Need advice on masonry chimney falling off house

[acesneights1]

we are buying an as is fixer upper. It was all we could afford after losing 100k on our old house. I was inspecting the chimney for the oil furnace(single flue) and I can sway it. It appears not to be attached to the house. I dont know if they did not use brick ties when it was built or the wood that it was attachted to rotted. I looked in the attaic at the gable sheeting and it is some kind of composite board called Celotex. Looked ok. We suspect they may have lifted the house and added to the hieght of the foundation to make a bomb shelter in the basement with 8’ ceiling. The rest of the cellar with extension is now 9’. Its an okd farm house from 60’s but foundation extension looks maybe 90s ?? Ton of rebar in it but I suspect they cut the brick ties when they lifted the house. Can I strap the chimney to the house with stainless straps if there is no seriuos issues with the side of the house ?

 

[peakbagger]

I have seen several houses with straps similar to what you describe. I don't know the code but it sure makes sense to me compared to it sitting on he ground. Celotex was a crappy sheathing that was allowed at one point. One step away from cardboard. I saw lots of condos get thrown up with it.

I have also seen add on chmneys with this issue where the new foundation for the chimney was poured on old backfill around the foundation, frost causes them to tip outwards and the chimney tris to go with it. There are helical screw anchor that can be attached to the chimney foundation corners that can be screwed down into the ground until they meet good soil and the chimney can be jacked back to get the chimney vertical.

Good luck on the project.

 

[zrock]

Did you not get a inspection before purchase? A house from the 60's i would be really Leary of screwing any sort of anchor/screw into the brick chimney. everything is old and brittle. The only way to fix it properly is remove it and rebuild it especially if you can sway it. A good wind and the thing may just topple over and hurt someone as much as you do not want to hear that. Maby look into a chimney similar to a wood stove setup and you can just buy sections and install. Still going to cost you money but no ware near as much

 

[Highbeam]

Did you not get a inspection before purchase? A house from the 60's i would be really Leary of screwing any sort of anchor/screw into the brick chimney. everything is old and brittle. The only way to fix it properly is remove it and rebuild it especially if you can sway it. A good wind and the thing may just topple over and hurt someone as much as you do not want to hear that. Maby look into a chimney similar to a wood stove setup and you can just buy sections and install. Still going to cost you money but no ware near as much

Yep, tear it down. I tore down the masonry chimney on my 1963 built home and it was a great move. Very cheap to remove in a day. Think 500$. Then you can install a modern high performance pipe chimney.

 

[bholler]

I would say easily 60% of the masonry chimneys will easily sway allot. Not that it is ok but it is extremely common. Has the chimney pulled away from the house or is it just that it sways? If it is just the sway anchor it to the house with a couple straps around it. It doesn't take much at all to keep them from moving. Before going further I would have the liner scanned though. If you need a liner in it also it may make sense to replace it. Also is the liner sized correctly for the furnace?

 

[bholler]

Yep, tear it down. I tore down the masonry chimney on my 1963 built home and it was a great move. Very cheap to remove in a day. Think 500$. Then you can install a modern high performance pipe chimney.

Yes but if it is a good functioning chimney that simply needs stabilized it can be fixed for under $100. And yes you can easily take an exterior chimney down for $500. But then you have to fix the siding soffit etc and then replace it with a new one. You are looking a at least $2000 to replace something that may just need a couple straps.

 

[bholler]

Yep, tear it down. I tore down the masonry chimney on my 1963 built home and it was a great move. Very cheap to remove in a day. Think 500$. Then you can install a modern high performance pipe chimney.

It is also entirely possible your idea is the best solution as well. We just don't have enough info to tell what is best.

 

[MTY]

Some how in my life I have been cursed with finding joy in fixing old houses. I have removed about half a dozen old masonry chimneys. They come down quickly with an 8 pound sledge. The problems are controlling and cleaning up the mess.

Without knowing exactly what you have, recommendations are hard to make, but if the cost of new was not much more than the cost of repair i'd lean that way. It may be possible to frame in a new metal chimney in order to cover the area where the old chimney was.

 

[acesneights1]

Sorry guys, we are moving into this horror and my online is limited to my phone. Other than the sway the chimney seems in good conidtion. Itmhas not pulled away from the flashing.

 

[bholler]

Sorry guys, we are moving into this horror and my online is limited to my phone. Other than the sway the chimney seems in good conidtion. Itmhas not pulled away from the flashing.

Then a few straps should be fine.

 

[Highbeam]

When you guys say sway, do you mean you shove it and the thing wiggles around like a wet noodle? Rocks back and forth? Wow.

 

[zrock]

2-5 tonne of brick is not going to be fine with a few straps. When brick ties are used they are every few rows... If you can move it by hand then the wind is able to move it. This will over time crack and separate the liner or worse crack and separate the brick causing it to come down.

 

[peakbagger]

The OP has stated that this house wasn't his choice, its what he afford to get on with life. I don't know if he is planning to fix it up and sell it or be buried in his old age in the backyard. Its looks like he has his hands full triaging what needs to be done first. He is in NE CT which is not an earthquake zone. Straps at intervals tied to building structure is going to stiffen things up and allow him to concentrate on far more pressing items. If he keeps an eye on it and it looks to be getting worse he can get it in the budget. If it is a foundation issue which is not unusual there are fixes that are code accepted that do not require removal.

 

[bholler]

When you guys say sway, do you mean you shove it and the thing wiggles around like a wet noodle? Rocks back and forth? Wow.

Yes most move some but if they aren't attached they can move allot.

 

[bholler]

2-5 tonne of brick is not going to be fine with a few straps. When brick ties are used they are every few rows... If you can move it by hand then the wind is able to move it. This will over time crack and separate the liner or worse crack and separate the brick causing it to come down.

Yes it absolutely will be just fine with a strap in the middle and one at the top. The op said it hasn't pulled away from the house which tells me the foundation is sound it just needs to be stabalized. If it had pulled away from the house that indicates a foundation problem and straps would not be adequate. But that simply is not the case.

 

[begreen]

Assuming that the chimney was maybe properly installed and there is a 1" gap between it and the house, how does one maintain the 1" gap while strapping the chimney. 1/2" cement board spacer strips, doubled up at the strap area?

 

[bholler]

Assuming that the chimney was maybe properly installed and there is a 1" gap between it and the house, how does one maintain the 1" gap while strapping the chimney. 1/2" cement board spacer strips, doubled up at the strap area?

It is for an oil furnace the gap is not required. It is very difficult to properly support a chimney that is built with the gap.

 

[zrock]

building code must be way different across the border... no building inspector or contractor would allow for just a few straps to hold up a chimney. infact a good inspector would have caught that at the sale of the house so purchaser could have worked the replacement into the price of home

 

[bholler]

building code must be way different across the border... no building inspector or contractor would allow for just a few straps to hold up a chimney. infact a good inspector would have caught that at the sale of the house so purchaser could have worked the replacement into the price of home

The fact is that as long as the chimney has a good foundation a couple straps is all that is needed to keep that structure from moving. They are in no way holding up the chimney the foundation is doing that. Is it to code? No but it is perfectly safe and the op is not required to bring it up to code at all. There is absolutely no reason for replacement from what we have heard here.

I can also tell you that in most cases the wall ties are simply nailed into the sheathing with roofing nails and really don't do a very good job of stopping movement anyway.

 

[acesneights1]

Thanks for the repiles. Yes the foundation is solid and there are no evident craxks in it. Infact we had a pretty nasty wind over the weekend and it did not move. A little further investigation at town hall shows the house was torn down and rebuilt but they saved the original foundation and poured about 18” onit o raise the house for a bomb shelter.the chimeny looks like maybe it was never brick tied or they saved it and built back around it.