My new Holz Haus

[jdinspector]

I split up about 2 cords of wood over the last few days and decided to make a holz haus. It's sitting on 4 pallets and is about 6 1/2 feet tall (8 feet diameter). What a pain in the butt to build correctly (I'm still not completely satisfied with how it turned out). If you don't keep the sides straight up and down or actually tilted in a little bit, it is really prone to collapsing. I'm very concerned about the kids next door, (the little one in the photo), so wanted to make sure this was pretty sturdy. This one will be 2/3 of my winter's wood for 2010-2011. Mostly maple in there, but some oak and some ash.

Has anyone built one taller than this? I'd be a little worried about it falling over.

 

[Bigcube]

Very cool! How do you stack them like that? Do they get enough airflow to dry?

 

[jdinspector]

Very cool! How do you stack them like that? Do they get enough airflow to dry?

It's like spokes on a wheel with a spacer every once in a while. I think it will dry pretty good. The entire center is full of loose stacked wood. I've partially covered the top with bark to act like a roof. I think I need to make it a little steeper, both for water shedding and for a better look. I was in a hurry to finish up today and ran out of wood to make the middle stick up. I'll split more in the next week or so and make the roof a little steeper.

 

[Jack Straw]

As someone who struggles with his wood piles that is very impressive. Nice family too. If that's your daughter, in a blink of your eye she'll be grown up and leaving. Trust me.

 

[iskiatomic]

Great job. I understand this method of stacking will dry wood faster. I don't think I have the patience for this method. Please let us know how this worked out.


KC

 

[adrpga498]

Looks very good for the first attempt. Don't need to add to the top.

 

[Todd]

Nice job. I know they can be a pita if not built correctly, I had one collapse a few years back. And if you make them too big it's hard to retrieve your wood. But they sure are cool looking.

 

[myzamboni]

Great job. I understand this method of stacking will dry wood faster. I don't think I have the patience for this method. Please let us know how this worked out.


KC

Nope, it won't dry faster. The main advantages are aesthetics and the ability to store a lot of wood in a small footprint.

 

[Hurricane]

Nice stack !

I tried the same thing last week on four pallets. I could not get the wood to stack sturdy enough for my liking so I took it apart and lined up the four pallets and did two rows on the pallets. I split larger splits and any wood that was not perfect did not stack correctly. Since the ring was circular I needed pie shaped pieces which splits do not come as, and my two kids asked me if I could put a door in it.

I would really like to build one of these but could not get it tight. My splits with knots and bulges would destabilize the stacks. I figured I would put all of those on the vertical inside but I did not seem to have enough of the smaller straight splits. I guess this may have something to do with me splitting by hand.

 

[Apprentice_GM]

Great job. I understand this method of stacking will dry wood faster. I don't think I have the patience for this method. Please let us know how this worked out.


KC

Nope, it won't dry faster. The main advantages are aesthetics and the ability to store a lot of wood in a small footprint.

iskiatomic - I am doing an experiment to determine which (if any) method of stacking seasons wood faster. See my signature for link.

myzamboni - I tend to agree with you, but do you have any facts / references / data to back up this statement? I'm spending a lot of time and effort on my experiment and would be happy to ditch it if already proven . . .

 

[Wood Duck]

I stack my wood in Holz Hausen and don't build any taller than about 6 feet max. I can't conveniently reach the wood on top in the middle if I make it any taller, so that is my limit.

 

[Todd]

Great job. I understand this method of stacking will dry wood faster. I don't think I have the patience for this method. Please let us know how this worked out.


KC

Nope, it won't dry faster. The main advantages are aesthetics and the ability to store a lot of wood in a small footprint.

iskiatomic - I am doing an experiment to determine which (if any) method of stacking seasons wood faster. See my signature for link.

myzamboni - I tend to agree with you, but do you have any facts / references / data to back up this statement? I'm spending a lot of time and effort on my experiment and would be happy to ditch it if already proven . . .

Don't mean to butt in here, but I have done the experiment and myzamboni is right. I had two HH's and one 26' long row in the same area, and I found no difference in drying time according to my moisture meter. The Holz is a great way to stack a lot of wood in a small area.

 

[iceman]

Great job. I understand this method of stacking will dry wood faster. I don't think I have the patience for this method. Please let us know how this worked out.


KC

Nope, it won't dry faster. The main advantages are aesthetics and the ability to store a lot of wood in a small footprint.

iskiatomic - I am doing an experiment to determine which (if any) method of stacking seasons wood faster. See my signature for link.

myzamboni - I tend to agree with you, but do you have any facts / references / data to back up this statement? I'm spending a lot of time and effort on my experiment and would be happy to ditch it if already proven . . .

Don't mean to butt in here, but I have done the experiment and myzamboni is right. I had two HH's and one 26' long row in the same area, and I found no difference in drying time according to my moisture meter. The Holz is a great way to stack a lot of wood in a small area.

so the answer would be yes then??????
if a ROW 26' feet long seasons as fast as a hh then the hh wins..... 26' in 1 row is at most 2 cds a small hh should be almost 3 cds
but did the hh get as much sun and wind as the row?
so vs a cd 4x4x8 stacked.. a hh might just season faster.. but a 7' dia hh should get 2.5-3 cds which is a smaller print than a 6x8x8 so in theory its packed "tighter" (smaller ft print) and seasons just as fast vs larger print
so yes you are right about lotta wood smaller area but ........... i dunno just guessing
would give us more detail on your experiment please

 

[pulldownclaw]

I love this debate, and would love if it got cleared up. Todd, I'm curious how the splits in the middle of the HH measured as opposed to the outside of the HH that saw most of the sun/wind? I built a 2 cord HH of oak last Fall, and wondering how it's going to burn this Winter...

 

[pulldownclaw]

Oh yeah, jdinspector, that's a mighty fine job you did there. I built mine sloped in a little more because I was afraid of it falling apart, but I think I'll try to keep the sides straighter next time. Looks like a giant pinecone....

 

[Todd]

Great job. I understand this method of stacking will dry wood faster. I don't think I have the patience for this method. Please let us know how this worked out.


KC

Nope, it won't dry faster. The main advantages are aesthetics and the ability to store a lot of wood in a small footprint.

iskiatomic - I am doing an experiment to determine which (if any) method of stacking seasons wood faster. See my signature for link.

myzamboni - I tend to agree with you, but do you have any facts / references / data to back up this statement? I'm spending a lot of time and effort on my experiment and would be happy to ditch it if already proven . . .

Don't mean to butt in here, but I have done the experiment and myzamboni is right. I had two HH's and one 26' long row in the same area, and I found no difference in drying time according to my moisture meter. The Holz is a great way to stack a lot of wood in a small area.

so the answer would be yes then??????
if a ROW 26' feet long seasons as fast as a hh then the hh wins..... 26' in 1 row is at most 2 cds a small hh should be almost 3 cds
but did the hh get as much sun and wind as the row?
so vs a cd 4x4x8 stacked.. a hh might just season faster.. but a 7' dia hh should get 2.5-3 cds which is a smaller print than a 6x8x8 so in theory its packed "tighter" (smaller ft print) and seasons just as fast vs larger print
so yes you are right about lotta wood smaller area but ........... i dunno just guessing
would give us more detail on your experiment please

My HH was about 2.5 cords and the single row was about 1.5 cords. I was taking moisture measurement samples from both and they were similar all year long, but I couldn't retrieve a sample from inside the HH til winter when I burned it. The splits inside the HH were good and dry when I got to them.

 

[Apprentice_GM]

Great job. I understand this method of stacking will dry wood faster. I don't think I have the patience for this method. Please let us know how this worked out.


KC

Nope, it won't dry faster. The main advantages are aesthetics and the ability to store a lot of wood in a small footprint.

iskiatomic - I am doing an experiment to determine which (if any) method of stacking seasons wood faster. See my signature for link.

myzamboni - I tend to agree with you, but do you have any facts / references / data to back up this statement? I'm spending a lot of time and effort on my experiment and would be happy to ditch it if already proven . . .

Don't mean to butt in here, but I have done the experiment and myzamboni is right. I had two HH's and one 26' long row in the same area, and I found no difference in drying time according to my moisture meter. The Holz is a great way to stack a lot of wood in a small area.

so the answer would be yes then??????
if a ROW 26' feet long seasons as fast as a hh then the hh wins..... 26' in 1 row is at most 2 cds a small hh should be almost 3 cds
but did the hh get as much sun and wind as the row?
so vs a cd 4x4x8 stacked.. a hh might just season faster.. but a 7' dia hh should get 2.5-3 cds which is a smaller print than a 6x8x8 so in theory its packed "tighter" (smaller ft print) and seasons just as fast vs larger print
so yes you are right about lotta wood smaller area but ........... i dunno just guessing
would give us more detail on your experiment please

My HH was about 2.5 cords and the single row was about 1.5 cords. I was taking moisture measurement samples from both and they were similar all year long, but I couldn't retrieve a sample from inside the HH til winter when I burned it. The splits inside the HH were good and dry when I got to them.

Todd, were you splitting or cutting the splits from both ricks (rows) and HH before measuring with the meter? I have found a big difference between outside exposed parts of the seasoned wood and the core. Did you perchance weigh any splits before and after seasoning? Weight is a much more accurate measure of moisture loss, and you don't need to re-split or cut.

I am anxious to see the results of my experiment, just waiting for the seasoning to happen, but if as you say the HH seasons as quick as the ricks, I am impressed, as intuitively I would have thought the ricks, with more exposure to sun and wind, would dry faster - especially compared to those internal splits in the HH. Also, over how long did you run your experiment?

I have been noticing a large difference in MC on the sunny and non sunny sides of the ricks and HH, although I am only penetrating 6mm / 1/4" into the wood with a cheapie MC meter.

Also, just out of interest, what type of wood were you seasoning?

 

[karri0n]

Oh yeah, jdinspector, that's a mighty fine job you did there. I built mine sloped in a little more because I was afraid of it falling apart, but I think I'll try to keep the sides straighter next time. Looks like a giant pinecone....

I really like the looks of the pinecone, honestly.

 

[Todd]

Great job. I understand this method of stacking will dry wood faster. I don't think I have the patience for this method. Please let us know how this worked out.


KC

Nope, it won't dry faster. The main advantages are aesthetics and the ability to store a lot of wood in a small footprint.

iskiatomic - I am doing an experiment to determine which (if any) method of stacking seasons wood faster. See my signature for link.

myzamboni - I tend to agree with you, but do you have any facts / references / data to back up this statement? I'm spending a lot of time and effort on my experiment and would be happy to ditch it if already proven . . .

Don't mean to butt in here, but I have done the experiment and myzamboni is right. I had two HH's and one 26' long row in the same area, and I found no difference in drying time according to my moisture meter. The Holz is a great way to stack a lot of wood in a small area.

so the answer would be yes then??????
if a ROW 26' feet long seasons as fast as a hh then the hh wins..... 26' in 1 row is at most 2 cds a small hh should be almost 3 cds
but did the hh get as much sun and wind as the row?
so vs a cd 4x4x8 stacked.. a hh might just season faster.. but a 7' dia hh should get 2.5-3 cds which is a smaller print than a 6x8x8 so in theory its packed "tighter" (smaller ft print) and seasons just as fast vs larger print
so yes you are right about lotta wood smaller area but ........... i dunno just guessing
would give us more detail on your experiment please

My HH was about 2.5 cords and the single row was about 1.5 cords. I was taking moisture measurement samples from both and they were similar all year long, but I couldn't retrieve a sample from inside the HH til winter when I burned it. The splits inside the HH were good and dry when I got to them.

Todd, were you splitting or cutting the splits from both ricks (rows) and HH before measuring with the meter? I have found a big difference between outside exposed parts of the seasoned wood and the core. Did you perchance weigh any splits before and after seasoning? Weight is a much more accurate measure of moisture loss, and you don't need to re-split or cut.

I am anxious to see the results of my experiment, just waiting for the seasoning to happen, but if as you say the HH seasons as quick as the ricks, I am impressed, as intuitively I would have thought the ricks, with more exposure to sun and wind, would dry faster - especially compared to those internal splits in the HH. Also, over how long did you run your experiment?

I have been noticing a large difference in MC on the sunny and non sunny sides of the ricks and HH, although I am only penetrating 6mm / 1/4" into the wood with a cheapie MC meter.

Also, just out of interest, what type of wood were you seasoning?

It was all Oak and all the wood had very little sun but good wind blowing through the area. I took moisture readings after splitting a piece in half and didn't weigh any splits. I was impressed on how the inside splits were just as dry as the outsides once I got to them. I think I had the HH sitting for about 18 months before I burned them and final moisture was 15-25% depending on the size of split. I also had a few sizzlers in the stove, most of those were large rounds. I found fresh cut Oak takes two summers to dry out to get it all under 25% no matter what stacking method I use. Now I have a wood shed that holds enough wood for two seasons and it will be nice not having to mess with the weather, tarps, or a tall Holz Hausen.

 

[madrone]

Great job. I understand this method of stacking will dry wood faster. I don't think I have the patience for this method. Please let us know how this worked out.


KC

Nope, it won't dry faster. The main advantages are aesthetics and the ability to store a lot of wood in a small footprint.

iskiatomic - I am doing an experiment to determine which (if any) method of stacking seasons wood faster. See my signature for link.

myzamboni - I tend to agree with you, but do you have any facts / references / data to back up this statement? I'm spending a lot of time and effort on my experiment and would be happy to ditch it if already proven . . .

Don't mean to butt in here, but I have done the experiment and myzamboni is right. I had two HH's and one 26' long row in the same area, and I found no difference in drying time according to my moisture meter. The Holz is a great way to stack a lot of wood in a small area.

so the answer would be yes then??????
if a ROW 26' feet long seasons as fast as a hh then the hh wins..... 26' in 1 row is at most 2 cds a small hh should be almost 3 cds
but did the hh get as much sun and wind as the row?
so vs a cd 4x4x8 stacked.. a hh might just season faster.. but a 7' dia hh should get 2.5-3 cds which is a smaller print than a 6x8x8 so in theory its packed "tighter" (smaller ft print) and seasons just as fast vs larger print
so yes you are right about lotta wood smaller area but ........... i dunno just guessing
would give us more detail on your experiment please

My HH was about 2.5 cords and the single row was about 1.5 cords. I was taking moisture measurement samples from both and they were similar all year long, but I couldn't retrieve a sample from inside the HH til winter when I burned it. The splits inside the HH were good and dry when I got to them.

Todd, were you splitting or cutting the splits from both ricks (rows) and HH before measuring with the meter? I have found a big difference between outside exposed parts of the seasoned wood and the core. Did you perchance weigh any splits before and after seasoning? Weight is a much more accurate measure of moisture loss, and you don't need to re-split or cut.

I am anxious to see the results of my experiment, just waiting for the seasoning to happen, but if as you say the HH seasons as quick as the ricks, I am impressed, as intuitively I would have thought the ricks, with more exposure to sun and wind, would dry faster - especially compared to those internal splits in the HH. Also, over how long did you run your experiment?

I have been noticing a large difference in MC on the sunny and non sunny sides of the ricks and HH, although I am only penetrating 6mm / 1/4" into the wood with a cheapie MC meter.

Also, just out of interest, what type of wood were you seasoning?

It was all Oak and all the wood had very little sun but good wind blowing through the area. I took moisture readings after splitting a piece in half and didn't weigh any splits. I was impressed on how the inside splits were just as dry as the outsides once I got to them. I think I had the HH sitting for about 18 months before I burned them and final moisture was 15-25% depending on the size of split. I also had a few sizzlers in the stove, most of those were large rounds. I found fresh cut Oak takes two summers to dry out to get it all under 25% no matter what stacking method I use. Now I have a wood shed that holds enough wood for two seasons and it will be nice not having to mess with the weather, tarps, or a tall Holz Hausen.

I don't have anything to add, I just thought it would be cool to keep quoting quotes.

 

[North of 60]

Great job. I understand this method of stacking will dry wood faster. I don't think I have the patience for this method. Please let us know how this worked out.


KC

Nope, it won't dry faster. The main advantages are aesthetics and the ability to store a lot of wood in a small footprint.

iskiatomic - I am doing an experiment to determine which (if any) method of stacking seasons wood faster. See my signature for link.

myzamboni - I tend to agree with you, but do you have any facts / references / data to back up this statement? I'm spending a lot of time and effort on my experiment and would be happy to ditch it if already proven . . .

Don't mean to butt in here, but I have done the experiment and myzamboni is right. I had two HH's and one 26' long row in the same area, and I found no difference in drying time according to my moisture meter. The Holz is a great way to stack a lot of wood in a small area.

so the answer would be yes then??????
if a ROW 26' feet long seasons as fast as a hh then the hh wins..... 26' in 1 row is at most 2 cds a small hh should be almost 3 cds
but did the hh get as much sun and wind as the row?
so vs a cd 4x4x8 stacked.. a hh might just season faster.. but a 7' dia hh should get 2.5-3 cds which is a smaller print than a 6x8x8 so in theory its packed "tighter" (smaller ft print) and seasons just as fast vs larger print
so yes you are right about lotta wood smaller area but ........... i dunno just guessing
would give us more detail on your experiment please

My HH was about 2.5 cords and the single row was about 1.5 cords. I was taking moisture measurement samples from both and they were similar all year long, but I couldn't retrieve a sample from inside the HH til winter when I burned it. The splits inside the HH were good and dry when I got to them.

Todd, were you splitting or cutting the splits from both ricks (rows) and HH before measuring with the meter? I have found a big difference between outside exposed parts of the seasoned wood and the core. Did you perchance weigh any splits before and after seasoning? Weight is a much more accurate measure of moisture loss, and you don't need to re-split or cut.

I am anxious to see the results of my experiment, just waiting for the seasoning to happen, but if as you say the HH seasons as quick as the ricks, I am impressed, as intuitively I would have thought the ricks, with more exposure to sun and wind, would dry faster - especially compared to those internal splits in the HH. Also, over how long did you run your experiment?

I have been noticing a large difference in MC on the sunny and non sunny sides of the ricks and HH, although I am only penetrating 6mm / 1/4" into the wood with a cheapie MC meter.

Also, just out of interest, what type of wood were you seasoning?

It was all Oak and all the wood had very little sun but good wind blowing through the area. I took moisture readings after splitting a piece in half and didn't weigh any splits. I was impressed on how the inside splits were just as dry as the outsides once I got to them. I think I had the HH sitting for about 18 months before I burned them and final moisture was 15-25% depending on the size of split. I also had a few sizzlers in the stove, most of those were large rounds. I found fresh cut Oak takes two summers to dry out to get it all under 25% no matter what stacking method I use. Now I have a wood shed that holds enough wood for two seasons and it will be nice not having to mess with the weather, tarps, or a tall Holz Hausen.

I don't have anything to add, I just thought it would be cool to keep quoting quotes.

Im in.

 

[madrone]

Great job. I understand this method of stacking will dry wood faster. I don't think I have the patience for this method. Please let us know how this worked out.


KC

Nope, it won't dry faster. The main advantages are aesthetics and the ability to store a lot of wood in a small footprint.

iskiatomic - I am doing an experiment to determine which (if any) method of stacking seasons wood faster. See my signature for link.

myzamboni - I tend to agree with you, but do you have any facts / references / data to back up this statement? I'm spending a lot of time and effort on my experiment and would be happy to ditch it if already proven . . .

Don't mean to butt in here, but I have done the experiment and myzamboni is right. I had two HH's and one 26' long row in the same area, and I found no difference in drying time according to my moisture meter. The Holz is a great way to stack a lot of wood in a small area.

so the answer would be yes then??????
if a ROW 26' feet long seasons as fast as a hh then the hh wins..... 26' in 1 row is at most 2 cds a small hh should be almost 3 cds
but did the hh get as much sun and wind as the row?
so vs a cd 4x4x8 stacked.. a hh might just season faster.. but a 7' dia hh should get 2.5-3 cds which is a smaller print than a 6x8x8 so in theory its packed "tighter" (smaller ft print) and seasons just as fast vs larger print
so yes you are right about lotta wood smaller area but ........... i dunno just guessing
would give us more detail on your experiment please

My HH was about 2.5 cords and the single row was about 1.5 cords. I was taking moisture measurement samples from both and they were similar all year long, but I couldn't retrieve a sample from inside the HH til winter when I burned it. The splits inside the HH were good and dry when I got to them.

Todd, were you splitting or cutting the splits from both ricks (rows) and HH before measuring with the meter? I have found a big difference between outside exposed parts of the seasoned wood and the core. Did you perchance weigh any splits before and after seasoning? Weight is a much more accurate measure of moisture loss, and you don't need to re-split or cut.

I am anxious to see the results of my experiment, just waiting for the seasoning to happen, but if as you say the HH seasons as quick as the ricks, I am impressed, as intuitively I would have thought the ricks, with more exposure to sun and wind, would dry faster - especially compared to those internal splits in the HH. Also, over how long did you run your experiment?

I have been noticing a large difference in MC on the sunny and non sunny sides of the ricks and HH, although I am only penetrating 6mm / 1/4" into the wood with a cheapie MC meter.

Also, just out of interest, what type of wood were you seasoning?

It was all Oak and all the wood had very little sun but good wind blowing through the area. I took moisture readings after splitting a piece in half and didn't weigh any splits. I was impressed on how the inside splits were just as dry as the outsides once I got to them. I think I had the HH sitting for about 18 months before I burned them and final moisture was 15-25% depending on the size of split. I also had a few sizzlers in the stove, most of those were large rounds. I found fresh cut Oak takes two summers to dry out to get it all under 25% no matter what stacking method I use. Now I have a wood shed that holds enough wood for two seasons and it will be nice not having to mess with the weather, tarps, or a tall Holz Hausen.

I don't have anything to add, I just thought it would be cool to keep quoting quotes.

Im in.

AWESOME Ride the quotes, dude!

 

[Abhoth]

[quote author="iskiatomic" date="1240117954"]Great job. I understand this method of stacking will dry wood faster. I don't think I have the patience for this method. Please let us know how this worked out.


KC

Nope, it won't dry faster. The main advantages are aesthetics and the ability to store a lot of wood in a small footprint.

iskiatomic - I am doing an experiment to determine which (if any) method of stacking seasons wood faster. See my signature for link.

myzamboni - I tend to agree with you, but do you have any facts / references / data to back up this statement? I'm spending a lot of time and effort on my experiment and would be happy to ditch it if already proven . . .

Don't mean to butt in here, but I have done the experiment and myzamboni is right. I had two HH's and one 26' long row in the same area, and I found no difference in drying time according to my moisture meter. The Holz is a great way to stack a lot of wood in a small area.

so the answer would be yes then??????
if a ROW 26' feet long seasons as fast as a hh then the hh wins..... 26' in 1 row is at most 2 cds a small hh should be almost 3 cds
but did the hh get as much sun and wind as the row?
so vs a cd 4x4x8 stacked.. a hh might just season faster.. but a 7' dia hh should get 2.5-3 cds which is a smaller print than a 6x8x8 so in theory its packed "tighter" (smaller ft print) and seasons just as fast vs larger print
so yes you are right about lotta wood smaller area but ........... i dunno just guessing
would give us more detail on your experiment please

My HH was about 2.5 cords and the single row was about 1.5 cords. I was taking moisture measurement samples from both and they were similar all year long, but I couldn't retrieve a sample from inside the HH til winter when I burned it. The splits inside the HH were good and dry when I got to them.

Todd, were you splitting or cutting the splits from both ricks (rows) and HH before measuring with the meter? I have found a big difference between outside exposed parts of the seasoned wood and the core. Did you perchance weigh any splits before and after seasoning? Weight is a much more accurate measure of moisture loss, and you don't need to re-split or cut.

I am anxious to see the results of my experiment, just waiting for the seasoning to happen, but if as you say the HH seasons as quick as the ricks, I am impressed, as intuitively I would have thought the ricks, with more exposure to sun and wind, would dry faster - especially compared to those internal splits in the HH. Also, over how long did you run your experiment?

I have been noticing a large difference in MC on the sunny and non sunny sides of the ricks and HH, although I am only penetrating 6mm / 1/4" into the wood with a cheapie MC meter.

Also, just out of interest, what type of wood were you seasoning?

It was all Oak and all the wood had very little sun but good wind blowing through the area. I took moisture readings after splitting a piece in half and didn't weigh any splits. I was impressed on how the inside splits were just as dry as the outsides once I got to them. I think I had the HH sitting for about 18 months before I burned them and final moisture was 15-25% depending on the size of split. I also had a few sizzlers in the stove, most of those were large rounds. I found fresh cut Oak takes two summers to dry out to get it all under 25% no matter what stacking method I use. Now I have a wood shed that holds enough wood for two seasons and it will be nice not having to mess with the weather, tarps, or a tall Holz Hausen.

I don't have anything to add, I just thought it would be cool to keep quoting quotes.

Im in.

AWESOME Ride the quotes, dude![/quote]

Oh for craps sake, who started 'the wave'... now I have to stand up! Damn... and I like the pine cone too!

 

[LLigetfa]

I'm getting dizzy from the "tunnel" effect! Make it stop.

 

[flyingcow]

Al gore would not be happy to see the internet used like this, he probably thinks its a waste of his invention. And i tried to read it and got dizzy.