Need Suggestions for Wood-Burning Insert Replacement

[jjbaer]

I have an older Buck Stove (non catalytic, model 27,000 I think) wood burning insert and was thinking about replacing it with a newer insert. My stove has a large fire chamber and burns well but it goes through wood very fast since it's an older model and isn't air tight. I think it dates back to at least 1997 or before. Also, since it's not air-tight I don't let it burn overnight.

My questions are these: 1) thoughts on if/if not to replace it 2) suggestions on various small to mid sized inserts with nice large viewing areas and that are RELIABLE that I might replace it with, 3) cat vs non-cat and 3) any other recommendations in general. Thanks!

 

[Hogwildz]

I have an older Buck Stove (non catalytic, model 27,000 I think) wood burning insert and was thinking about replacing it with a newer insert. My stove has a large fire chamber and burns well but it goes through wood very fast since it's an older model and isn't air tight. I think it dates back to at least 1997 or before. Also, since it's not air-tight I don't let it burn overnight.

My questions are these: 1) thoughts on if/if not to replace it
Loading & using less wood= less money, possibly longer , cleaner burns. If ya have the cash, maybe replace. Maybe do it now instead of down the road when circumstances may be different.

2) suggestions on various small to mid sized inserts with nice large viewing areas and that are RELIABLE that I might replace it with,
All I know is my Summit, but this is large. I have heard great things on the Vista(small) & Pacific(medium).
Hearthstone's Morgan has a larger viewing area then my Summit. (broken link removed to http://www.chimneysweeponline.com/viewwoodi.htm)
there's a few on there with viewing area sizes.


3) cat vs non-cat and 3) any other recommendations in general. Thanks!

Dunno nothing bout cats, but I like my non cat Summit. Burns great, clean. That Morgan is 4.2 gph I think, seems high for a smaller insert, but still EPA approved.

Its all a preference and narrow down task. Reading the reviews on here helped me narrow it down. https://www.hearth.com/ratings/search.php

 

[elkimmeg]

If you have a Check out the centry is is identicle to this
DUTCHWEST Plate Steel DW2500X01

The certury 2500 insert is the same stove as the Dutch west

Lowes are having fire sales so check them out

 

[PacificGuyInCNY]

Definitely go for a modern state of the art insert, you won't regret it. Take a little while, do your research on the boards here and wherever and above all ask around and find a reputable dealer. As for catalytics the few guys I know that have 'em hate 'em but some of the best brains on this board really like theirs. Figure out the sq footage of your house and if you wanna heat the whole place go for an insert that's rated maybe 30% higher as those ratings are notoriously optimistic.

One of my favorite sites for basic reading is the Chimney Sweep Online at

(broken link removed to http://www.chimneysweeponline.com/library.htm) , the owner Tom is a member of this board.

 

[seaken]

I have an older Buck Stove (non catalytic, model 27,000 I think) wood burning insert and was thinking about replacing it with a newer insert. My stove has a large fire chamber and burns well but it goes through wood very fast since it's an older model and isn't air tight. I think it dates back to at least 1997 or before. Also, since it's not air-tight I don't let it burn overnight.

My questions are these: 1) thoughts on if/if not to replace it 2) suggestions on various small to mid sized inserts with nice large viewing areas and that are RELIABLE that I might replace it with, 3) cat vs non-cat and 3) any other recommendations in general. Thanks!

Could you have meant 1977? Seems a stove made in 1997 would be closer to modern EPA stoves. Maybe it's in the exempt category?

Anyway, small and large viewing do not usually go together. The Osburn seems to be the best glass area for a small insert. Although the Small WinterWarm has a pretty large glass also. I wouldn't worry about catalytic vs non-cat unless you really hate cleaning and maintenance. If you keep your oil changed and paint your house it won't matter. If you don't like to clean or maintain stuff you should go Non-cat with a firebrick box and secondary air tubes or baffle. Something like the Lopi Answer, or Avalon Pendleton, maybe a Pacific Energy.

 

[PacificGuyInCNY]

Something like the Lopi Answer, or Avalon Pendleton, maybe a Pacific Energy.

Maybe a Pacific Energy? Maybe???????? ;-P

 

[Roospike]

Hey ! I know , How about a Pacific Energy stove!?

 

[wg_bent]

Hey ! I know , How about a Pacific Energy stove!?

And ya gotta get the baby blue... forget the red. (or was that take the red(s) man)

 

[elkimmeg]

Can't be another PE stove this forum had used up its quota for the year. We need some balance like a Jotul.
Mike Can't be the only member with one

 

[jjbaer]

[Could you have meant 1977? Seems a stove made in 1997 would be closer to modern EPA stoves. Maybe it's in the exempt category?

Thanks...am looking at these and others now. As for the stoves age, I should have looked at the tag when I had it out 2 months ago but didn't. When we bought the house in 1998, the Buck Stove insert was already there. It has double doors with a sliding air intake at the bottom of each door and wood handles on a spring on each door. It has a 3-speed blower control on the bottom RHS and has three hot air vents (one horizontal vent on the top and a vertical vent on each side) and two vertical air intakes on each side.

 

[wg_bent]

Can't be another PE stove this forum had used up its quota for the year. We need some balance like a Jotul.
Mike Can't be the only member with one

I'd like to hear from some more of the Morso folks. I know Kevin and he likes his stove, but his is a very conventional stove very similar to many of the Jotul or VC cast stoves. How about anyone out there with

Anyone with an 8100 series or a 2040?

Even if we must endure another person with a PE stove, how about someone with a Fusion?

Anyone out there with a Scan?

How about one of them Aussie Cook stoves? Sure would be neat the hear from someone who heats and cooks on one of them consistantly.

Back to topic: But this was thread was about inserts. I know Elk (did you elk? not sure) and others have said that the Winterwarm inserts have some flaws and may be in a redesign phase. Maybe wait till their out?

I sure like the Lopi Revere also.

 

[citizanken]

Be sure to check out the Hearthstone Morgan. I have not used this insert, but I have the bigger model, and we really like it. The Morgan has a large viewing area, but its looks are not for everyone.

 

[Highbeam]

I am in a similar boat. I just moved into a home with a Lopi insert. The big one. I thought it would be too big but it just barely keeps up with the leaks of this old home.

Anyway, I had to pull the stove out to read the tag and find that the stove was from 1992. Since the regs haven't changed since 1990(?) or so then is there really a benefit to buying newer? Seems that anything made since 1990 should be just as airtight as the modern stoves and don't think getting a new stove will let you stoke the box for the night and sleep soundly, just read about the runaway stoves on this site.

There are lots of nice new stoves and I would love one but be sure that you will be getting an improvement in efficiency, performance, or something before spending the big bucks.

 

[Rhone]

I personally don't look at the grams, the old stoves put out 30-50 gph there isn't a big difference with today between one putting out 2.9 vs 4.2 gph and the test to determine the gph is heavily based on how good the rep is to handle it because the rep shifts, pokes, and maneuvers the pile during the test. Could just be the day Hearthstone sent their rep for the Morgan testing he had an off day or wasn't particularly skilled. If you accumulate the 1.3 gph difference, burning 8 hours a day for 6 months that 1.3 gph will add up to 4.25 lbs of unburned wood you sent out the flue per year, that's about a split. Is it worth sacrificing a 58% bigger view to save a split/year, that is left to the individual. The cat vs. non-cat I don't think it makes a big difference. The cat you can't engage it until it reaches a certain temp and offers a little more of a failure point and maintenance but once engaged you can forget about it and they let you burn slower. With secondary burn, on occasion the logs will collapse on themselves extinguishing secondary burn and the fire smolders. If I notice I shift the logs around to start it back up, that's not a problem with a cat. It doesn't happen often, but it does happen.

The Morgan has a bit more even heat, well built, big window, soapstone which should last the life of the unit, but more expensive & needs a 36" clearance above it.

The PE I think are the low maintenance & most feature champs, but their windows are smaller than normal. They have one of the best air wash systems so stay particularly clean. Their inserts (most if not all) allow for outside combustion air (or basement if chimney is inside) which is unique to them and offer big warranties and very easy to maintain.

The Osburn offers a bay window view and for price I think it's hard to beat it's view.

Jotul have a unique nice gothic look to them.

I know I missed some. In the end, I don't think you can go wrong with whatever you pick. I'd pick one that you like the look of most because you'll be looking at it, a lot, even in summer. You better like what you're looking at.

 

[jjbaer]

I am in a similar boat. I just moved into a home with a Lopi insert. The big one. I thought it would be too big but it just barely keeps up with the leaks of this old home.

Anyway, I had to pull the stove out to read the tag and find that the stove was from 1992. Since the regs haven't changed since 1990(?) or so then is there really a benefit to buying newer? Seems that anything made since 1990 should be just as airtight as the modern stoves and don't think getting a new stove will let you stoke the box for the night and sleep soundly, just read about the runaway stoves on this site.

There are lots of nice new stoves and I would love one but be sure that you will be getting an improvement in efficiency, performance, or something before spending the big bucks.

I know it's much older than 1998...it was there in 1998 when we moved in....it has slider air vents and that's it...not cat device, no secondary burn......I throw in 4 splits and gone in 2 hrs to coals...If I damp it down and with no secondary burn I think I'd get cresote......

 

[Roospike]

Even if we must endure another person with a PE stove, how about someone with a Fusion?

Actually , the Pacific Energy - Fusion , Spectrum, Super 27 and the "Pacific" insert are all the same fire box , same stove .

 

[cammer]

I have a PE Pacific insert that works great. I will not say how it compares to anything else on the market right now because I have no idea. Viewing area seems large to me for a 2000sqft stove though I haven't seen a great number of other manufacturer's inserts. Glass stays VERY clean - I just don't ever need to clean it. Blower warranty is 5 yrs (most others that I considered were 1 yr).

Good luck in your search.

 

[Alphonse]

In response to Citazenken's suggestion to check out the Hearthstone Morgan:

I have the Morgan. If you want an insert that produces a pretty fire, the Morgan is a candidate.

If you want an insert that produces any sort of heat, that is well built, that has an air control that lets you control the rate of burn, a blower that blows hot air at a speed that isn't too loud to tolerate.... I could go on, but you get the idea - don't get this insert.

I'm in the process of returning my second one (so it wasn't that I got a lemon the 1st time), and then I'll be in your shoes, looking for a good product. I'm considering the Regency 2400, the Hampton, and the Jotul Kennebec. Some of these may be too big for you, altho the Regency and Jotul come in smaller sizes.

I had the VC Winterwarm Small at a previous location, and an Ashley stove way before that, so I am familiar with how a stove or insert can and should perform.

Citazenken - I'm interested to hear that you like your Clydesdale. If we had gotten any sort of support from Hearthstone, I would consider it. If it works well for you, it must have a different design than the Morgan.

If Hearthstone ever does respond to my dealer’s queries, I will update this message. But so far, nothing.

 

[jjbaer]

I've been researching almost every insert out there and by the time I weed out those that: 1) won't fit, 2) are not what my wife would allow in the room or 3) those I can't meet clearences on even with heat shields, then I'm down to the VC Winterwarm series and maybe the Jotul......

I went to see a VC WinterWarm Large a few days ago and it was very nice.....I think it has the second largest glass area of any insert...about 253 sq inches. It also takes 24" logs, has an ash pan, is cast iron and you can burn it with the door open and a screen installed. I saw it burning in both cat and non-cat modes and both were very beautiful. The fans are noiseless...I mean I had to put my ear to the insert to hear them running. Also, the door is interlocked to the cat bypass so you can't open it unless it's in non-cat mode which prevents back-puffing. Still looking at more just in case I missed something.....

 

[begreen]

I'd take a look at the Jotul Kennebec. It has a good reputation for reliability.

 

[jjbaer]

I'd take a look at the Jotul Kennebec. It has a good reputation for reliability.

I think Jotul really DOESN'T want to sell these inserts...........

1) the model 450 shows a requirement of 42" to the mantle with a shield but there are NO provisions for trim being closer...in fact, trim clearances aren't even mentioned......so, since I have trim at 41" then I can't use this one....

2) the model 350 says trim no closer than 41" and while I meet that requirement, the closest the mantle can be is 53" and guess what....unlike the 450 where a heat shield reduces the mantle clearance, the model 350 has NO provision for a shield.......


so.........unless this is a typo and the 350 is suppose to be able to be used with a shield, then I can't use either one.......

What I'm seeing in every one of these inserts with few exceptions is that clearance requirements kill you unless you use some ugly shield. The VC WWL is another story...they must have engineered the heat flow very well because their clearances to trim and mantle with NO heat shield is almost the lowest I've seen....38.5" to trim and/or mantle and I can meet both of these.