interesting read....wood chips powering military base 24/7
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Spletz
Member
Very cool! Thanks for sharing it. I hope it becomes a trend. Once the military adapts such measures, technologies approve.
Spletz
Member
Ha! That was meant to be improve.Is that with a nod or the clapping of particles?
Dieselhead
Minister of Fire
Heres a school in CT that does the same:
http://www.centerbrook.com/project/hotchkiss_school_biomass_heating_facility
http://www.centerbrook.com/project/hotchkiss_school_biomass_heating_facility
Another point of view regarding this:
(broken link removed to http://climate-connections.org/2014/02/02/firewood-sellers-blame-fort-drum-biomass-plant-for-lumber-shortage/)
And another:
(broken link removed to http://www.wwnytv.com/news/local/Feedback-Firewood-Shortage-In-North-Country-277659601.html)
(broken link removed to http://climate-connections.org/2014/02/02/firewood-sellers-blame-fort-drum-biomass-plant-for-lumber-shortage/)
And another:
(broken link removed to http://www.wwnytv.com/news/local/Feedback-Firewood-Shortage-In-North-Country-277659601.html)
Batman
Member
What made the project was that there was an existing district heating system in place to supply heat to the facility and a most of the infrastructure in place to burn biomass. So most of the big money was spent in the past and all the project did was modify the boiler from coal to wood. The state capital complex in Montpelier VT has had a wood fired district heating system and recently has expanded to supply the downtown area of Montpelier.
Harman p-68a
Member
I live less than 10 miles from Fort Drum and try and get some Firewood around here now
Better bring your checkbook. . It has also affected the pellets supply and price . So as some of us locals say just another benefit of having the base around ..
Better bring your checkbook. . It has also affected the pellets supply and price . So as some of us locals say just another benefit of having the base around ..
Interesting read. We too employ a biomass boiler similar to the one in my Avitar to provide low pressure wet steam for our industrial manifacturing operation and keep the municipal tree crews in Toledo, Ohio and South East Michigan out of landfills and dumping at our facility.
It's a Hurst Biomass Scotchback firetube boiler btw, 250 horsepower. www.hurstboiler.com Basically no stack emissions with the on site bag house and it's stratified gasification. You can smell the wood burning but you can't see where, it burns that clean. Completely computer controlled.
It's a Hurst Biomass Scotchback firetube boiler btw, 250 horsepower. www.hurstboiler.com Basically no stack emissions with the on site bag house and it's stratified gasification. You can smell the wood burning but you can't see where, it burns that clean. Completely computer controlled.
Bret Chase
Minister of Fire
Bret Chase
Minister of Fire
In Northern New England, we've got 12 biomass plants in ME and 6 in NH... A couple of them are 50MW class plants.
They burn an astonishing amount of what is basically garbage... ground up stumps, etc all of it green.
I haven't been able to quickly find a % of generation... but it's quite a bit more than 1.4% I'd say
I can see taxing entities heating with pellets in biomass boilers because there is really no monetray concern with spending tax derivived funds (pellets are a very inefficient means of heating cost wise on a large scale). Wood chips and landfill biomass are much more economical but tax supported entities don't give a hoot...it's not their money, it's yours.
If we ran our biomass boiler on processed pellets it would be instantly a profit eater. landfill fodder isn't, at all.
If we ran our biomass boiler on processed pellets it would be instantly a profit eater. landfill fodder isn't, at all.
I work with several of the large biomass power generating plants in the region . The only reason they are still running are the incentives for renewables. They typical size is normally smaller in the 20 to 30 MW range as they need to run off fuel from close by the plant. Once the fuel has to be trucked much more than 50 miles, the heating value of the diesel used to move it exceeds the heating value of the wood. Of course the incentives don't care so there are times when the larger plants are indirectly fueled by diesel.
Exactly correct. But then it's a 'green inititative' thing or a 'feel good' thing. Besides, subsidized is taxpayer money and the government shows no fiscal responsibility with money thats not their's.......
Just like corn alcohol for gasoline additive. E-Plants cannot survive without being subsidized by the government and/or tax incentives. Neither E-plants not biofuel electrical generation or heating schools and businesses is economically practical from a net neutral aspect. They all rely on government money or tax breaks to survive. People need to wake up and smell the roses...porobably won't, after all, it's 'green'. Just ask Al Gore.....
How did you make those calculations? Let's say a truck transports 5 ton of woodchips. That's 10,000 lb. At 7000 usable BTU per pound I get 70 million BTU. 1 gallon of diesel has 140,000 BTU. That would mean the truck would need more than 500 gallons of diesel to drive the chips around. I guess that truck would need to travel a LOT more than 50 miles to exceed the BTU in the chips.
There is more to a truck than just diesel fuel. Drivers wages, cost of purchasing the truck and/or trailer, road use tax, permits,upkeep like tires and oil, Federal excise tax, but then you just put gas in your car and drive it with no upkeep...right?
Greenies live in glass houses......
Greenies live in glass houses......
And oil needs to be explored, drilled, piped, shipped, refined, trucked around including permits, taxes, spill clean-up cost etc. So how different is it really? And a good part of that money goes abroad. 
Woodchips do at least provide income to American workers. And wood actually grows on trees, unlike oil.
Woodchips do at least provide income to American workers. And wood actually grows on trees, unlike oil.
And oil needs to be explored, drilled, piped, shipped, refined, trucked around including permits, taxes, spill clean-up cost etc. So how different is it really? And a good part of that money goes abroad.
Woodchips do at least provide income to American workers. And wood actually grows on trees, unlike oil.
Wrong, oil did grow (from) trees, millions of years ago. Far as a good part of the money goes abroad statement, thats becoming less and less as time goes on and as we become a net exporter instead of a net importer.
Tell you want I know... If we didn't get free biomass (wood chips) to run out plant boiler (pictured in my avitar), we'd shut it down and have in the past and ran NG. The only way it's a profit maker is when the fuel is free. When we can't get it, it's cold as the winter. And that don't include the million five startup and construction cost either. Thats just day-to day operation.
Biomass boilers aren't viable unless the fuel source is free or almost free. You can think they are and the gummit will tell you they are but they aren't (unless of course you don't pay the tarrif and have the taxpayers paying it), then, they are the best thing since sliced bread.
Woodchips might provide income for American workers but, there are a helluva lot more American workers working in refineries and oil fields than workers processing wood chips.... Be real.
Not that I am a fan of corn based ethanol it is not a very green source of energy, but likewise big oil has been deeply subsidized for a long time too. Just ask Rex Tillerson.Exactly correct. But then it's a 'green inititative' thing or a 'feel good' thing. Besides, subsidized is taxpayer money and the government shows no fiscal responsibility with money thats not their's.......
Just like corn alcohol for gasoline additive. E-Plants cannot survive without being subsidized by the government and/or tax incentives. Neither E-plants not biofuel electrical generation or heating schools and businesses is economically practical from a net neutral aspect. They all rely on government money or tax breaks to survive. People need to wake up and smell the roses...porobably won't, after all, it's 'green'. Just ask Al Gore.....
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