I'm baaaaack. With the help from others on this forum, and due to my clearance restraints, I've narrowed it down to the 2 inserts in this threads title. If you got a minute I'd be interested in anyone's pro, cons and experiences with these manufacturers and more specifically, these models. There is one possible wood stove in the running, the Vista, by PE that has a height of 27 3/4 and my FP opening is 27 5/8 (the ceiling inside is 30+) Also if I decide on the stove, where can I find the clearances when putting it into the FP or is this not advisable, for efficiency or other reasons? I've noticed I haven't seen many photos where this is done. Thanks again for your interest and opinions..
Lopi Answer insert vs PE Vista insert
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If you are putting it in a fireplace, go with an insert. The blower will get the heat out into the room and will be mounted on the front for easier servicing.
Grisu
Minister of Fire
Why do you say the Vista has a height of 27"? Does that include the clearance requirements to your trim? The insert itself is only 19.75" tall: http://pacificenergy.net/products/wood/inserts/vista-insert/
It's me again Grisu. The one with clearance issues. The vista stove is 27 3/4", but I think I'm leaning towards the inserts. I'm off by 2 3/4 with the Vista insert in height to my wood face (w mantle shield) and 1 1/4 below on the Answer by Lopi w /o a shield (not offered). I want to go with the Vista By PE. I believe you stated you burn the Super, happy with it? Hearth to 1" thick wood facing is 34". PE only gives me to mantle height (no mention of wood facing) of 18 1/2" (w shield) clearance, added to Vista firebox height of 18 5/16 ~ 36 1/4. That's a 33% reduction of distance vs with no shield. Which is pretty consistent with the literature I've been reading on units w and w/o shields. So if I applied that to the Lopi Answer clearance requirements with no option of shield, constructing my own, I'm thinking I can reach and even be below the requirements on that unit. Does that make sense? The lopi's box H is 20 3/4 w a clearance requirement of 12" which = 32 3/4, which is 1 1/4 below my wood facing. Again I think I'd like to go with the PE, but I don't know if they consider the wood facing as part of the mantle due to its combustability . And these salesmen around here don't seem to know much about the products. Hey Grisu, I appreciate your patience and interest in this. Don't mean to be so meticulous, it's just I want to do this right and not 1/2 a--ed.
Grisu
Minister of Fire
Yes, I remember and I missed that you were now looking at stoves, not inserts anymore. I am very happy with the PE Super insert as many other members here. If you can fit that one in it would be a great option. Almost its only weak point is the subpar manual. Your specific case may not be covered. I would give them a call to see if a combustible face trim has to obey the same clearance as a mantel and if a mantel shield is an allowable means to reduce that distance. Get their answer in writing for insurance and inspection purposes.
A few members here have the PA Vista and seem to like it although they get burn times of only 4 to 5 hours. That means someone needs to be in the house most of the time to feed it and every morning you need to start from a cold stove. I would highly recommend to look for an insert with a firebox of at least 2 cu ft. Is there anything about the Regency i2400 that I missed? Its clearances seem to be ok for your fireplace and with a 2.3 cu ft firebox it would be a much better choice.
A few members here have the PA Vista and seem to like it although they get burn times of only 4 to 5 hours. That means someone needs to be in the house most of the time to feed it and every morning you need to start from a cold stove. I would highly recommend to look for an insert with a firebox of at least 2 cu ft. Is there anything about the Regency i2400 that I missed? Its clearances seem to be ok for your fireplace and with a 2.3 cu ft firebox it would be a much better choice.
fredarm
Minister of Fire
I've been burning a Vista Insert for the past 6 years. It's a great little stove and puts out a lot of heat for its size. It's easy to use (single draft lever) and very well built (has a stainless steel baffle). It does a good job as supplemental heat in our 1900 foot colonial. It heats the L-shaped living room/dining/kitchen area nicely, but the office opposite the kitchen doesn't get much heat and neither does the upstairs. That said, it is a small stove and won't heat most houses (except the smallest) by itself. If you are constrained by fireplace size, as I was, and are just looking for supplemental heat, I would highly recommend it. As Grisu said, you get about 4-5 hours of real burn time, although if I pack it full at bedtime there are usually enough coals to start a fire in the morning if I don't get up too late. Since I'm just an evening and weekend burner, it's not really an issue.
thanks to you both, it gives me a bit more confidence while im out looking at these units. Just today found one that meets all my clearances, the I1200 by Regency using Grisu recommendation. I know these are small units but with a 1400 Sq. Ft. house, and just looking for supplemental heat, as long as I find a well built stove, I believe itll be worth it. Ill post w/I next few days and let you know what the verdict is. Thanx again, you've helped tremendously. Vista/Regency with Answer fading fast (due to the salesmans lack of knowledge on his own units).
DBoon
Minister of Fire
What fredarm said about the Vista I will say about the Answer. It is hard to go wrong with either of these two stoves from a quality point of view. With hardwoods (maple, hickory, ash), I'll get a 4-5 hour heating burn out of mine, and 8-10 hours later (overnight) can relight from coals.
thanx DBoon, first to comment on Lopi should know w/i a day or 2. Removed a section of hardwood flooring today so that I can extend my hearth to 19 1/2 " (flush w floor) with slate to match existing. Also had my chimney cleaned as well. just a matter of pulling the trigger. Both Regencys (1200 and the 2400) fall into my clearances, along with the Lopi answer. Id have to alter my facing for the Vista and I value it to much. Ill let you all know when I select. It may also come down to dollars, dealing with a new dealer, who seems much more knowledgeable than the Lopi dealer so we'll see. Thanx again everyone.
Attachments
Hopefully they were large, especially when he had beans and broccoli for diner.
Grisu
Minister of Fire
At least the i2400 needs some thermal protection in the hearth; r-value of 0.6 if I remember correctly. When redoing the hearth keep that in mind also for the other two inserts.
nice one begreen. I believe they have a computation page on thermal protection in the owners manual Grisu, thanx for keeping me on my toes. laying down gauged slate with 1/2" mud bed.Hopefully they were large, especially when he had beans and broccoli for diner.
finger is on the trigger. dealer quoted me 2300 for the I2400 regency + 320 insulation kit (1/2") + 440 for 6" SS flex liner. As far as I researched, that's around 100 more than internet costs, and I'm assuming there would be shipping costs involved online. Knowledgeable on their stoves. Still debating on self install, its not if I can do it, but if I want to do it. Built three homes/cabins on my own, figure I could wade thru it. But I'm not getting any younger and I can't hop around 8/12 roof pitches like I used to. They quoted 600 on the install. got no problem with them making money, I do the same in my stone business but I told them if I have them do it, i'll be expecting professional work. Fill you in later, thanx Grisu and everyone else for your input, Couldn't have got to this point without it!
Grisu
Minister of Fire
$600 is certainly not a bad price for an install. Did you check with your home insurance whether they require a professional doing it?
If no one has mentioned it yet, I highly recommend putting in a damper-sealing block-off plate: https://www.hearth.com/talk/wiki/make-a-damper-sealing-block-off-plate/ That will make a big difference how much heat you will get out of the insert.
If no one has mentioned it yet, I highly recommend putting in a damper-sealing block-off plate: https://www.hearth.com/talk/wiki/make-a-damper-sealing-block-off-plate/ That will make a big difference how much heat you will get out of the insert.
I'm replying before I read your thread on the block off plate. Thru this past week, researching all these to-do's, I chanced upon that suggestion and made a note to ask, the prior 3 dealers did not bring it up. So before I had a chance to, this last dealer mentioned it. Although I was envisioning a sheet of metal. stock, she said the installer uses paperless insulation. I'm going back tom. And I will delve into it more extensively. I don't know, what if dislodges, you'd never know it. I was actually going to make one myself over the next few weeks before install. Also I have a 4 1/4" x 29" damper that Obviously the liner needs to pass thru, and I know the installer needs to see prior to, but do they torch thru that to get their 6" diameter. The dealer said they would "sawzall" to get the diameter. Now I'm not a liner installer but I've had a sawzall in my hand as much as a cup of coffee and I can't see how he's gonna cut that steel beast of a damper to form. I'm a little concerned about possible damage to my fire brick and mortar holding it in. I'm telling ya, the thing could be used as a tank axle. Why not go to 6" oval back to round?
Grisu
Minister of Fire
Rarely will an installer include a proper block-off plate. A common shortcut is to stuff unbacked fiberglass insulation in the cavity. If stuffed tight enough it will kind of work. Using Roxul insulation will be better (found at Lowes). Ask them for it or get some yourself. A proper sheet metal plate with some Roxul on top for added insulation will give you the most heat retention and needs to be done only once. Should they be reluctant to include it, I would ask them if they can at least install it when you provide the plate .
Tell them about your damper and maybe provide a picture. They may not anticipate that yours is that sturdy. I would discourage ovalizing the liner that much. It will affect draft and make cleaning much more difficult in the future.
Tell them about your damper and maybe provide a picture. They may not anticipate that yours is that sturdy. I would discourage ovalizing the liner that much. It will affect draft and make cleaning much more difficult in the future.
Bigg_Redd
Minister of Fire
Ok. Didn't pull the trigger yet. Called installer, no return as of yet. Its amazing to me they can give a quote and not even see what they are up against. I wouldn't dream of bidding a job wo seeing it first. Anyways, been messing with the damper, I'm concerned that they may be bulls in a china shop, and loosen my brick trying to jack the thing out of the fire box.If you could see up that flue, voids, danglers, it's flipping amazing. Don't know what's going to drop out of this thing. Have my point of penetration thru the damper marked (using the center of insert and location of flue connect as a guide). I believe I'm going to use a my grinder with a cutting wheel and notch out my damper then use the grinder with diamond blade to notch the brick. The damper frame obviously was used as a rest/ support for a row of angled brick and it's locked by brick on either side. My thought is to leave the frame as is other than the notching. The way it looks is there will be a soft "S" from the flue side of the damper, thru the damper, to the flue/liner connection of the fire box. I'm estimating a 12" offset in a 30 " run. Any concerns out there with this configuration. I'm going to lay it out and figure the degrees and will repost. The deeper I go, the more I'm inclined to tackle this. Does insurance co. Need certification of installation? Don't even know if installers are certified. Will try to contact again tomorrow. If you don't hear from me again, I'm buried underneath a half ton of brick.
Grisu
Minister of Fire
Call your insurance and ask them. What an insurance requires can differ wildly from just giving a few measurements over the phone to professional install followed up by building inspection. You will need to tell them anyway that you will get a woodburning appliance which may increase your premium. Good luck and stay safe!
Hogwildz
Minister of Fire
Be wary of installers that give quotes without seeing the job.
Nothing in writing of what he is doing, and what you are getting, can leave a wide open road to frustration.
Make sure he shows you a copy of his liability insurance also and current contractors license if required in your area.
Nothing in writing of what he is doing, and what you are getting, can leave a wide open road to frustration.
Make sure he shows you a copy of his liability insurance also and current contractors license if required in your area.
That's exactly what I told my wife. Being self employed in the tile and stone trade and taught by "old world" stone setters, it's been engrained in me to do things right. In the last 25 years since I've been doing this and over 500 jobs completed, I have never given a quote on something I haven't seen. It just doesn't make sense to me and makes me a little leery. Good news is, the installers sec. Got back ahold of me and we made a appt. for the installer to stop by and look at my situation. I used the reasoning of doing us both a favor by knowing ahead of time what he's got to deal with. Plus it allows me to get feel for his expertise. My wife constantly complains about me doing these things myself, not because I want to but because I can, but I've forced myself to let someone else do something, and I'm doing my best to make sure that someone does it right. Oh the crosses I have to bear! Thanx hog wildz
thanx Hogwidz
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