New Woodstock Fireview owner.....

[sailor61]

After several months of being on the fence I finally did it, ordered the Fireview about an hour ago and just put the check in the mail. Went for the light grey and ordered the rear heatshield and spacers for the rear wall. Not quite certain what the final install will look like but I'm slowly pulling an idea together; hearth area will the natural stone pebbles laid in tile sheets (got a great deal on it, about $2/sq ft rather than the usual 20) over cement board. Stove will sit on an exisitng copper pad on top of the hearth. The false rear wall (raised an inch off wall) will be also be cement board but covered with copper - depending on metal price when I get to that point. As I said, it's pulling together. Will post some pics when it's complete in a few months.

Saw the post about the current sale and couldn't put it off any longer. 600 dollar asvings onteh stove and freight of $75 to RI - brought the entire package down into the range of other units I have been looking at. Now, it's just a matter of getting the install completed..............

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Hope you've made a good purchase there. I'm not quite understanding your idea of stone pebbles in tile sheets though. Could you explain that for me?

btw, we also had decided to get a Fireview. However, we called to order the stove and after talking with their general manager yesterday, I simply said, "Thank you," and hung up the phone. This lady sounded to me to be a but full of herself and would not honor the 6 mo. guarantee as stated by other people whom I had already discussed this with. So, guess we look hard at Hearthstone and a few others again.

 

[Todd]

You'll love the stove. Too bad winters allmost over. Good luck on the install.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Todd, why do you think we would love the stove? Are they that good?

I was right now answering a letter that Woodstock had sent to me. Apparently they are not willing to bend though on the guarantee. We were told before that if we bought the stove and did not install and burn the stove before the next heating season that the 6 month wouldn't start until then. Now they say they won't do that. I have a definite problem with any company that tells you different answers to the same question. Appears to me to be a lie. The bad thing about lying is that it soon becomes a habit....especially with someone who is selling you a product or service. (Yes, I have been involved in sales! Honest sales at that.)

 

[Todd]

Hope you've made a good purchase there. I'm not quite understanding your idea of stone pebbles in tile sheets though. Could you explain that for me?

btw, we also had decided to get a Fireview. However, we called to order the stove and after talking with their general manager yesterday, I simply said, "Thank you," and hung up the phone. This lady sounded to me to be a but full of herself and would not honor the 6 mo. guarantee as stated by other people whom I had already discussed this with. So, guess we look hard at Hearthstone and a few others again.

What do you mean "wont honor the 6 month guarantee?" Is that because of the new sale price? I'd still go with it if I were you. I think they are great stoves. Must of caught her on a bad day.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Todd, we might have disregarded this issue if we hadn't been told first that they would honor the guarantee beginning next fall. Glad to hear they are good stoves. We are just a bit gun shy now because of an apparent lie. It is difficult to believe something once you've been lied to.

btw, she did agree to extend the offer to March 2, but said no on the guarantee except for the parts guarantee. They would extend that to the end of December 2008. The 6 month would extend to the end of 2007.

 

[sailor61]

Never entered my mind to question the six month money back guarantee - to be honest figured their lack of exposure on that was one reason they were willing to offer such a steep discount.

After thinking about it for a few minutes I gave them a call back and explained that I had purchased the stove this morning and already mailed the check - that what I wanted was to clarify the money back guarantee terms. The fellow at Woodstock very clearly stated that the clock starts ticking from the date they ship the stove, not when it is received, installed or used and that they did not offer any sort of seasonal extension on that.

Not sure what happened in this other case - possibly a salesman made a mistake. No matter what, they are making it clear now.

Tom

 

[Backwoods Savage]

The did agree to extend the warranty to December 31, 2007 but not beyond that. The first guy I talked to quite some time ago said something entirely different. When I explained that we do not have a back-up heating system and we would not be installing the stove until this coming summer, he informed me that under those circumstances they usually started the six month period at the start of next fall's heating season.

The lady wrote to me this morning to apologize. My answer to her was that there were a couple issues. The only one I will mention here is the six month thing. I gave her a list of things and and at the end stated that we consider the heating season to begin September 15 here in Michigan. Based upon that, six months would be from September 15 until March 15. So, if she was not willing to extend that guarantee another 2 1/2 months, thank you and goodbye.

Some will think I am bull-headed about a trivial thing, but remember that this was only the final issue. It is also interesting that when someone (or company) lies about one thing, they usually lie about others. That part really worries me.

 

[Corie]

Find another stove company willing to let you use a stove for six monthes and then take it back, no questions asked.



Good luck.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Evidently my last post did not take.

Corie, that guarantee is not now the issue. The real issue is the lie. What I say to anyone who lies to me is, "If you lied to me about that, what else have you lied about?" Sales people of all people MUST NOT LIE.


Also, my apologies to sailor61 as I really did not mean to cut in with this on his thread. I probably should have started a new thread but did not expect much response.

 

[sailor61]

Dennis,

Their willingness to extend the guarantee until December for you makes me wonder if I should call them back and go for the same deal. Based on their reputation I'm not overly concerned about being unhappy with the stove but it couldn't hurt to be on the cautious side. Did they also agree to extend the regular parts warranty and, if so, how long?

Tom

 

[Gunner]

I wouldn't worry about the "6 month no questions asked" return but thats just me. All reports say that these are damn good stoves.

 

[Mo Heat]

The word "lie" seems so harsh. Even good people (or company representatives) occasionally make honest mistakes, don't they? I know I've had to reverse positions on occasion after becoming aware of new information. But we all get to set our own standards, and if you feel someone lied to you deliberately, with malice, or from incompetence, then you may want to buy somewhere else, even if they offer a superior product. Your call, of course.

 

[rmcfall]

Do you really believe that she LIED to you, thereby having an intention to deceive you? I imagine she was probably misinformed herself or confused. I own a Keystone and have dealt with Woodstock via both the phone and email, and my experiences have been very positive. In fact, I was impressed at how willing they were to answer my numerous questions. In addition, I was surprised at how patient they were with me, as demonstrated by some of the rather lengthy phone calls I had with them. I find this type of customer service to be a rarity.

So again, do you really believe that the INTENTION was to LIE to you...to DECEIVE you into believing something that wasn't true? I imagine it was probably more an error due to some sort of misunderstanding that occurred, and not a calculated lie.

Evidently my last post did not take.

Corie, that guarantee is not now the issue. The real issue is the lie. What I say to anyone who lies to me is, "If you lied to me about that, what else have you lied about?" Sales people of all people MUST NOT LIE.


Also, my apologies to sailor61 as I really did not mean to cut in with this on his thread. I probably should have started a new thread but did not expect much response.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Well, let me say this. My wife and I talked at length about this and we have agreed that if the company will bend, then we will also bend (and hope for the best). So if the company will not bend for 2 1/2 months, then there are other stove companies out there that we can deal with who are just as helpful. For instance, you might be hard pressed to top Lehman's for customer service and we have had one, and only one other offer from a LOCAL dealerthat if we purchased one of their stoves, they would take it back if we were not satisfied. This from a dealer who has been in business a long, long time and has a great reputation. He also handles soapstone stoves from Hearthstone and other type stoves from many companies. He also handles wood pellet stoves and corn burners. He also handles regular furnaces. In short, he is very well known and has an excellent reputation. From Woodstock, all I have is pictures and what I hear on forums such as this. We have never even seen a Woodstock stove and we live in a state where many people heat with wood. (I also have been in thousands of homes through my working years and never saw one.)

So, I agree, it may not have been an intentional lie. However, when I asked about this when placing my order, the way this person came across was not very professional and when the condition was not met, we simply decided, no thank you. I in no way intend to do this company any harm as I am certain they have thousands of satisfied customers and will have more in the future. I was only stating why I did not buy.

 

[rmcfall]

I hear what you are saying and can understand your frustration. If you can put that aside, keep in mind that the Woodstock stoves are extremely well built stoves. While I have only personally owned one other stove, I have seen other stoves in people's homes before, and I can say without hesitation that the Woodstock stove I have is like a well crafted piece of furniture. This isn't to say that the other stove I had and the stoves I have seen elsewhere weren't nice, but that the craftsmenship behind the Woodstock stoves seems to me to be superior. Without question, I believe the Keystone I have is a quality piece of work. Just my 2 cents...

 

[begreen]

The stove company has no idea what you will do with the stove once you get it. For all they know you'll be running it outside as a barbeque. I think they are being fair. If you want the generous discount, then accept the terms.

 

[Corie]

I agree.

You're asking for the equivalent of buying a car now because of discount and then promising you won't drive it until next year. Therefore the warranty shouldn't begin until next year. I doubt you'll find a car dealership willing to take you up on that offer.

Not trying to be curt or a pain in the butt, but you're REALLY asking a lot to expect them to do this for you.

 

[Sandor]

Right on Corie.

Sometimes not accepting some customers can be a good business decision.

This lady wanted me to build her a home several years ago. After about an hour discussing the house with her, I determined she would not be a good customer. I told her flat out that I would not build her a home, and to go elsewhere. You should have seen the look on her face! Some people will never be happy, no matter what you do. None of us are perfect.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

You folks might be interested to know that the folks at Woodstock have not given up....nor have we. We're working on it.

I agree that it appears their product is good. However, comparing this with buying a car is...well, I won't get into that one. No sense in getting something else started here. And Sandor, thanks for attempting to make me look like the goat, but nothing personal was taken. I too have turned down business in the past because of some circumstances. I've had repeat customers that I've dropped like a hot potatoe too so I understand. It is just not appreciated what you are trying to protrait here.

 

[Corie]

In the interest of not starting an enormous argument I'm going to drop it. Good luck with your stove purchase, hope you find a stove company and/or dealerthat makes you happy.

 

[webbie]

You folks might be interested to know that the folks at Woodstock have not given up....nor have we. We're working on it.

I agree that it appears their product is good.

A stove purchased now can be used for a couple months this year - perhaps up to the middle of May in Mich and New England (on occasion). Then someone can fire it up in Oct and use it until the end of Dec.

Sounds fair to me.

As far as the lie, I would call it a "lack of consistency and understanding" BUT, keep this in mind. It is you that is looking for something above and beyond what every other customer gets. In other words, you want to be treated differently than their policy and other customers. That is fine - a negotiating point - but don't expect everything to be perfectly understood once you "forge your own custom deal".

The funny thing is, knowing the folks at Woodstock well I can guess that if you never brought this up - and if your stove was 7 months old and unsatisfactory, that they would take care of it. They are into 100% customer satisfaction and will do "whatever it takes" to get this. I won't tell you that they have never had a complaint, but we have never seen one on the stove ratings nor on this board. Even one customer who returned the stoves praised them (the return was for another reason - not the stove performance).

I hope it works out. Like you, my wife often gets too involved "in the game" of buying. I just say "heck, do it". The bottom line is that you are going to get a top-notch stove for the price of a regular one, you are gonna love it, and there is almost no chance you are gonna return it.

Although there are a lot of good stoves out there, this one is a lifetime purchase.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Craig I appreciate your thoughts, however, you also are making some assumptions that just are not so.

It is true someone could make a purchase now and use it for a while this spring. However, in my initial conversation with Woodstock I made it plain that I would not be ready for the stove until after this year's heating season. If possible, I would be more than willing to pay for the stove IN FULL but not take delivery until we were ready to install it.

As for the October-December burning, you never know what you will get but one thing you know is that the real heating season doesn't begin until January. Take this winter for example. November and December were so warm that many days and nights we did not even have the stove burning. When we did, it burned so low that it would be very diffucult to judge any stove with that type of burn.

You can call it lack of consistency and understanding if you wish and you can play on words all you want but if it isn't the truth... In addition to that, you state that it is me asking for something above and beyond what other customers get. That never entered my mind! I think both selling and buying parties have to be fair.

As for Woodstock, I must give them credit as they did not give up. I had totally written them off and had even discarded all my note and literature when all of a sudden an email turned up from them. I'll not go into details here but will say that in the end this all turned out well. We will soon be owners of a Woodstock stove. The stove is paid in full although it will not be delivered immediately. Both parties are happy.

 

[webbie]

Glad to hear you made a deal. Nothing I said was meant in a personal manner - just that I looked at their sale and it said 100% clearly that unit must be shipped and 100% paid for now to qualify. So anything that is different from that is a "custom" or negotiated deal. That is beyond what most people get. No problem there - that is the nature of business and a good business can be flexible so that everyone ends up happy.

I sold $4,000-$8,000 Central heating (wood/oil) units for many years and we had spring or summer sales just like this one - maybe 10% off and free shipping and other accessories. Although we had rules (like Woodstock), you can bet that we tried to get EVERY order that came our way! A dollar now, even at a discount price, is better than a dollar later.

 

[jjbaer]

After several months of being on the fence I finally did it, ordered the Fireview about an hour ago and just put the check in the mail. Went for the light grey and ordered the rear heatshield and spacers for the rear wall. Not quite certain what the final install will look like but I'm slowly pulling an idea together; hearth area will the natural stone pebbles laid in tile sheets (got a great deal on it, about $2/sq ft rather than the usual 20) over cement board. Stove will sit on an exisitng copper pad on top of the hearth. The false rear wall (raised an inch off wall) will be also be cement board but covered with copper - depending on metal price when I get to that point. As I said, it's pulling together. Will post some pics when it's complete in a few months.

Saw the post about the current sale and couldn't put it off any longer. 600 dollar asvings onteh stove and freight of $75 to RI - brought the entire package down into the range of other units I have been looking at. Now, it's just a matter of getting the install completed..............

I think that was my post you saw...I want my 50% share of the savings....LOL.... They e-mailed me and sent me a flyer so I thought I'd share it with the rest of you...glad to see that you took advantage of it....