Homeowners insurance: workshop stove

[Squiner]

Anyone know a homeowners insurer that will allow a wood stove in an accessory building (workshop)?

Just called my insurer (Geico) and was told if I installed one I would be canceled.

 

[bholler]

What is the workshop used for

 

[Squiner]

What is the workshop used for

Typical workshop activities, not including flammable liquid storage.

So I called America First Insurance Group and they allow it; getting a quote. Waiting to hear back from Farmers Insurance.

 

[bholler]

Typical workshop activities, not including flammable liquid storage.

So I called America First Insurance Group and they allow it; getting a quote. Waiting to hear back from Farmers Insurance.

Are you working on vehicles or gas powered equipment? Is it a wood shop?

 

[Squiner]

Are you working on vehicles or gas powered equipment? Is it a wood shop?

Sorry, that’s what I meant by no flammable liquids... No.

But my question was which insurance will allow a wood stove in an out building. I know about NFPA 211, IBC, etc. this isn’t about code. It’s about insurance companies risk tolerance.

 

[bholler]

Sorry, that’s what I meant by no flammable liquids... No.

But my question was which insurance will allow a wood stove in an out building. I know about NFPA 211, IBC, etc. this isn’t about code. It’s about insurance companies risk tolerance.

Ok good just checking because if it was a code violation just because they tell you it's covered now doesn't mean it would be in the event of a claim unless you had a specific statement from them in writing saying it was ok with that violation. But that doesn't apply to you.

 

[Squiner]

Ok good just checking because if it was a code violation just because they tell you it's covered now doesn't mean it would be in the event of a claim unless you had a specific statement from them in writing saying it was ok with that violation. But that doesn't apply to you.

So, now to tease that I point out a little. I’m interpreting the NFPA 211 and it states the following:

“Solid fuel burning appliances shall not be installed in any location where gasoline or any other flammable vapors or gases are present.”

If possible, I would like to be able to park my diesel tractor in the workshop. Diesel is a combustible liquid which I believe falls outside these restrictions. The flash point of diesel is about 125 degrees F.

I understand some may say of course diesel falls into this bin but technically it doesn’t. I’m sure the NFPA chose its terms precisely.

 

[bholler]

So, now to tease that I point out a little. I’m interpreting the NFPA 211 and it states the following:

“Solid fuel burning appliances shall not be installed in any location where gasoline or any other flammable vapors or gases are present.”

If possible, I would like to be able to park my diesel tractor in the workshop. Diesel is a combustible liquid which I believe falls outside these restrictions. The flash point of diesel is about 125 degrees F.

I understand some may say of course diesel falls into this bin but technically it doesn’t. I’m sure the NFPA chose its terms precisely.

It also says solid fuel appliances shall not be installed in any garage. With garage defined as a space used to store or do maintenance on motor vehicles. A tractor is a motor vehicle

 

[Squiner]

It also says solid fuel appliances shall not be installed in any garage. With garage defined as a space used to store or do maintenance on motor vehicles. A tractor is a motor vehicle

The DOT ( CFR) and NHTSA does not consider tractors and other farm vehicles as motor vehicles. Their road use is incidental to their intended purpose.

 

[bholler]

The DOT ( CFR) and NHTSA does not consider tractors and other farm vehicles as motor vehicles. Their road use is incidental to their intended purpose.

Ok but they are farm vehicles correct? And they have internal combustion engines correct?

If you ever have to file a claim do you want to rely on that argument to have the damages paid for?

I am not making any judgment call here. I have a clear automotive shop with a woodstove in it. But I am fully aware that if I ever had to make a claim involving that it would be denied

 

[Squiner]

Ok but they are farm vehicles correct? And they have internal combustion engines correct?

If you ever have to file a claim do you want to rely on that argument to have the damages paid for?

I am not making any judgment call here. I have a clear automotive shop with a woodstove in it. But I am fully aware that if I ever had to make a claim involving that it would be denied

I completely understand your point and no I wouldn’t want to have to argue that point. But what really comes into play is what the insurer requires. I spoke with Farmers insurance today and they will insure with my setup. They had no restrictions other than it had to be 18” above the finished floor and it has to be a wood stove. Don’t really understand that but whatever, works for me. Sounds like with that they are assuming the potential for heavy flammable gases.

Just because the NFPA exists doesn’t mean it applies here. My County issued me a permit and they didn’t adopt the NFPA standard as far as I could tell. They follow the 2018 IBC and I reviewed the ECodes online. I have no idea if insurance companies adopt consensus standards. If I ask their heads will probably soon spin, at least a sales agents lol.

Update: so a quick search reveals insurance companies do adopt NFPA standards. I need to ask specifically what the restrictions will be in writing. The sales agents are shockingly ignorant to their own companies policies. I guess it’s in the fine print somewhere and when theirs a claim their lawyers pull the details out. Wish they were more transparent but guess that doesn’t get them policies…

 

[bholler]

I completely understand your point and no I wouldn’t want to have to argue that point. But what really comes into play is what the insurer requires. I spoke with Farmers insurance today and they will insure with my setup. They had no restrictions other than it had to be 18” above the finished floor and it has to be a wood stove. Don’t really understand that but whatever, works for me. Sounds like with that they are assuming the potential for heavy flammable gases.

Just because the NFPA exists doesn’t mean it applies here. My County issued me a permit and they didn’t adopt the NFPA standard as far as I could tell. They follow the 2018 IBC and I reviewed the ECodes online. I have no idea if insurance companies adopt consensus standards. If I ask their heads will probably soon spin, at least a sales agents lol.

Update: so a quick search reveals insurance companies do adopt NFPA standards. I need to ask specifically what the restrictions will be in writing. The sales agents are shockingly ignorant to their own companies policies. I guess it’s in the fine print somewhere and when theirs a claim their lawyers pull the details out. Wish they were more transparent but guess that doesn’t get them policies…

Yes all of Maryland follows nfpa. And if you are only dealing with an agent you need to make sure they actually check with the underwriter. The agent is simply a salesman and is interested in keeping their customers happy. But they are not the ones who will handle it if you need to make a claim.