How much variability in a cord of wood?

[lnh62]

This past summer I purchased two cords of hardwood (delivered). After the truck dumped the wood I said to the driver, "That's two cords?" He said absolutely, and drove off with my check. Not having vast experience buying firewood, I felt like it was a bit light, but didn't really have grounds to question the driver.

The wood then sat in a pile exposed to the sun and wind for the past 4 months (which I'd cover when it rained, and uncover otherwise). I finally built that wood storage lean-to I've been talking about for years, and finally stacked the wood. It stacked up as 1.5 cords, not even close to 2 cords. I know that as the wood additionally dried over the past 4 months it certainly shrunk a little bit, but I can't believe it would have reduced in volume by 25%. I wouldn't expect that when buying 2 cords you'd exactly get that, but I feel this much shortage is way too much. I believe legally a cord is the volume at it's first stacking, so the delivered volume could be less if it was "first stacked" while green. How much variability should you expect in buying a cord of wood. I will call the seller, but I highly doubt they will supply the shorted amount. At the very least (assuming no action from the vendor), I'll file a report with the local BBB.

 

[nshif]

2 cords of wood does NOT shrink to 1.5 cords in 4 months or for that mater in years. If you are measuring correctly you got shorted. there is probably not much you can do about it other then find another supplier.

 

[ozarkjeep]

thats pretty common when you buy firewood.

I recall once back in the mid 1980s, my father having a 'discussion' with a man who brought a "cord" of wood to sell us.
Dad looked at the wood stacked in the truck bed, and told the guy it wasnt a cord, the guy said " sure it is, lets stack it and Ill show you!"

dad helped him unload it all, then pulled a tape measure on it, and was really nice to the guy, dad even helped him load it back up!
haha

http://www.canren.gc.ca/prod_serv/index.asp?CaId=161&PgId=857

this website shows a cord as 128 cubic feet, 4 feet tall, by 4 feet deep, by 8 feet long.

know before you buy next time, I would for sure pass the word along, or contact the BBB after giving the seller an oppurtunity to make the shortage right.

around here, wood is usually sold as a rick, which I belelive is half of a cord.
( about a full sized truck bed)

 

[Roospike]

Seasoned wood buying by the cord is 2 cords , maybe 2.xx if your lucky but nothing less than 2 128cf stacks (256cf)

Buying green unseasoned 2 cords is still 2 cords 128cf x 2 ( 256cf ) when delivered but can and will shrink when it does season ...... not by 1/2 a cord tho.

 

[NWfuel]

I bet if you leave anything around for 4 months is will get carried away.
Thomas

 

[bruce56bb]

you don't live around st. louis do you? i've heard they use metric tapes measures or something to measure cords there.

 

[elkimmeg]

Bruce I'm still laughing good one this guy has the same woodman Mo has. Me, I would not sit pat. I would demand the make up wood . If you let him get away with it ,surely he will do the same to others. I had a situation where I sold loam to a company and they only credited me for 6 yards for my Mac dump truck. Well I ran short and had to purchase loam Same dump truch they charged me for 8 yards . Imagine the look I got when 30,000 previous yards were involved. I broght in a stack of receits where they paid for 6 yards My dump truck is a 6 to 8 yard capacity. I told them I would gladly pay them for 8 yards if they paid be for the same 8 I delivered this equated to them owing mw $16,000 more money. funny how things work out

 

[lnh62]

I bet if you leave anything around for 4 months is will get carried away.
Thomas

We do have a family of beavers who have taken up residence at the back of our property, but they go after other wood, not the seasoned firewood. Not worried about firewood theft around here.

I will call them tomorrow, but doubt they will do anything. Would like to be suprised. Besides the BBB the options seem pretty limited. About all you can do is make yourself a thorn in their side. Could file a report with the state Attorney General's office (which will only result in action if there are LOTS of complaints). Could file in small claims court. Maybe get one of the local TV stations interested in doing one of those "Consumer Beware" segments on the local news. Angie's List also has "Firewood" as a category they track.

 

[mtarbert]

You may want to contact you Department of Ag. I know in Maryland all sellers of firewood must be licensed with the Dept of Ag and sell wood by a fraction of a cord (no pickup loads) and give a reciept stating the size and species. I think that is why here wood suppliers charge 50 dollars for stacking

 

[Firewoodguy.com]

This past summer I purchased two cords of hardwood (delivered). After the truck dumped the wood I said to the driver, "That's two cords?" He said absolutely, and drove off with my check. Not having vast experience buying firewood, I felt like it was a bit light, but didn't really have grounds to question the driver.

The wood then sat in a pile exposed to the sun and wind for the past 4 months (which I'd cover when it rained, and uncover otherwise). I finally built that wood storage lean-to I've been talking about for years, and finally stacked the wood. It stacked up as 1.5 cords, not even close to 2 cords. I know that as the wood additionally dried over the past 4 months it certainly shrunk a little bit, but I can't believe it would have reduced in volume by 25%. I wouldn't expect that when buying 2 cords you'd exactly get that, but I feel this much shortage is way too much. I believe legally a cord is the volume at it's first stacking, so the delivered volume could be less if it was "first stacked" while green. How much variability should you expect in buying a cord of wood. I will call the seller, but I highly doubt they will supply the shorted amount. At the very least (assuming no action from the vendor), I'll file a report with the local BBB.

What state or town are you in ?

 

[johnsopi]

I have wondered about the whole buying wood thing. Unless you trust the seller or oversee the loading and unloading it is hard to know how much wood you have until it is stacked. By that time the seller is gone,and has your money.If it is short they are not going to own up to it because then they would be emitting wrong doing. I guess knowing the seller is the best way to buy wood
or going out and looking at the wood before the deliver it.

 

[hardwood715]

How much variability in a cord of wood?

difference between night and day! This tree guy to that tree guy! Unbelievable how they make some tape measures shorther than others. Worse part is when your showing your buddy the great deal you got on your newly dumped load of firewood, at least he tried choking back the laughter,,,,that trend again

 

[coldinnj]

Here is a firewood calculator:
Easy way to figure out your wood pile size.
http://www.state.me.us/ag/firewood.html
BTW same problem with coal deliveries. After some shortings on deliveries. Dealertreid telling me some bull about the coal size differences. Finally after proving the bull and showing I was ready to take action. I recieved 2 tons "free".
Kind of like the old "butcher with his thumb on the scale" idea.

 

[wahoowad]

I feel you should have stacked and measured it right away. 4 months is too much time to go by, even though I believe things happened as you say. I'm the first to put my foot up someone's anus who tries to cheat me, but you need to hold them accountable more or less around the time of your business transaction. A well meaning call to him by you is not out of the question, it gives him a chance to earn your future business and maybe additional goodwill with others.

 

[NWfuel]

This happened to me once in 29 years of selling cordwood. I delivered 1 full cord of 24" Dry Fir to a guy and dumped in driveway.

3 weeks later he calls and said he just stacked it. He claims it was short by 1/4 cord. I asked him for his measurements and he gave them to me. He was short!

I loaded the cord, we guarantee 135 cu ft to our cords, it is premeasured on pallets. It did not blow out of the truck.
BUT I told him I would drop off the shortage within a week when I am back in the neigborhood.

The following year I saw his order come up again. I called him and told him would not be delivering to that address again.

Thomas

 

[lnh62]

What state or town are you in ?

I'm in Sudbury, MA (25 miles west of Boston). Seems many sellers only have a 15 mile radius as a delivery area.

I feel you should have stacked and measured it right away. 4 months is too much time to go by, even though I believe things happened as you say. I'm the first to put my foot up someone's anus who tries to cheat me, but you need to hold them accountable more or less around the time of your business transaction. A well meaning call to him by you is not out of the question, it gives him a chance to earn your future business and maybe additional goodwill with others.

I agree with you. If it wasn't for my notion to build the lean-to, I would have stacked it right away. Certainly the elapsed time since the transaction doesn't work in my favor.

To wear a sellers shoes for a moment...

How do they know you haven't burnt a bunch, or split some off to a neighbor? Even if it's stacked right away the seller couldn't be sure a honest buyer is at play. The only sure thing is the post above that said the seller has to stack it off the truck (for a fee).

In this case I'm not trying to cheat the seller by any stretch of the imagination. I called the company this morning and spoke with the office person. I'm told someone will call me back latter.

 

[coldinnj]

Back to a previous time and culture. Trust No One.
You might not trust the seller.
The seller might not trust you.
Problem is very simple. If you are honest. If you are positive no one made off with your wood.
If you contact the seller and nicely talk about the problem. If all the above is true then the seller would know what controls he puts on checking his outgoing loads and whether or not there is the possibility of error.
Then you have a solution because if all the above is true and the seller does not acknowledge his possibility of fault then do not trust the seller. I am not perfect. When I sell a product to a customer it goes through intense quality controls and inspections. However if a customer were to contact me with a "shortage" I would look into it. If I immediately take a stance that we never make a mistake we would be showing to have bad customer service and irresponsibility.
Yes as others said and of course you know it puts you in a difficult position as the load was not checked immediately. BUT some delivery guys know and count on this too.

 

[par38lamp]

you don't live around st. louis do you? i've heard they use metric tapes measures or something to measure cords there.

Hmm. I live in St. Louis, and never heard of that. LOL.

 

[treeman08]

One part of the measurement that has not been mentioned here is how tight the wood is stacked.
Are there any gaps in the stack? Depending on how it is stacked can make a big diffrence, but 25% is a lot of gaps.
I have been told that a cord is 4 X 4 X 8 or 128 cubic feet with it stacked so that "a Squirrel to get through the cracks, but not the cat that is chasing it."
Anyone heard that saying, or any other requirements?

 

[Andre B.]

Here is some info on what a legal cord is. It is from Canada but I think the definitions are much the same in the US.
http://www.gov.ns.ca/natr/publications/energy/buyfirewood.pdf
_____________
Andre' B.

 

[lnh62]

One part of the measurement that has not been mentioned here is how tight the wood is stacked.
Are there any gaps in the stack? Depending on how it is stacked can make a big diffrence, but 25% is a lot of gaps.
I have been told that a cord is 4 X 4 X 8 or 128 cubic feet with it stacked so that "a Squirrel to get through the cracks, but not the cat that is chasing it."
Anyone heard that saying, or any other requirements?

Stacking variability is the reason I originally said that I only expected approximately 2 cords. I'd guess if you stack wood several times you will get slightly different results although it's probably in the range of +- 2%. The Canadian legal standard seems to imply the stacking is "tight". Stacking so a squirrel can get through sounds a bit on the loose side.

 

[[email protected]]

Most trucks ,unless its a large large dump , can't hold two cords

 

[lnh62]

To report back...

I sent a registered mail letter to the vendor outlining the problem as they never returned my phone calls. Included in the letter were pictures of the stacked wood with dimensions of each pile. Three weeks went by without a response.

Then filed a complaint with the local BBB, and received a response from the vendor within 3 days outlining a resolution where they will refund on a pro-rated basis for the shortage (which was my suggested resolution). The money isn't in the bank yet, but it's does look promising. Obviously I won't be ordering firewood from them anymore, and I'm sure the feeling is mutual. If it was close I wouldn't have bothered, but at best the 2 cord delivery was 1.3 cords.

 

[Roospike]

Good job. Tho you wont be buying from this seller any longer hopefully things will change and the future buyers would thank you.

There is a big difference from 2 cords to 1.3