New Damper installed, no screen?

[8686]

Hi guys! New homeowner and new fireplace user. We had problems with smoke/water coming into our house. The chimney guy came over and said we need a new damper. So he charged us $600 for a new top lock damper, fixed cracking/flaking flue at the top, and some sealant where the chimney touches the house. He was done in about 30 minutes. Aside from feeling totally ripped off, the fireplace draft is much better and we have not experienced any leaks since.

So, the guy put a top-lock damper with no cover or screen. We had a screen on it to begin with. At first I didn't think about it, but now...

Here are my concerns. Can you please tell me if I am overthinking it and should just leave it alone or if my concerns are valid.

1. animals/rain. There are usually hot embers left at night and I like to leave the damper open until the morning. I feel the fire could ignite and want to leave it open for smoke to exit also.

2. Snow/ice. I am afraid that snow will cover it and ice will freeze it shut rendering it useless in a snow storm.

3. Fire concern? The screen also serves as a spark arrester too.

Thanks everyone.

 

[Nick Mystic]

Is this new top lock damper recessed down below the top of the chimney opening? It sounds like you just have a clay tile flue with no flex liner since you have a fireplace as opposed to an insert or stove. If the new damper is below the top of the clay tile flue and would not be interfered with if you put a rain cap/screen on the top of the flue, then I don't see what the problem would be with doing this. For sure, you are thinking straight about not closing that damper down at night, or any time, if there is a chance you still have any hot coals still in the fireplace. That would be a good recipe for carbon monoxide poisoning.

 

[EatenByLimestone]

Welcome to the forum!

He might not have ripped you off, what were the other quotes you got?

You needed chimney maintenance and he provided it. It might have been more than you wished he would have charged, but once given an idea of what he wanted to do you could have looked for other quotes, done the work yourself, or chosen not to have the work done. He has tools and vehicles to maintain. I'm betting his insurance isn't the cheapest either. He is at constant risk of falling off the roof and if the cause of a fire is traced back to work he did he's got quite a lawsuit on his hands.

As to your worries, all worries are valid. Just some are more apt to happen than others.

1. animals/rain. There are usually hot embers left at night and I like to leave the damper open until the morning. I feel the fire could ignite and want to leave it open for smoke to exit also.

It's good to leave the damper open until all of the coals go out. Otherwise you could have carbon monoxide, smoke, and a whole host of other nasties building up in your house. I don't think animals would want to climb down a chimney with all that stuff coming up it. I'm pretty sure the smell of a fresh fire will keep them out in the few hours between the fire going out and you getting around to closing the damper.

2. Snow/ice. I am afraid that snow will cover it and ice will freeze it shut rendering it useless in a snow storm.

That's pretty valid. I haven't heard of this happening, but that doesn't mean it hasn't happened, especially if you get an ice storm. If it does happen I guess that's motivation to get the ladders out and climb up there to chip it. The fireplace may be your backup source of heat.

3. Fire concern? The screen also serves as a spark arrester too.

Also valid, but I wouldn't worry about this. Many screens have half inch openings and that would be a pretty large spark/ember flying up. I'm not saying it can't happen, but the odds are against it. Screens can also become clogged with ash and creosote.

I have one you didn't think of... bees

Bees wouldn't be deterred by a screen and can shut your flue down. With the top seal they won't be building a nest in there. I had yellowjackets decide to live in my chimney this year. It surprised the heck out of me when I went to light the woodstove this fall. I thought I was set to burn since I had swept it last spring.

Capping off the top and closing the old damper on the bottom should help keep heat in the house which should save you a bit on heating too.

Matt

 

[8686]

Is this new top lock damper recessed down below the top of the chimney opening?

Yes, the brick chimney stops a couple feet above the house, the crown, and then the damper. When it is closed it looks like the whole thing is flush. When open, you can see the top pop up.

 

[8686]

Welcome to the forum!

He might not have ripped you off, what were the other quotes you got?
He did a chimney cleaning and crown repair about 3 months ago. I got about 4 estimates that time and liked him the best. What prompted this repair is that water was entering the chimney and flowing through the brick in front of the fireplace and into our rug. Just some small spots, but just wanted to get it done quickly.

He has tools and vehicles to maintain. I'm betting his insurance isn't the cheapest either. He is at constant risk of falling off the roof and if the cause of a fire is traced back to work he did he's got quite a lawsuit on his hands. Yes, this makes sense. It's just, from my experience, most jobs are done on a time basis. The guy was there literally for 30 minutes. How big/challenging a job could it have been for 30 minutes of a job and a bill for $600? But time was of the essence and it seems the job is done.

I'm pretty sure the smell of a fresh fire will keep them out in the few hours between the fire going out and you getting around to closing the damper.I just hope I don't forget to close it.

especially if you get an ice storm.
This is probably my biggest concern. A big pile of snow could easily keep this thing down.

Didn't think of bees/wasps. The damper he installed looks very cheap. It's this one. They sell another kind that is just like the first but has the top and cage around it. Albeit, more expensive.

Before I noticed the leaks we had a constant stream of air coming into the house from the fireplace. It's a downstairs fireplace of a high-ranch. This was largely due to the broken damper. After he put the new damper on the draft was cut down considerably. However there is still a draft. I thought the new damper should seal it up completely. No air. I feel like if there is still air coming in then rain can still come in. There are cracks all over the chimney too. He patched them up for me, but still, there is air coming into the house. I have a piece of foam weather stripping in between the glass doors on my fireplace.

Oh, there is no bottom damper just the top. I have that metal pull cord.

I appreciate all the comments.

 

[EatenByLimestone]

I've seen a number of people around my area with the one like you have installed. I like that 2nd one! I don't think you'll ever get a perfect seal on it. There are air bladders I've seen for sale like this one. They seem like they'd work, but I've never tried one.

(broken link removed to http://www.chimneyballoon.us/chimneyballoon.html)

 

[BrotherBart]

Little late now but this is my favorite chimney top damper and cap.

http://www.woodlanddirect.com/Chimney/Top-Sealing-Chimney-Dampers/Lyemance-Damper-Energy-Saving

http://www.woodlanddirect.com/Chimney/Top-Sealing-Chimney-Dampers/Lyemance-Damper-Energy-Saving

The one you have will be fine. Nothing is gonna set up housekeeping in that chimney while a fire is burning or the damper is closed.

 

[bholler]

the draft you feel is probably just from the cold air in the chimney dropping I assume it is an outside chimney. if so heated air goes up is stopped by the top sealer cools and comes back down. it could need adjusted if so you just need to shorten the cable no big deal. there should not be any water coming down the flue with that type of damper but you said there are allot of cracks? if so they can let allot of water into the structure. I agree that the price is pretty high unless he repointed it if he just sealed the cracks with caulk it is pretty high. and it will make it a pain in the ass for the person who goes to actually fix the problem by cutting out the mortar and repointing.