New guy with lots of questions

[csludtke]

I am in the midst of an extensive remodel. The oldest section of the house has a massive stone fireplace. Inside of the fireplace. Based upon dates found scribbled on the chimney, I think the fireplace was build in 1953. The stone and mortar are dirty, but in good shape. On all sides of the firebox, there is approximately 3 to 4 feet of stone and mortar to an elevation of around 10 feet until the structure begins to taper. I believe the whole structure is semi-solid and void of combustable material (wood internal structure). The total chimney height is over 22 feet.

It appears as if a "heat circulating" Heatilator type of zero clearance insert was used. It is about 38 inches wide by 30 or so inches tall. It has two room air "intake" vents located on the bottom of each side of the firebox. It has a large "internal air exhaust" vent positioned about 8 inches above the firebox. You can see 4 tubes that I believe originate from the intake vents (interior air) and exhaust from the vent above the fire box. It appears as

The fire box is lined with a steel shell. The steel is cracked and significantly corroded. The fire box is missing the damper.
We live in an area with strong winds. An external air vent on is connected from the outside to above the built in firebox.

We have had several fires. The system appears to suck out all of the good air from the house and force it up the chimney. Radiant heat will make the immediate area comfortable but almost freeze other areas of the house.

When the conditions are not optimum, (wind, fire dwindling, etc), a very significant amount of the wood products of combustion enter the living area.

So,

For the past several winters we have sealed the box with a tight fitting foam panel. Strong winds have blown that out several times. When there is no fire, a significant amount of cold air comes throught the upper vent.

I would like some ideas. Is it possible to remove the existing box:? Can I install a fireplace insert (the air passage up the chimney is blocked with the "four tubes" described above. What would the level of difficulty be to install a fireplace or fireplace insert and connect the combustion air supply to the outside?

Oh, I live in the mountains. I have an abundant supply of fuel. I am not interested in a nat gas solution.

 

[begreen]

Welcome. The Superior heatform is not a ZC, it is a metal masonry form fireplace. It sounds rusted out. If so I think it is going to require taking a torch and cutting it out followed by a rebuilding of the masonry shell. You should have it inspected and gone over by a mason first. After the rebuild an insert could be installed or perhaps a freestanding stove could be placed in front? Can you post a picture or two of the existing unit? How large is the current fireplace opening?

Here is a similar situation:
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/old-fireplace-problem.50677/

 

[branchburner]

The system appears to suck out all of the good air from the house and force it up the chimney. Radiant heat will make the immediate area comfortable but almost freeze other areas of the house..

Yup, a pretty good description of a typical fireplace.

Consider, rather than an insert you could also install a free-standing stove. Either way, you will want a 6" liner installed to exhaust. And while many do connect the combustion air supply to the outside, that is not generally necessary.

 

[fossil]

If it were me, I'd be thinking about rip-out/demo of the existing, rebuild/repair the masonry as needed, and installation of a nice freestanding woodburner as a hearth stove with the attendant full stainless liner of the flue and a block-off plate at the top of the firebox. Very effective, efficient heating off the living space with none of the problems you're experiencing now. Won't be cheap, but it'll be a quality solution. Rick

 

[csludtke]

Thanks for your help. I really appreciate it.

I have attached some pictures and I have examined the interior of the firebox more thouroughly (I have an appointment with a Sweep that has a camera). I will ask the Sweep if there is evidence of a chimney fire or not.

As near as I can tell all of the masonry is in very good condition. I cannot significantly mark by scraping any of the masonry inside or outside of the fire box (what I can reach). From a masonry perspective, everything looks good. From a metal perspective, one of the pictures shows a very large crack in the middle of the back wall. I believe that this crack is responsible for a lot of the smoke that enters the house.

I am exploring the following options:

• Afford later - $15k ? - have professional install a large Fireplace like a Napolean NZ6000.
• Afford later - $7k ? - Cut out vents and fill with similar stone, cut circular hole in throat/smoke shelf and line with stainless , fill firebox with masonry to eliminate new fires in box and "plumb" for an external stove (wall would be filled in with stone with only a vent for the stove protruding from the rock wall)
• Install fireplace insert $7k - Fill in top vent with masonry. Cut out circular hole in throat/smoke shelf and line with stainless

Other ideas (probably bad ideas)

• Weld and seal crack in metal and wait until lottery is won.

I am interested in a very rough estimate for the above options.

 

[begreen]

Looks like the center two heat tubes could be cut out and then a liner can pass down through there connected to an insert. That would probably be the least expensive solution. If chosen a plaque needs to be affixed to the back wall of the fireplace saying that it is no longer usable as an open fireplace and must have an insert installed.