Installation Estimate

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MacinJosh

Feeling the Heat
Mar 4, 2015
310
Crestwood, KY
Hey guys,

I received a quote for both a BK King and Princess install along with Class A Chimney tear down and replacement. Need some input and feedback from installers or anyone else that has had similar work done. The quotes are fairly steep and I just want to make sure they're on par with industry norms before I shell out that kind of money. I know it's an investment that will eventually pay for itself but I'd like to cover my bases before pulling the trigger. I'd love to do some or all of the work myself but I just don't have the time right now and I'd rather pay someone who knows what they're doing and have it done quickly.

Any help/insight is greatly appreciated. Cheers!
 

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Also, because of the clearance on the existing chimney, the installer said double wall would have to be used for the stove pipe. Not sure how much clearance stove pipe needs. Here are some recent photos after I tore the drywall out. The HVAC ductwork is getting rerouted soon.

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I recently had a Woodstock Ideal Steel stove installed for $3,000 in New England. I supplied the stove. My carpenter built the raised hearth and enclosed chase on 2nd floor. Everything else listed below was included in that price.

Two story, corner installation on 1st floor with chimney going straight up and out through the 8 on 12 pitch roof. Five feet of double wall stove pipe, plus 21 feet of stainless steel, insulated double wall Class A chimney (9' exposed above roof with bracing). Included outside air kit and all thimbles.


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It's nice that they detailed out the parts completely. There are several obvious human errors in the quotes. Compare the same silicone sealant price between the 2 quotes ($150.40 vs $21.90). And there is a huge disparity for the Ember King type 1 hearth board pricing between the two estimates. Neither price seems correct ($14.95 vs $477) $477 is too much for a simple type 1 pad. Also, the BK King estimate calls for two DVL chimney adapters when only can be used.

Single wall stove pipe requires 18" clearance, double-wall is typically 6". BK recommends using double-wall stove pipe to keep the flue gases hotter.
 
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It's nice that they detailed out the parts completely. There are several obvious human errors in the quotes. Compare the same silicone sealant price between the 2 quotes ($150.40 vs $21.90). And there is a huge disparity for the Ember King type 1 hearth board pricing between the two estimates. Neither price seems correct ($14.95 vs $477) $477 is too much for a simple type 1 pad. Also, the BK King estimate calls for two DVL chimney adapters when only can be used.

Single wall stove pipe requires 18" clearance, double-wall is typically 6". BK recommends using double-wall stove pipe to keep the flue gases hotter.

Thanks begreen. I agree with the errors you have pointed out. I emailed about the crazy difference in sealant. I did some Googling and the Ember King pad seems way over priced for as bare basic as it is. I went to Woodland Direct and for just a few dollars more you can get a MUCH nicer pad. As for the chimney adapters, is that just a typo? It says it’s a “kit” so the price should be what it is, right? Don’t think they are quoting me for two adapters but I can ask.

Good to know about the stove pipe. Since it sounds like I need it anyway, that’s a bonus. I would have thought you wanted single wall to get more heat off the stove pipe and not up the flue. But I presume hotter flue gases help prevent buildup?

So other than the human errors, does the cost of the stove and the piping seem reasonable? I thought $975 for labor was reasonable considering all they have to do to remove the old one.

Thanks again.
 
The 2 chimney adapters are listed in the King estimate, not part of a kit. There should be only one listed. The piping parts are all retail priced which is fair. They have the cost of running a business to cover.

You want the stove producing the heat, not the flue. Hotter flue gases keep creosote from condensing and improve draft.
 
Almost 20 years ago mine was around $4800 Stove, chimney and install. I did the hearth. The issue was they wanted to cut holes and make a snake out of the chimney. No way, stop. I became the chimney chase builder. They came back and stacked the chimney sections. If I had to do it again, I would do it myself.
 
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In order to tuck the parlor model into a corner like that it will also require side and rear heat shields. I’d strongly suggest you go with the ultra and the blowers. It’s cleaner looking and the blower is a very nice addition.
 
I was thinking aesthetically and to keep the stove further from the sliding door to place the stove in the corner at an angle facing towards the middle of the room. This would offset the stove from the flue. They have to use to 45’s to make it work and they’re still not sure they can because of the soffit. There’s minimum length before you can elbow I guess. The ceiling support box will already be low since it will go in the newly shaped soffit after the ductwork is moved. A straight stove pipe is an option but that moves the stove close to the sliding glass door and isn’t as aesthetically pleasing in my opinion. Would draft be an issue with 2 45’s from the stove to the flue? Thoughts?
 
In order to tuck the parlor model into a corner like that it will also require side and rear heat shields. I’d strongly suggest you go with the ultra and the blowers. It’s cleaner looking and the blower is a very nice addition.

Hey Webby, it’s been awhile. Thanks for chiming in. Can you elaborate? Can’t I just pull the parlor away from the corner until the distance between the back corners of the stove meet the clearance requirements to the combustible wall? I don’t need the stove super tucked back in.

Also, how does the ultra get around this? What’s different about it? Also, the parlor has a blower option as well, correct? I was going to see how the stove works without a blower to see if I need one. I’d love to be fully operational without needing electric for when the power goes out.
 
The ultra has the heat shields built into it, and the fans take the place of the shield on the back of the stove. You can use a rear shield in place of the blowers if you wanted. It will be pretty far out from the corner if you don’t want any additional heat shields.
 
I’m not sure right off hand the clearances. In a corner we’ve either installed the heat shields or most often it’s an ultra.
 
I was thinking aesthetically and to keep the stove further from the sliding door to place the stove in the corner at an angle facing towards the middle of the room. This would offset the stove from the flue. They have to use to 45’s to make it work and they’re still not sure they can because of the soffit. There’s minimum length before you can elbow I guess. The ceiling support box will already be low since it will go in the newly shaped soffit after the ductwork is moved. A straight stove pipe is an option but that moves the stove close to the sliding glass door and isn’t as aesthetically pleasing in my opinion. Would draft be an issue with 2 45’s from the stove to the flue? Thoughts?

Can anyone offer any advice on the proposed stove pipe with 2 45's? Can that create a draft issue?
 
I know it's an investment that will eventually pay for itself but I'd like to cover my bases before pulling the trigger.

I'm a little curious what sort of rough calculation you've performed to determine that the stove will pay for itself. Not saying you're wrong, but ~7k is a lot of money. Especially if you buy wood instead of scrounging, and if you have not yet bought other gear (chainsaw, splitter), it is going to take a long long time.
 
Can anyone offer any advice on the proposed stove pipe with 2 45's? Can that create a draft issue?
Probably not as long as the total flue system height is >16'.
 
I'm a little curious what sort of rough calculation you've performed to determine that the stove will pay for itself. Not saying you're wrong, but ~7k is a lot of money. Especially if you buy wood instead of scrounging, and if you have not yet bought other gear (chainsaw, splitter), it is going to take a long long time.
I’ll let the OP respond, of course, but I know that prior to getting our stove we ran our heat on fairly low due to cost. Once we got the stove, were able to have temps in the house that were higher than we would have done with the previous electric. When I’ve done some math, I’ve used this higher temp that the stove affords, and this quickens the time it takes to recoup costs.Even if buying wood, we would be saving a good deal annually. Even at 7k, the stove wound have paid for itself in a timeframe that was reasonable, not 2 years but not a lifetime neither.
 
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I'm a little curious what sort of rough calculation you've performed to determine that the stove will pay for itself. Not saying you're wrong, but ~7k is a lot of money. Especially if you buy wood instead of scrounging, and if you have not yet bought other gear (chainsaw, splitter), it is going to take a long long time.

Haha, I'll admit it's a bit crude, but I'm an electrical engineer so I tend to nerd out on these things. I have an advanced electric meter that allows me to look at my daily energy usage (up to a 15 minute average interval). Assuming normal energy use like lights, stove, dryer, etc. are fairly constant and don't fluctuate with the weather, I compared winter months vs shoulder months when my heat pump and furnace rarely ran. I attribute that difference in cost to heating costs. Again, I know it's a crude calculation. I then multiplied that by the number of winter months in my region and divided that into ~7K to get a rough ROI. Ignoring factors such as fuel for saws, etc. I estimate 7-8 years.

As for equipment, I'm set there. I have 3 Stihls, a 35 ton splitter, PPE, mauls, axes, etc. I live on 7 acres of dense woods and the Ash Borer has made sure I have a steady supply of free wood. I have about 6-7 full cords split, covered, dry, and ready to burn.
 
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I'm a little curious what sort of rough calculation you've performed to determine that the stove will pay for itself. Not saying you're wrong, but ~7k is a lot of money. Especially if you buy wood instead of scrounging, and if you have not yet bought other gear (chainsaw, splitter), it is going to take a long long time.

My setup + install was around the same. A lot of money, yes...for sure. The difference is that now my natural gas bill isn't $300+ during the winter months, coupled with my downstairs struggling to stay over 55 (rest of the house at 67-68) prior to the stove being down there. Even ignoring the eventual ROI which I know I will get fairly quick in my case, it's nice having a house that's actually comfortable now. Split levels are a pain. You're right though regarding buying wood vs scrounging, I'm not sure I would've gone the stove route if I wasn't able to scrounge.
 
I’ll let the OP respond, of course, but I know that prior to getting our stove we ran our heat on fairly low due to cost. Once we got the stove, were able to have temps in the house that were higher than we would have done with the previous electric. When I’ve done some math, I’ve used this higher temp that the stove affords, and this quickens the time it takes to recoup costs.Even if buying wood, we would be saving a good deal annually. Even at 7k, the stove wound have paid for itself in a timeframe that was reasonable, not 2 years but not a lifetime neither.

I'm in the same boat - formerly electric heat paying CT exhorbitant electric rates, used to be cold all the time. It definitely pays off for a lot of people, but not everyone. I just wanted to point it out. There is a lot of enthusiasm for wood stoves on hearth.com of course... but the finances don't work out for everyone. An extreme example (but one that I've encountered) would be someone whose alternative heat source is natural gas (cheap), who only burns on weekends, and who buys wood instead of scrounging. In that position, you're probably not making your money back.
 
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Haha, I'll admit it's a bit crude, but I'm an electrical engineer so I tend to nerd out on these things. I have an advanced electric meter that allows me to look at my daily energy usage (up to a 15 minute average interval). Assuming normal energy use like lights, stove, dryer, etc. are fairly constant and don't fluctuate with the weather, I compared winter months vs shoulder months when my heat pump and furnace rarely ran. I attribute that difference in cost to heating costs. Again, I know it's a crude calculation. I then multiplied that by the number of winter months in my region and divided that into ~7K to get a rough ROI. Ignoring factors such as fuel for saws, etc. I estimate 7-8 years.

As for equipment, I'm set there. I have 3 Stihls, a 35 ton splitter, PPE, mauls, axes, etc. I live on 7 acres of dense woods and the Ash Borer has made sure I have a steady supply of free wood. I have about 6-7 full cords split, covered, dry, and ready to burn.

Sounds like you've got it more than figured out!
 
What manufacturer are they using for the install? Those prices in general seem more expensive than they otherwise should be.

I'm also not seeing any double wall stove pipe on the princess quote.

$75 dollars for a tube of silicone???

I'd shop around for quotes at the very least.
 
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