Love burning wood....but....

[flyingcow]

Wish i would have put solid foam in my walls instead of r-19 F/g. But it is nice to start a fire and leave, knowing that a 5 cu/ft firebox full of wood will keep the house warm and wife happy. It's 0 degrees and a 10mph wind. Why did i build a house on top of a hill in northern maine? Oh yeah, for the view. The view is this........looks freakin' cold out there!! Happy burning fellow boiler room nuts :coolsmile:

 

[ihookem]

Flying crow, I have the same thing here. I can see for miles and I love the summer and fall, winter is terrible though. Anyway I built the same house twice, the first burned down. At first I had blown in cellulose in the walls and was better than fiberglass. Now I have 4" foam in the walls and it's a whole different house. The difference is it is the new house has a lot more moisture in it. I wipe the moisture off the windows a few times a day and our front door is dripping with condensation. A few times I just opened all the windows for 15 min when it was 3 degrees and blew the moisture out. So, a long story short your fiberglass walls do have two advantages, it lets the house breath a little bit. I think I would go back to cellulose if I built a third house. Some say get an air exchanger but that sucks heat out anyway I think. So, I don't know what to do except get storms windows on so I did. It helps keep the moisture from building up quite a bit. Later, ihookem,

 

[muleman51]

Hey Flying Cow , It isn't any warmer in Minnesota. Wish I had R19, I'd have to rebuild this 1923 wonder. We stay warm but not without effort. I need to visit with you about your Inova. I need to do something different, don't think the Adobe will last that much longer. I'll PM you.

 

[bernard]

Same thing here built 10 years ago on top of a ridge. great view of the western mountians and sugarloaf . but i wish foam or solid was being used more back then. .. r-19 is fine with out the wind. its a challange when temps go below 0 and the winds start to howl. but ill fill the eko before i fill the oil tank.

 

[slowzuki]

You need an air exchanger, its required by law up here now. They don't lose that much heat if you get a heat recovery type and you're gonna rot out sills etc with the condensation. You're breathing all the off gassing from particle baord and carpet etc. You could end up with mold problems too. This has been known since the 70's when the first tight houses were built. You really should have one.

Flying crow, I have the same thing here. I can see for miles and I love the summer and fall, winter is terrible though. Anyway I built the same house twice, the first burned down. At first I had blown in cellulose in the walls and was better than fiberglass. Now I have 4" foam in the walls and it's a whole different house. The difference is it is the new house has a lot more moisture in it. I wipe the moisture off the windows a few times a day and our front door is dripping with condensation. A few times I just opened all the windows for 15 min when it was 3 degrees and blew the moisture out. So, a long story short your fiberglass walls do have two advantages, it lets the house breath a little bit. I think I would go back to cellulose if I built a third house. Some say get an air exchanger but that sucks heat out anyway I think. So, I don't know what to do except get storms windows on so I did. It helps keep the moisture from building up quite a bit. Later, ihookem,

 

[tom in maine]

We rebuilt our 200+ year old house about 5 years ago.
The walls and roof are about R65 foam. The basement is spray foam. With all this foam and a lot of sealing, we have a heat load that is about
6,000 btus/hr at -10F.
Our hot water load is more than the heat load. It is only an 1100 sq. ft. cape, but it is on the ocean and it is windy as hell!

We have a small boiler that I built that pumps into an unpressurized tank (what else would one use??)
Last night I ran about 30# of wood. No oil thus far. The solar backup system goes in next year.

Insulation makes everything a lot simpler. It was a fair bit of work, but I don't want to mess with too much wood. I like wood, but not that much.

Keep warm!
Tom

 

[huffdawg]

Flying crow, I have the same thing here. I can see for miles and I love the summer and fall, winter is terrible though. Anyway I built the same house twice, the first burned down. At first I had blown in cellulose in the walls and was better than fiberglass. Now I have 4" foam in the walls and it's a whole different house. The difference is it is the new house has a lot more moisture in it. I wipe the moisture off the windows a few times a day and our front door is dripping with condensation. A few times I just opened all the windows for 15 min when it was 3 degrees and blew the moisture out. So, a long story short your fiberglass walls do have two advantages, it lets the house breath a little bit. I think I would go back to cellulose if I built a third house. Some say get an air exchanger but that sucks heat out anyway I think. So, I don't know what to do except get storms windows on so I did. It helps keep the mo[isture from building up quite a bit. Later, ihookem,

You need an HRV (heat recovery ventilation) It draws in fresh air from outside through a heat x changer that has your warm air from inside puhing out. Yes you loose some heat but you also will dehumidify and filter the air . With the tight houses now a days you need to get fresh air some how.

 

[ihookem]

I have a 6" pipe coming into the cold air return from outside. This passed code here but I wonder if it shoiuld have had two of them. The only thing is an air exchanger. Later, ihookem.

 

[ohbie1]

Man you northern state guys are really rugged. You remind me of the pioneers of the 1800s. We live on a mountain top, and it's colder up here than the rest of Jersey, BUT 15 °F to 20 °F is considered friged........Springlike to you guys!

 

[dogwood]

Tom in Maine, how are your walls constructed to accomodate R-65 foam. How thick are they? I built mine with 2x8's to accomodate R-26 pink fiberglass. I was going to use double wall construction, but this was about twenty years ago, and I thought the building inspector wouldn't pass on it if I did. People have changed since and I regret I didn't do what you have now.

My entire propane bill was only $65.00 monthly then with everything in the home using propane. R-65 insulation would have been overkill then, but not now. I should have stuck to my guns. Superinsulating your house and any alternative energy use was still out in left field then, especially in a more southerly state like Virginia. With current propane bills like mine of $375.00 monthly, nobody is looking askance at alternative energy anymore. And now you can easily find air exchangers and the like also.

By the way we live on a hilltop too. Can't beat the views of the Blue Ridge mountains, although I do miss the North Cascades of Washington. Let us know about your wall construction techniques. I am really impressed and interested in how you squeezed in that much insulation.

Mike

 

[tom in maine]

Tom in Maine, how are your walls constructed to accomodate R-65 foam. How thick are they? I built mine with 2x8's to accomodate R-26 pink fiberglass. I was going to use double wall construction, but this was about twenty years ago, and I thought the building inspector wouldn't pass on it if I did. People have changed since and I regret I didn't do what you have now.

Mike

We found the walls on the first floor were rotted (a victim of a wet basement and a couple hundred years of wind driven rain), so we removed 4' of wall at a time and replaced them with foam panels we built. The panels had 5.5" of polyiso foam (~R-38) sandwiched between 2 2x4's that were laid flat every 16" These were glued and screwed together to create the panel. The exterior 2x4's were pressure treated, given the location. We had tested the panels at the University of Maine and found they were as strong as conventional structural panels and /or stick building.
Once the panels were up, there was the space in between the exterior 2x4's that screamed for 1.5" of foam, so I cut and fit 1.5" polyiso in between them (R-10.8) and then it only made sense to throw another 2" over the "studs" before sheathing it.
The second floor (it was a high posted cape) had a cavity I built to match the first floor walls and it was filled to spray foam to stiffen up what was very loose
mortised framing.
When all was done we had R-65 in everything but the front wall, which was originally leaning back, so in order to have a straight wall under the roof, I had 5" to fill.
That got padded out with another 5" of foam.
Fortunately, at that time, we were in the business of selling polyiso seconds and the cost was not horrible. I think the numbers work with firsts. The thicker the walls are the stronger the house is.
I had a theory that the R-40 that everyone, including myself, was suggesting for superinsulation was not enough. I did some math and through some
calculations that might be considered voodoo, felt that R-60 was the number to shoot for. That seems to be bearing true for our climate.

It does heat and cool easily. And it makes the cost of heating and cooling with almost anything practical. We used to use 250g of oil for heat and hot water.
At that point, a small gas fireplace would've been a lot easier, but I don't want to send my money anywhere but Waldo County--where we live.

 

[dogwood]

Tom, one more construction detail question. What did you use for the top and bottom plates that the panels sit on/over? Did you use 2x10s, or the original members existing in the house? Is your house post and beam constuction? The original foundation must be fairly wide as well. Must have been quite a projesct and sounds like you did a great job. Did you find you need an air/air exchanger to avoid interior moisture issues with all that added insulation or does your 200+ year old home still have enough natural draft remaining to not to require one?

Mike

 

[tom in maine]

The top and bottom plates were 2x6's since the foam was let back and the plates fit in between the "studs". They were screwed into the studs. The foam is an excellent structural support if protected from buckling, which is what the studs do.
The walls were placed under a solid 6x6 ring beam that was original to the house, so the load was pretty well carried by the walls placed underneath and screwed into place.
The house was sort of a post and beam with some stud-like trees that were flattened on two sides that were placed like studs.
The new walls sat on a new floor that had double band joists and 1.25" decking. We started out just replacing the floor which was an old post and beam floor that was rotted in many area.
While we were at it, we lifted the house 8" so I could stand up in the basement. While lifting the house, we discovered how bad the walls were.
It was exciting stuff, that I did with a friend and a rag tag crew of hippies. It got done and no one even got hurt or died.

 

[dogwood]

Must have been one heckuva job. Wish I could have been there to help. I was a hippie too about 35-40 years ago. I was actually was travelling to Maine from New York to look for land to homestead back in 1976 when the starter on my old International Scout gave out outside of Boston. Got a push start from a big rig, rode non-stop back to Long Island, ended up joining the service, and moved to the Seattle area afterwards instead, where I gutted and restored a turn-of-the -century home. Might have been your neighbor otherwise. Take care.

Mike

 

[nealj]

It is my opinion that there is no better investment than the right insulation. We renovated a 1896 house about 10 years ago. Doing most work ourselves we weren't going to cut corners. Original insulation was soft brick mortared between studs with plaster and lathe over that. We did a complete demo removing plaster lathe and brick. Then put 4" fg between studs and then furred studs out and put 2" white foam on the inside. We also resided so with that we used house wrap. New wndows and doors so basically a new house const. with the exception of sheathing which is shiplap. We have an infloor heat system originaly fired by propane. The first fall we nearly ran out of fuel before we checked the tank the first time. I know this a long story but my point is the fg insulation was a waste of time and money with air infiltration through the sheathing even with the house wrap. We could have foamed the original 4" walls sealed it up and it would still be paying returns. Since that first winter installed owb so it doesn't hurt as much but still wooda shoulda coulda.

 

[laynes69]

We have a 2400 SQ FT victorian with 10' ceilings. Dad and grandpa owned an insulating business back in 78. When grandma owned the house dad filled the walls with urea-formaldahyde foam. Average thickness 8". Our walls are warm, but our basement is extremely drafty at the foundation and some rooms are drafty at the bottom of the floor where dad put in batts of fiberglass. Our house is 150+ years old with double hung double pane vinyl windows and triple track storms on the outside of those. It heats better than grandmas little trailer, but I can't for the life of me figure out how to stop those damn drafts at the foundation. Its a boulder foundation with a 10" square beam on top with the walls off of that. Any ideas? Also our blown in cellouse in the attic has settled to 3" thickness. They recommend a r60 in the attic. I figure thats possibly a biggie on our drafts and heat loss. I looked up into the attic and can look down the interior walls so I know we are loosing heat there also. Would like to get a energy audit done on the home, but not sure if its worth the cost. Other than the few bad drafts, and some heat loss were happy. So if anyone has got any ideas on where those drafts could be entering into the home, or what to do to stop them i'm all ears. At this point i'm stuck.

 

[muleman51]

Good Morning. In our area Xcel Energy will do energy audits very reasonably I have had them done on our residence and rental property. Some of the auditors are better than others. As for your foundation leakage, we had spray foam applied over the foundation and up over the bottom two siding boards and down to six inches below grade. The contractor does this all the time. then you just paint over it. It really does not look to bad. It will be less noticeable once the landscaping regrows and fills in. You can really tell the difference, stops all those drafts and warmed up the basement.