Insulated Liner

[Warfox]

Hello all.

In my quest for a wood insert I initially shied away from catalytic’s, but have since changed my mind. Specifically, I’m looking at the Blaze King Princess insert for its long burn times, and ability to really dial it down low. I do have multiple cords of wood seasoned 3 years + at this point.

My local Blaze King dealer states that 98% of their installs up here in my area of Massachusetts are no n-insulated, but that I’m welcome to request one.

I’ve read here that insulated liners are important as well as block off plates( I requested a metal block off plate as well).

How worried should I be that they don’t recommend an insulated liner? How necessary are they?

 

[stoveliker]

If you run low, the flue gases will have a very low temperature. There's not much heat left in them, but they should stay above 212 F (best 250 or so...) to avoid condensation and thus creosote formation.

So it is important to keep as much of the heat as possible in the flue, so insulation is important.
Even more so if the chimney is on an outside wall.

Moreover if your chimney doesn't have 2" clearance from the outside of its brick to any combustible (or 1" for an outside chimney), code and safety requires an insulated liner.

Do request an insulated liner.

 

[Ctwoodtick]

Insulate it for sure. What that dealer said reflects they’ve been neglecting code and basic safety protocol.

 

[Warfox]

Thank you so much for the informative replies - this forum is a gem.

Can anyone drop a link to the specific type of liner that I should request for the Princess insert install? It’s a single story exterior chimney, and a prior chimney company listed in their quote for install:

- a 6” x 15’ stainless steel liner(also no mentions of insulation)

- “snout & tee”

- “ 6” stove adapter + 90 degree elbow

I really want to ensure this is installed properly.

 

[bholler]

Thank you so much for the informative replies - this forum is a gem.

Can anyone drop a link to the specific type of liner that I should request for the Princess insert install? It’s a single story exterior chimney, and a prior chimney company listed in their quote for install:

- a 6” x 15’ stainless steel liner(also no mentions of insulation)

- “snout & tee”

- “ 6” stove adapter + 90 degree elbow

I really want to ensure this is installed properly.

Uh why are they using a tee and elbow for an insert?

 

[stoveliker]

Also, at 15' it may work (it's the minimum required by BK), but there is a chance that it will work less well when it's warm out (50 or so) and you are trying to go as low as possible.

It's good to go ahead but be aware that there is a finite chance of the above.

 

[EbS-P]

What size is the existing chimney?

 

[stoveliker]

Cross section that is, not height?
(I presume)

 

[Warfox]

What size is the existing chimney?

I checked and it is indeed 15’ . Which specific type of liner should I request? A pre-insulated correct ?

 

[stoveliker]

Pre insulated is easiest but a diy insulation kit plus liner is good too.

Note there are different qualities of liner, some last longer than others. I don't know enough; ebs-p likely will, or bholler for sure.

 

[EbS-P]

Pre insulated is easiest but a diy insulation kit plus liner is good too.

Note there are different qualities of liner, some last longer than others. I don't know enough; ebs-p likely will, or bholler for sure.

They don’t sell heavyweight pre insulated. Don’t get smooth or triple wall they are junk.

Check the inside dimensions of your current chimney, LxW.
It’s nearly impossible to get a round 6” insualted liner down an 8”x8” hole.

 

[bholler]

I am still wondering why they are quoting a tee and elbow for an insert

 

[Warfox]

I am still wondering why they are quoting a tee and elbow for an insert

I don’t either.

For the flu tile best I can measure without getting on roof and removing the metal cap: 10in x 10in

But there is a metal damper that is 6” opening if lucky.

 

[stoveliker]

That should fit an insulated 6" easily.

 

[bholler]

I don’t either.

For the flu tile best I can measure without getting on roof and removing the metal cap: 10in x 10in

But there is a metal damper that is 6” opening if lucky.

It doesn't make any sense at all and that would make me doubt that they know what they are doing

 

[Warfox]

That Tee & 90 elbow were actually part of the quote from my chimney sweep company I used, don’t know what the Blaze King dealer installer wants to use exactly yet - he is coming for a site visit on Wednesday, and I’ll go over my concerns with him at that time.

 

[stoveliker]

If the chimney sweep company did not come out and measure for that quote, they may simply have made a mistake in their memory of your system, thinking you had a freestanding stove.

 

[Highbeam]

Or they quoted for a freestanding on the hearth stove vs. an insert. Do you have room to do a freestanding stove on the hearth? I sure am glad that I replaced my insert with a freestanding stove.

 

[Warfox]

Oh no, it’s an on paper in-house quote, which makes me (hopefully) doubt their 8 grand estimate for a partial chimney rebuild, too,

And no unfortunately I do not have room for a free standing, as the room is only 250sq ft and rear of couch would be too close.

 

[stoveliker]

chimney requirements will be the same for a freestanding and an insert - although the connection part will be different (if they had to demo part of the current fireplace to where the snout +90 is going to be, that'll be different for the insert).

Maybe it's time to put a picture of the location (inside and outside) in this thread?

 

[Warfox]

Here are some pictures…Chimney company wants 8600 to rebuild “from splash shelf up”.

 

[stoveliker]

That chimney doesn't look good from both the inside and the outside. But I don't know what getting it safe needs (rebuild or other) or what that would cost.

If the bottom pic is from the fireplace up, no T and/or 90 is needed. Just a liner.

 

[BKVP]

@bholler can give you a expert opinion. Of course not doing the inspection himself, the picture are all he has to go by.

Perhaps pouring a new reliner would help...not certain.

BKVP

 

[bholler]

Here are some pictures…Chimney company wants 8600 to rebuild “from splash shelf up”.

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Yes it definitely needs rebuilt atleast roofline up. I think.i would get other quotes though. Quoting a tee and elbow for an insert is a red flag. As is their use of the term splash shelf which simply is not the proper name for any part of a chimney.

 

[stoveliker]

Lol, don't you think that's the shelf where creosote is supposed to land?