Lining Chimney 10-3-2 Rule Problem and Other Questions

[pen]

Here's a peek at my chimney and thimble

(see pictures below)


I have a few questions about lining it. I am choosing to line it because I know there are a few tiles w/ cracks and another house in the area burnt last night from a chimney fire. I am too proactive to let things go any longer with a clear conscience.

1. The stove I run is an englander 30 w/ 6in outlet. My clay tiles measure 7 1/4 by 7 1/4 inside. Is that room for a 6 in flex liner typically? Or should I consider a 5.5 in flex liner?

2. The chimney does not follow the 10-3-2 rule. I don't want to simply slap in the liner and still have a chimney that isn't tall enough. What sort of options do I have for raising the chimney about 3 feet? (other than the obvious of having to use brick and raise the chimney)

3. The crock / thimble has an 8 in diameter. Is it standard to just use a chisel and break up the tile flue liner that stops my stove pipe from going too far into the flu so that I can get the flex liner to make the bend? I am figuring the liner will have to bend here to make some sort of connection to the stove pipe as there is not room for a T of any sort.

4. Currently, I go from 6 in to 8 in right at the thimble. this works great as I can get a cover plate to fill in the gap around that area. What will I use to give this a finished look w/ the whole thing is 5.5 or 6 inches?

5. Would I consider trying to add some sort of insulation around this liner once added? Like vermiculite? Would there be room, would this be necessary?


I realize there are a lot of questions posed here. I appreciate anyone's help w/ anyone of these concerns.

Thanks,

pen

 

[pen]

Here are the rest of the pics

 

[Wet1]

Pen,

I have a 35' chimney which I relined, the I.D. on my tiles is 7"x7". I ended up using a 6" liner. I didn't have any major problems with it going down the chimney, but I did fabricate a cone for the end of the liner which I also had an eyelet to attach a rope to (for a helper to pull from from the bottom). I have a slight jog at the bottom, and that was a little concerning, but it made it through with a little twisting and work. I want to say the O.D. on the liner is about 6 3/8".

With your tight tiles, you're not going to be able to wrap the liner (I couldn't either), even if you went with a 5.5". I bought some perlite off ebay and will be pouring that down around my liner in the near future. I didn't want to use any permanent mix that could potentially be a major PITA should it even need to come out... so perlite/vermiculite was the obvious solution. You just need to make sure the bottom is sealed so the particles don't spill out.

Looking at your pictures, I'd remove the crown and add a few courses of bricks to gain a little height. You can buy flue extenders, but I think they look like crap, plus brick is fairly cheap and easy lay.

They sell covers to cover your thimble hole.

 

[mellow]

If you want to be sure about your chimney having cracked tiles have a sweep come by with a camera, they can check out every inch of your chimney tiles and tell you if you need a liner or not, OR, you could just buy a 6 inch liner and insulation and call it a day (I fit my 6" liner with .5 inch wrapped insulation in a 6.75" chimney). I am not sure if you could flex liner into that tight of a spot to come through your existing thimble, you might need to figure out how to get a T in there, maybe cut out bricks on other side of chimney and install a clean out door for more access?

 

[Wet1]

You're not going to be able to pull the flex through that thimble. You'll need to attach the tee to the liner before sinking it down the chimney, and then attach the snout through the thimble hole... that is what I had to do anyway.

 

[pen]

You're not going to be able to pull the flex through that thimble. You'll need to attach the tee to the liner before sinking it down the chimney, and then attach the snout through the thimble hole... that is what I had to do anyway.

Apparently the T's are quite small then in stature? I wasn't sure if they would have a diameter of greater than 7inches or not.

pen

 

[oconnor]

You're not going to be able to pull the flex through that thimble. You'll need to attach the tee to the liner before sinking it down the chimney, and then attach the snout through the thimble hole... that is what I had to do anyway.

When you do this, how do you get at the cleanout? Is there some sort of removable base that you have to reach up and remove when cleaning, and then reinstall when done? I have an insert stove, so it isn't an issue for me, but I am curious - lots of stove folks ask me about it, and I haven't an answer for them yet.

 

[Wet1]

The tee is about 6. 3/8" at its wides point by about 16" or so. There's an adapter that attaches the flex to the tee, and I think it's right at 6.5", which I think was the widest part of my liner.

I bought my kit from "TheHeatElement" here on the board. Give him a shout, he's very reasonable, ships very fast, and very knowledgeable about his products. Send him a PM and I'm sure he'll take care of all your liner needs.

 

[Wet1]

You're not going to be able to pull the flex through that thimble. You'll need to attach the tee to the liner before sinking it down the chimney, and then attach the snout through the thimble hole... that is what I had to do anyway.

When you do this, how do you get at the cleanout? Is there some sort of removable base that you have to reach up and remove when cleaning, and then reinstall when done? I have an insert stove, so it isn't an issue for me, but I am curious - lots of stove folks ask me about it, and I haven't an answer for them yet.

Yes, there's a cap at the base of the tee. You can either clean it through the snout or take off the removable cap at the base of the tee (mine attaches with three screws). For me it's easier to go through the snout as my access to the bottom of the tee is fairly limited. I could put in an access to the cap if I needed to, but I haven't found a real need for doing this.

 

[BrotherBart]

What size is that hole in the flue tile at the back of the thimble Pen?

 

[pen]

What size is that hole in the flue tile at the back of the thimble Pen?

Pretty much 6 inches if memory serves. That's why I was wondering if I would probably just have to take a bar and bust the lip off of it so that it was 8 inches like the crock

pen

 

[pen]

Pen,

Looking at your pictures, I'd remove the crown and add a few courses of bricks to gain a little height. You can buy flue extenders, but I think they look like crap, plus brick is fairly cheap and easy lay.

They sell covers to cover your thimble hole.

I did the brick that's seen in the thimble. When it comes to brick work, I can do it, but I hate it. Especially this time of year.

I was kind of afraid of that. Plus I haven't enough brick that matches around to finish it.

Man I wish I had the money this summer to do this. I blew my wad on materials for a new roof and the new Englander. Now that it looks like i've got the old fisher sold, I want to use that money for the liner. Putting the liner in during the winter would have been a part-of-a-day job. Brick work included, now things aren't so nice and easy.

That's life!

pen

 

[BrotherBart]

You could do something list this for the time being, or contact the web master and see if he has any Extend-A-Flues left.

http://www.woodlanddirect.com/Chimney/Chimney-Liner-Parts/Flue-Extender

 

[WNCburner]

Pen- I'm dealing with a chimney extension issue myself. I'm not too excited about about a rock and mortar extension, so I'm going to add a chimney pot to the top of the flue, and drop an insulated liner down. The ones I'm considering are antique English clay chimney pots that I found at a local antiques dealer. There are a few dealers online that you can use to get an idea of what's available...not sure that they would look right with your house or not. I need to add four or five feet to my chimney, and setting one pot in mortar was a better option for me than the other options I explored(plus the wife acceptance factor was highest). The pots available at my local store seemed to run about $100 per foot (24" pots around $200, etc.) they had sizes from 18" to about 6'. I'll second the idea of contacting "TheHeatElement". I've been hounding him myself with questions about using his products for my project, and he has been very helpful. The antiques dealer here has a website and will ship, PM me if you want more info. May be another option for you at the least.

 

[pen]

You could do something list this for the time being, or contact the web master and see if he has any Extend-A-Flues left.

http://www.woodlanddirect.com/Chimney/Chimney-Liner-Parts/Flue-Extender

That stainless flu extender might do the trick. 18 inches of height would be close to what I'd need. It may not look as good as having the correct masonry chimney, but I don't think it'd look any worse than having a few feet of brick work that doesn't match either.

pen