Help a Newbie pick a stove!

[NortheastPhotographic]

Hi All!
Long time lurker first time poster. My Fiance and I are in the process of purchasing a lovely little home on an Island here in Maine. It's a very open saltbox style house, about 1300sq/ft. The 2nd floor is exposed from the first via a catwalk that connects the two bedrooms. The brick chimney is right in the middle of the home, with an open fireplace on one side, and a wood stove ready port on the other. The stove would be right when you enter the house, opposite the side of the living room, kitchen, etc. One great thing heating wise is it has ample southern facing windows. It also has a forced air heating system via an oil furnace. The previous owner heated mostly with wood, and we'd like to do the same.

I'm totally new to wood stoves. I've only used them in cabin rentals. I have a few questions, and I'd love to take recommendations as to models if you have any.

It seems like people are pretty down on catalytic stoves, especially those from Vermont Castings. On the other hand, if I get a handle on how to use one, it seems like it could have significant advantages. Worth the risk?

On the size ratings. If a stove is good for lets say 1500sq/ft, is it really sufficient for my needs, or would I be better off sizing up to something good for 2500 sq/ft?

I had wanted to shop used, but stories of rebuilds are scaring me off a little...

On models, I like the looks of the Jotul F55, and the VC Intrepid II. I'm open to any recommendations you may have! $2500ish would probably be the max of my budget right now.

 

[jetsam]

It seems like people are pretty down on catalytic stoves, especially those from Vermont Castings. On the other hand, if I get a handle on how to use one, it seems like it could have significant advantages. Worth the risk?

"People" are not so bright sometimes. There's no risk to a cat or noncat if you get a good stove. (You certainly can get a crappy stove in either flavor, so do look out for that.) Cats are not inherently harder to operate, though there are plenty of people out there who have never used one and feel strongly that they are Bad. I would explain this phenomenon to you, but I'm not a psychiatrist.

My stove is a cat, and is significantly easier to operate than most tube stoves (one air control, no babysitting, no overfires unless the stove gets a hole in it).

On the size ratings.

Fiction from the marketing department. They have no idea what your envelope is like. It sounds like a ridiculous thing to advertise about a heat source, and it is.

I had wanted to shop used, but stories of rebuilds are scaring me off a little...

On models, I like the looks of the Jotul F55, and the VC Intrepid II. I'm open to any recommendations you may have! $2500ish would probably be the max of my budget right now.

If you have $2500 to spend and you are not familiar with woodstoves and/or mechanically inclined, you may be better suited for the new stove market. Remember that the liner is going to be expensive, very expensive if you don't install it yourself.

 

[NortheastPhotographic]

"

If you have $2500 to spend and you are not familiar with woodstoves and/or mechanically inclined, you may be better suited for the new stove market. Remember that the liner is going to be expensive, very expensive if you don't install it yourself.

The seller previously had a wood stove in this same location. Would there be a liner in place already?

 

[Jan Pijpelink]

The seller previously had a wood stove in this same location. Would there be a liner in place already?

Stick your head in the chimney and have a look. It should stick out at the bottom.

 

[begreen]

It would be better to have a pro assess the readiness of the chimney and flue for a woodstove. There are many possibilities of past connections being unsafe and maybe even illegal. Our old fireplace had an unlined chimney with multiple ports (thimbles) taken off the fireplace chimney. One was just plastered over. Have a certified sweep or at least one with very good references inspect the chimney for its current state and viability for connecting a woodstove. Even if it is not good now, it may be made safe and ready with a cleaning and a stainless steel liner added.

There are many good stoves on the market. Vermont Castings has been under new mgmt. for a few years now and they are working on improving their product. However, there are a lot of other alternatives that will get the job done. Many are simpler and easier to maintain stoves.

If you are intending to heat with wood, you will need to have a good sized stash of wood stacked and drying right now. Try to buy "seasoned wood" from a reputable dealer, but expect that is actually will not be fully seasoned.

 

[RandyBoBandy]

like begreen said. Take “seasoned” firewood with a grain of salt. Finding actual seasoned firewood for sale is like finding a leprechaun riding a unicorn with a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.

 

[Mainely Saws]

I think today is the last day of a sale by Woodstock stove company but I would suggest giving them a call ............

(broken link removed to http://www.woodstove.com/sale)

 

[NortheastPhotographic]

like begreen said. Take “seasoned” firewood with a grain of salt. Finding actual seasoned firewood for sale is like finding a leprechaun riding a unicorn with a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.

I would appreciate any resources you have on seasoning 101!

 

[NortheastPhotographic]

I think today is the last day of a sale by Woodstock stove company but I would suggest giving them a call ............

(broken link removed to http://www.woodstove.com/sale)

Dang! Not ready to buy just now.

 

[Mainely Saws]

Still worth a call . They are a very reputable and knowledgeable company that makes great stoves .Check them out on this site ..........

 

[KennyK]

I think today is the last day of a sale by Woodstock stove company but I would suggest giving them a call ............

(broken link removed to http://www.woodstove.com/sale)

The folks at Woodstock are incredibly helpful and will support you. My guess is if you call them and explain your totally new to the market, possibly considering one of their stoves but need a little longer to decide, there's a good chance they'd extend the sale price to you for another week or so (who knows, maybe even longer!). Additionally, they will talk with you about your exact situation, and give you educated and well informed information about which of their stoves would work best in your situation (they looked through photos and blueprints of my home and offered great input), and all with no pressure to buy. And this information coming from the people who make the stove - you'll be hard presssd to find that with another company. Plus, they are guaranteeing their stoves with a full refund through the end of 2018, including shipping, so if you don't love it you could always return it.

I haven't yet used a Woodstock, but just ordered their Ideal Steel. As you already saw on this thread, and can find a lot more info on if you look around this site, nothing complicated or challenging about their cat stoves, just less wood wasted and longer burn times from what I hear! Search this site for Woodstock stoves and you will find many, many fans and reviews!

Good luck!

 

[Rearscreen]

Call Woodstock, I would assume even a down payment will get you under the wire. Explain your situation.

 

[begreen]

I would get a review of the chimney soon so that you have knowledge of that cost. If you prefer to keep within a tighter budget and are flexible with looks, there are several standard stove choices under $2000 that will do the job.

 

[RandyBoBandy]

I would appreciate any resources you have on seasoning 101!

There’s a lot of ways to make sure you have good firewood for next burn season but you need to start now. If you don’t have the resources to produce your own (woods, chainsaw, splitter, axe, etc.) than start buying a cord here and a cord there. Find a good dry spot on your property preferably where it will be exposed to wind and start stacking. If you can afford the lumber it’s best to build a wood shed. Something that will keep you firewood off the ground, and protect it from rain and snow but let the wind blow through. If you go to the woodshed forum here there is a thread full of peoples wood sheds. Also go to homedepot and buy a $20.00 moisture meter.
Typically what happens when buying “seasoned” wood is that it’s just not dry enough to burn in a wood stove efficiently. You’re looking for a moisture content below 20%. Closer to 16% is best.

 

[begreen]

There are lots of discussions on how to stack, dry and store wood in the Wood Shed forum here on hearth.com.

https://www.hearth.com/talk/forums/the-wood-shed.17/

 

[au2183]

Dang! Not ready to buy just now.

I agree with calling Woodstock. I’m waiting on a Fireview I ordered last month after visiting the factory in January and doing a ton of research. I’ve been burning wood for over 50 years, and I’ve never dealt with a better company, or seen better built stoves in my lifetime of experience. You cannot go wrong with Woodstock.
Our last stove was a Jotul 3CB and I’d never consider another one of their stoves. We did have a good experience with a Vermont Castings back in the 80’s but I’ve heard too many horror stories since then to risk my hard earned money there.
The size Home your talking about would be well served by several of the Woodstock models depending on how tight it is and what the decor is like. Check out the Palladian, Keystone, Fireview, Absolute Steel, and Ideal Steel in particular. Any of those will keep you warm very efficiently.
They will hold your hand through the entire purchase and setup and make sure you’re doing it right and they want to make sure you’re happy in the end, and you will be! If you’re interested in great service they can’t be matched in my experience.
Check out the website and call.

 

[Rearscreen]

They just extended the sale through the weekend.

 

[Ashful]

A Jotul F55 will roast you out of 1300 sq.ft. That one is a no-go, in my opinion.

Heed well, the advice on getting some wood stacked and drying, ASAP. If you go the backyard kiln route (see Poindexter’s posts on this subject), you could actually have some ready to burn next fall. If air drying without the aid of a kiln, it’s very unlikely you will have any wood ready to burn in 2019. Figure at least 1 FULL summer for most softwoods, and 2 - 3 summers to season most hardwoods.

On cats and non-cats, I’ll just say that I’ve watched countless members of this forum buy a non-cat from a swindling local dealer, only to come here and switch to a cat stove after a few years. I haven’t seen many go the other way. Catalytic stoves offer superior performance, with the one concession being the added cost of replacing a combustor every few years. The combustor for my stove costs $200, and is warranted for 10 years. I have three years on them now, and they’re still working great. I’ll spend that amortized few dollars per year, to enjoy the long burn times that only cat stoves can get. One of my stoves was loaded Thursday night, and is just almost ready for a reload now. You can’t do that with any non-cat.

Oh, begreen... my claimed end of the burning season was pre-mature. Things finally dried out enough here that I was able to fetch some wood on Thursday evening! I’ll be moving more today, if the rain holds off.

 

[Ashful]

Had a few more minutes, so more on stove selection. One of my stoves is located in 1200 sq.ft. of 1990’s construction (our family room addition), and I’ve run two different stoves there. This space has five exterior doors (four being glass French doors) 14 double-hung windows, and additional transom windows above 16 of the doors and windows. The ceiling height is vaulted to 14 feet. Overall, roughly the size and volume of your house.

I am currently running a Blaze King Ashford 30, and it’s decent match for this space. With the solar gain I get from those 35’ish windows, it can get very warm on sunny days in shoulder season, but it’s just about perfect for cloudy days and overnights. I run this stove very low, 24 hours per load, and the furnace almost never kicks on to heat this wing of the house. This works out perfectly, as 24 hour reloads fit both my schedule and my heating needs.

If I were to buy a non-cat, I’d have to go much, much smaller. This is because non-cats cannot be turned down far enough to achieve the low heat output and 24 hour load times that are just the daily routine of my stoves. This would mean reloading a smaller non-cat maybe every 8 hours, something that does not fit my work schedule.

If I were buying a new stove to heat a small space today, I would be looking at only two options:

1. Blaze King 30 box (Ashford, Chinook, etc.)
2. Woodstock Fireview

Blaze King has the performance advantage, for low-range output and long burn time, but plenty of folks like the look of Woodstock. Both companies are at the top of the market in terms of customer support and accessibility.

Non-cat in 1300 sq.ft., if you have any level of insulation, is going to mean having to go with a very small stove. This is because they can never be turned down what we might call “medium”. Small non-cats mean frequent reloading, something I’d not have the patience for, but I’m sure soon enough someone will come along to give you an opposing view.

 

[jetsam]

something I’d not have the patience for, but I’m sure soon enough someone will come along to give you an opposing view.

You would so!

 

[begreen]

buy a non-cat from a swindling local dealer, only to come here and switch to a cat stove after a few years. I haven’t seen many go the other way

I have to take exception to that statement. It's far from accurate. Yes, people have had issues with dealers, but this happens when selling both non-cat and cat stoves. There are other cat stoves like VC, Buck, Appalachian and other hybrids too. Not all are trouble free and not all dealerships are great. Even BK has had some poor dealers reported, that happens. What is not mentioned is that there are 10s of thousands of stove sales every year that we don't hear about. They are happy with their stoves and dealerships. By and large people come here to learn and to solve problems. So we see bad installs, bad support, factory errors, etc.. FWIW, this is not peculiar to the stove industry. Look at how many good cars are sold by weak or poor dealerships.

As for stove size, I have a neighbor and a close friend that have a 2 cu ft and 3 cu ft PE stoves. Both houses are 1600 sq ft. with relatively open floorplans. The neighbor has a 2cu ft stove in an old home. It does a great job of heating the place. My friend has a 3.0 ft stove like ours in a tighter newer single story home. They don't like a hot house and have never complained of overheating. This is in part because both are experienced wood burners and don't constant stoke the fire when the weather is mild. The operator has a lot to do with how the stove heats. Can a 3 cu ft stove be too much for some homes, yes. But with a home in Maine, if it is average to poorly insulated, a 3 cu ft stove might work ok.

 

[Ashful]

I have to take exception to that statement. It's far from accurate. Yes, people have had issues with dealers, but this happens when selling both non-cat and cat stoves. There are other cat stoves like VC, Buck, Appalachian and other hybrids too. Not all are trouble free and not all dealerships are great. Even BK has had some poor dealers reported, that happens. What is not mentioned is that there are 10s of thousands of stove sales every year that we don't hear about. They are happy with their stoves and dealerships. By and large people come here to learn and to solve problems. So we see bad installs, bad support, factory errors, etc.. FWIW, this is not peculiar to the stove industry. Look at how many good cars are sold by weak or poor dealerships.

As for stove size, I have a neighbor and a close friend that have a 2 cu ft and 3 cu ft PE stoves. Both houses are 1600 sq ft. with relatively open floorplans. The neighbor has a 2cu ft stove in an old home. It does a great job of heating the place. My friend has a 3.0 ft stove like ours in a tighter newer single story home. They don't like a hot house and have never complained of overheating. This is in part because both are experienced wood burners and don't constant stoke the fire when the weather is mild. The operator has a lot to do with how the stove heats. Can a 3 cu ft stove be too much for some homes, yes. But with a home in Maine, if it is average to poorly insulated, a 3 cu ft stove might work ok.

You are right in all your statements, as usual, begreen. But you’re taking my statement beyond that which I intended it, my fault for not being more clear. We see so many reports here of dealers telling customers that cat stoves are bad, and to be avoided, based on inaccurate information from stoves made 30 years ago. They knowingly and deliberately ignore the vast improvements made in catalytic stoves since the bad days of the 1980’s, deceiving customers into buying the stove they’re offering. That’s what I meant, when I used the word “swindling”.

I’ve said numerous times, if I couldn’t buy a cat stove, PE would be at the top of my list. I love their looks, and their cast clad steel box construction.

 

[fossil]

Two words - Ceiling Fan

 

[jetsam]

Did we really do the cat vs. tube thing in one page with no tears? Well done.

Now BK vs. Woodstock... go!

 

[Rearscreen]

Two words - Ceiling Fan

Yes, blades with shiny foil to reflect the radiance of a Woodstock and

Now BK vs. Woodstock... go!

big blades for the nice feel of warm summer breeze for the BK.
On this subject, I had a lightning bug attached to a bedroom ceiling fan once. It was quite a show.