower and distribution blowers for when it breaks. If there are any other parts or pieces that you think would be good to have on the ready I would appreciate the feedback.

Another question. Are there any diagnostic tools that can be run to see what the fan rpm's are running at or anything else I can hook up to my laptop to get a better idea of whats going on with the internals of this confounded machine?

Lucky for me I've got a warm front moving in so it shouldn't be too cold until another week or two while the unit is down. I have a wood burner in the basement to help me manage the cold until then. (Love my Jotul!)

Thanks much

 

[Mt Bob]

It happens,the impeller gets a lot of heat.You could try tapping it inwards,only gently.Sometimes have to resort to heating the hub,or slicing it with a cutoff wheel on a dremel.Also sounds like one of your blowers may not be working.Get the impeller off,or break off rest of blades,put stove in test position,room blowers will cycle off to high,you may find problem blower.Sometimes you can lube them.The harman diagnostic box is really expensive,for what little it does.Start there.I like dealing with mountainview,but they are close to me,earth sense prob closer to you.That impeller is usually 15 bucks,always nice to have a spare.

 

[Nepa]

It happens,the impeller gets a lot of heat.You could try tapping it inwards,only gently.Sometimes have to resort to heating the hub,or slicing it with a cutoff wheel on a dremel.Also sounds like one of your blowers may not be working.Get the impeller off,or break off rest of blades,put stove in test position,room blowers will cycle off to high,you may find problem blower.Sometimes you can lube them.The harman diagnostic box is really expensive,for what little it does.Start there.I like dealing with mountainview,but they are close to me,earth sense prob closer to you.That impeller is usually 15 bucks,always nice to have a spare.

Thanks for the advice. I checked out the store and the parts are cheaper for sure but it looks like not directly oem. For the combustion fan, it looks like the wiring isn't correctly sized so and I'l have to splice and lengthen it to fit. I spoke with one of the techs and he said that was the only difference. I'm concerned that there wasn't any other modifications to the motor not mentioned that might cause me problems with the board. Any advice/experience on that one?

(broken link removed to http://pellethead.com/product/harman-harmon-combustion-exhaust-draft-fan-motor-part-3-21-08639-amp-univcomb/)

 

[Ssyko]

That link is just the blower motor. The fan on it is for cooling the motor. You still need the impeller blade. And the motors they sell are Chinese made and you need to ck if the HP, RPM, Amps are the same as your original motor.

 

[Harmanizer]

When you install your new combustion impeller make sure you use antisieze on the shaft and the set screw.It will make it easier to remove next time.

 

[Nepa]

Thanks for the replies. I tried heating the impeller and removing it with vice grips. No help. I see guys just use a hacksaw to cut the shaft off. Someone I spoke to said use a dremmel to cut it off... Looks like the whole thing will need to be replaced. Grrr. I'll check the stats of the motor to see if it matches, paddle has been ordered as well. I'll be sure to use the anti-seize when I get it set.

 

[MtDew]

If you are just needing to replace your combustion blower fan just snap off the remaining fan blades and cut the fan hub that is stuck on the motor shaft. With the remaining fan blades out of the way, you should have access to use a Dremel tool with a cutting disc to slice the fan hub to be separated from the shaft. Try spraying PB Blaster on the hub and shaft, especially in the set screw hole and leave it sit. Can also try to heat up the fan hub with a plumber's torch.

 

[Nepa]

I appreciate it, but I hit with PB yesterday several times and then this morning. Nothing. Then I hit it with the yellow plumbers torch, got it glowing red hot. Nothing. The fans fell off in my hands when I tried to pull it off, so I could get in with the cutting dremmel tool, but at this point I'm not too confident the spindle shaft is perfectly straight, so even if I did get a new paddle back on there it may be off kilter with the all the heat, pulling and banging, so I don't want to chance it.

SOMEONE needs to invent a stronger heat resistant paddle. Can make a cool mill real fast....Anyone know a good patent lawyer?

 

[rickwai]

The only time I remove fan blade is to replace motor. Then a new blade is used. No real need to take the blade off to clean. It is not that critical. I just scrape behind it with a scraper between the paddles so the wall is not getting built up.

 

[Nepa]

The only time I remove fan blade is to replace motor. Then a new blade is used. No real need to take the blade off to clean. It is not that critical. I just scrape behind it with a scraper between the paddles so the wall is not getting built up.

The stove's just over 2 years old, I was hitting the ash on the paddle and behind it with a paintbrush, I wanted to make sure behind the paddle blades was clean, hard to get with any other tool. So hence the idea to remove it. The set screw came out with a slight crack. Who knew it would crumble in my hands?! lol It should be made stronger but, $$$ to made in replacements.

I have been experiencing some screeching late at night, I can't reproduce it during test mode. Its intermittent. So its gotta be one of the 3 fans. When I called my local harmon dealer he wouldn't send a tech out because I didn't buy it from him. Yeah. He just gave me a number to a local sweep, and when I called him, he said he wasn't certified to repair Harmons but would clean it for me. He said most problems are from people not cleaning it well enough so I wanted it as clean as it could be. I even used easy off oven spray on some gunky parts on the inside.

If I was king, I would devise a way to put it in a "clean mode", even if I had to pull it out and attach some additional hoses to achieve this, and have the fans rev up at ultra high speeds in reverse, blowing it up the chimney. Voila! You read it first here folks! Problem solved.Wheres that lawyer?! lol

 

[Mt Bob]

Some stoves have a "cleaning" mode,such as my old integra,reduces the amount of pellets and runs the blower(combustion) on high,usually once an hour.Harmans,tend to run the comb blower on high,during the shutdown phase.I have only heard of relatively few impellers coming apart,but they are cheap.I do not remove my impeller when cleaning,on my accentra f/s,it is a double impeller(because of the altitude I live at) and has been on there over 2 years.Do not understand your remark about running the blowers in reverse.

 

[Nepa]

Some stoves have a "cleaning" mode,such as my old integra,reduces the amount of pellets and runs the blower(combustion) on high,usually once an hour.Harmans,tend to run the comb blower on high,during the shutdown phase.I have only heard of relatively few impellers coming apart,but they are cheap.I do not remove my impeller when cleaning,on my accentra f/s,it is a double impeller(because of the altitude I live at) and has been on there over 2 years.Do not understand your remark about running the blowers in reverse.

If it were possible to run the distribution blowers in reverse(or in such a way) that would allow the excess ash/dust buildup on the squirrel cages to go up and out the chimney that would be ideal. My options were to either remove the wiring harness from the 5 or 6 zip ties to other wires, and then unbolt the fans and bring it outside to use an air compressor to clean it out thoroughly, bring it back, re-bolt, re-run the cables and re-zip tie.

I tried leaving it as is, and hitting it with my air compressor while my wife held a vacuum cleaner to catch the flying debris. It didn't work too well and we had to mop and dust the entire living room.

The only way I can see to clean it thoroughly next year is to remove them and clean them outside. Just another troublesome maintenance task I would hope someone would have the mindset to make it easier for the consumer. Maybe even to just have the entire backside removable with a few bolts and quick release cables. It's difficult to access the insert even with it pulled out to it max using the rail system and too heavy to move the entire unit outside. There's got to be a better way to work on it, or at least I think there should be.

Thanks for the feedback

 

[rickwai]

If it were possible to run the distribution blowers in reverse(or in such a way) that would allow the excess ash/dust buildup on the squirrel cages to go up and out the chimney that would be ideal. My options were to either remove the wiring harness from the 5 or 6 zip ties to other wires, and then unbolt the fans and bring it outside to use an air compressor to clean it out thoroughly, bring it back, re-bolt, re-run the cables and re-zip tie.

I tried leaving it as is, and hitting it with my air compressor while my wife held a vacuum cleaner to catch the flying debris. It didn't work too well and we had to mop and dust the entire living room.

The only way I can see to clean it thoroughly next year is to remove them and clean them outside. Just another troublesome maintenance task I would hope someone would have the mindset to make it easier for the consumer. Maybe even to just have the entire backside removable with a few bolts and quick release cables. It's difficult to access the insert even with it pulled out to it max using the rail system and too heavy to move the entire unit outside. There's got to be a better way to work on it, or at least I think there should be.

Thanks for the feedback

You are way over thinking your cleaning. You dont have to have to stove looking back to new inside. As far as comb. fan, Just use a 1 inch scraper between the blades to rotate around to clean the wall behind it and a dust pan brush to knock ash off the blades. 3 min. tops for this part. Unless you have long hair dogs or cats, Dist. fans only need cleaned every few years.
Harman stoves are by far the best engineered for daily cleaning. No hidden passages, no gasketed connections to have to worry about, Inserts are designed to be easily pulled with 1 person and no pipes to unhook and try to get to reseal.

 

[Nepa]

If you are just needing to replace your combustion blower fan just snap off the remaining fan blades and cut the fan hub that is stuck on the motor shaft. With the remaining fan blades out of the way, you should have access to use a Dremel tool with a cutting disc to slice the fan hub to be separated from the shaft. Try spraying PB Blaster on the hub and shaft, especially in the set screw hole and leave it sit. Can also try to heat up the fan hub with a plumber's torch.

I just tried the dremmel tool. It's difficult to get in there. The only way I could cut it was by going sideways. Cutting and spraying with more PB oil and tapping it with a screwdriver, it moved back. Then I was able to pull it off, but cutting my wrist and my hand in the process.

So now that its off, I did cut into the shaft slightly. I'll assume it wont make too much of a difference although my OCD senses are going off the scales. I'll see how the fan spins once I get it on.

If you see the shaft there is a flat edge to it. You would think the new fan would have a similar indentation to fit into. Like a key in a key hole. It doesn't. Do I have the right one? I ordered a fan from amazon, the fastest delivery I could get. So does it matter where the set hole screw goes? should I screw it against the circular edge or the flat edge?

 

[MtDew]

Glad you got it apart. I would align the set screw with the flat on the shaft. Clean up the shaft with a wire wheel on the Dremel or some fine sandpaper. Don't forget the antisieze when reinstalling.

 

[Nepa]

You are way over thinking your cleaning. You dont have to have to stove looking back to new inside. As far as comb. fan, Just use a 1 inch scraper between the blades to rotate around to clean the wall behind it and a dust pan brush to knock ash off the blades. 3 min. tops for this part. Unless you have long hair dogs or cats, Dist. fans only need cleaned every few years.
Harman stoves are by far the best engineered for daily cleaning. No hidden passages, no gasketed connections to have to worry about, Inserts are designed to be easily pulled with 1 person and no pipes to unhook and try to get to reseal.

I'm just going by what the sweep told me. I've never owned any other pellet stoves so I can't compare. All I can explain is whats happening to my 2 year old harmon. The Cadillac of pellet stoves. 9 tons through it so far. If I hear screeching sounds from the machine in the middle of the night, I need to try to clean it to the best of my ability to rule out particulates that may be causing any problems. I do have 2 dogs but didn't see any hair.

I'm also having an issue with my penchiometer. When I turn it to full the fans wont blow full force. I have to back it down a pinch to make it go on full. I tried googling and and one guy said turn it all the way one way and back again to "reset it" but it didn't work. Just 5 months outta warranty and I need to buy a new board for $186 on top of my other issues? I'm all for giving credit where credit is due, but if there are problems with a stove they should discussed so consumers can benefit from another's experience and opinion.

A a quick release from the back of the motor to release the spindle shaft so it didn't have to be cut from the front would be the easiest fix with the paddle situation.

Thanks for your response

 

[Nepa]

Glad you got it apart. I would align the set screw with the flat on the shaft. Clean up the shaft with a wire wheel on the Dremel or some fine sandpaper. Don't forget the antisieze when reinstalling.

Thanks, I did what your recommended. I'm running it on test and the fan seems to be spinning ok, I did a slow mo video with my iphone of the fan spinning to get a better look and it appears to be 99%. Barely any wobble.

Cheers!

 

[Harmanizer]

You may have carbon buildup in your auger tube.That will cause an occasional screech.With no pellets in the auger use a flashlight to check.You can usually use a screwdriver to scrape any deposits out of there.

 

[Nepa]

You may have carbon buildup in your auger tube.That will cause an occasional screech.With no pellets in the auger use a flashlight to check.You can usually use a screwdriver to scrape any deposits out of there.

Thanks, I'll check that after my next ton is up and I'm due for cleaning.