Non Ethanol Gas

[ScottLewis]

The place where I buy my non ethanol hasn't had any for 2 months. My current batch I mixed up 6 months ago. I mixed 50:1. How long does this stuff last?
At Lowes they sell a one quart can of pre mixed 50:1. Is the pre mixed at Lowes any good?

 

[blades]

non ethanol lasts at least 6 mo. or more. never used the premixed can stuff- way to pricy for me. other thing is how long has it been gathering dust on the shelf at the store.

 

[Eman85]

I've used non-ethanol and ethanol gas, it all works. For the price of that canned gas I'd just dump the gallon of pre-mix and drain the saw, you'd be throwing away less money then a Qt. of the canned stuff costs. You don't have to waste it put it in your lawnmower or tractor.

 

[GG Woody]

I'm assuming that you're burning it in a chainsaw...
I'd run what you have, a lot of the premix also helps with stabilizing the fuel. I've had fuel sit much longer than 6 months.
The only problems I've had with ethanol is leaving it in the tank/lines.
At work I usually just buy the premix stuff from the auto parts store, it also works as expected.

I've had problems with marked marine ethanol fuel wrecking fuel shutoffs on ATV/dirtbikes, otherwise ethanol has not caused me problems.
I would definitely pay a bit more for non-ethanol though...

 

[ScottLewis]

I have a Stihl 039. Fifteen years ago the saw quit working. The mechanic asked if I was using ethanol gas. I told him I was.
He told me the ethanol had fried the seals around the carburetor. Cost $208 to repair.

The ethanol gas worked fine for me but it fried the saw.

For me it is non ethanol only.

 

[ScottLewis]

You guys are running ethanol gas in a chainsaw with no ill effect? What chain saw?

 

[GG Woody]

You guys are running ethanol gas in a chainsaw with no ill effect? What chain saw?

Husq 2100CD, Husq 288XP, Stihl 192t, Stihl ms170, Stihl ms362CM...
All our pump gas in Canada is mandated to have ethanol, I believe aviation fuel is the only exception.

 

[Whitenuckler]

Husq 2100CD, Husq 288XP, Stihl 192t, Stihl ms170, Stihl ms362CM...
All our pump gas in Canada is mandated to have ethanol, I believe aviation fuel is the only exception.

I have non ethanol at my Petro Canada in Charlottetown. They get it from Irving in NB. I asked the delivery guy, and he said the law applies to the refinery as a whole, not to each liter made. Other pumps like Irving have the sticker "may contain up to 15% ethanol". I am super happy, but not sure how long it will last. The guy said it will propably end up getting blended.

 

[John Mc]

I have non ethanol at my Petro Canada in Charlottetown. They get it from Irving in NB. I asked the delivery guy, and he said the law applies to the refinery as a whole, not to each liter made. Other pumps like Irving have the sticker "may contain up to 15% ethanol". I am super happy, but not sure how long it will last. The guy said it will propably end up getting blended.

Make a point of letting them know you are shopping there because they carry non-ethanol gas. I tell my gas station here in Vermont that because they carry non-ethanol gas I'm buying all my gas from them whenever possible whether ethanol (for our cars) or non-ethanol (for my antique truck and all of our small engines).

 

[ABMax24]

I have non ethanol at my Petro Canada in Charlottetown. They get it from Irving in NB. I asked the delivery guy, and he said the law applies to the refinery as a whole, not to each liter made. Other pumps like Irving have the sticker "may contain up to 15% ethanol". I am super happy, but not sure how long it will last. The guy said it will propably end up getting blended.

Overall in Canada, Refineries must sell 5% of their fuel as a gasoline replacement (typically ethanol). So lots of sellers sell premium fuel that is ethanol free, and offset that with regular fuel that is a bit over 5%. It doesn't have to be much over 5% as they sell way more regular than premium.

In the other hand, some sell the ethanol in premium fuel, using to bump up the octane rating. So some premium can have 10% ethanol in it.

 

[ScottLewis]

GGWoody it is fascinating that you can run your saws using ethanol gasoline. My Stihl 039 was purchased about 30 years ago, and it was 15 years ago that it was ruined by ethanol gasoline. At that time it was common knowledge among chain saw mechanics in N. Carolina that ethanol gasoline would ruin a chain saw.
Perhaps saw manufacturers today have changed the composition of the seals near the carburetor so that they are not harmed by ethanol gas.

EMan 85 it says you are from E TN. Does that mean east Tennessee? If so you are not far from me. So you, too are running ethanol gas.

 

[Pinesmoke]

I've used ethanol gas since it's been at the pumps in all air cooled stuff. Good oil in the 2 cycles is a must in my mind from my motocross days. The only adjustment I make is the octane, 89 in the cool weather and 93 during the summer.

Never had an issue. I mix the 2 cycle in a 2 gal can so it really never is older than a month or so.

 

[Whitenuckler]

Make a point of letting them know you are shopping there because they carry non-ethanol gas. I tell my gas station here in Vermont that because they carry non-ethanol gas I'm buying all my gas from them whenever possible whether ethanol (for our cars) or non-ethanol (for my antique truck and all of our small engines).

Before I talked to a pump tech, and the tanker delivery guy, I went into the store to ask the person behind the counter. He didn't even know what I was talking about. I'm not sure how the ownership is handled.
"Petro-Canada is owned by Suncor Energy, which acquired the company in August 2009 to create Canada's leading integrated energy company. It operates as a subsidiary of Suncor, managing over 1,800 retail and wholesale locations across Canada."

 

[John Mc]

GGWoody it is fascinating that you can run your saws using ethanol gasoline. My Stihl 039 was purchased about 30 years ago, and it was 15 years ago that it was ruined by ethanol gasoline. At that time it was common knowledge among chain saw mechanics in N. Carolina that ethanol gasoline would ruin a chain saw.
Perhaps saw manufacturers today have changed the composition of the seals near the carburetor so that they are not harmed by ethanol gas.

EMan 85 it says you are from E TN. Does that mean east Tennessee? If so you are not far from me. So you, too are running ethanol gas.

Older saws definitely had a problem with ethanol blended fuels. The ethanol would attack the seals, fuel lines and the diaphragm. Moderns saws are mostly approved to run up to E10 gas (10% ethanol). The seals and fuel line materials have been updated for ethanol blends.

However, the updated materials have not eliminated all of the problems with ethanol blended fuels. The shelf life of ethanol blends is much shorter than E0 gas. In addition, ethanol is hygroscopic: it is attracted to and readily combines with water - so much so that it will pull water out of the air. This can become a real problem, especially if the fuel is not stored properly. If enough water combines with the ethanol based fuel, the water/ethanol mix settles out of the fuel (a process called "phase separation"). This water/ethanol mix is corrosive. It can attack carburetors. In 2 cycle engines, since the fuel is also the engine lube, it can attack other parts of the engine. This is where you sometimes hear chainsaw repair people talking about corrosion in the bottom end.

People who run their chainsaws frequently and turn over their fuel regularly and store it properly can usually get away with running E10 fuel. If you allow fuel to sit around for long especially in a 2 cycle engine, you might get by with ethanol blended fuel, but you are taking a real chance.

 

[GG Woody]

GGWoody it is fascinating that you can run your saws using ethanol gasoline. My Stihl 039 was purchased about 30 years ago, and it was 15 years ago that it was ruined by ethanol gasoline. At that time it was common knowledge among chain saw mechanics in N. Carolina that ethanol gasoline would ruin a chain saw.
Perhaps saw manufacturers today have changed the composition of the seals near the carburetor so that they are not harmed by ethanol gas.

EMan 85 it says you are from E TN. Does that mean east Tennessee? If so you are not far from me. So you, too are running ethanol gas.

A couple of my saws are at least 30yrs old, and my 288 sits way more than it is used. No problems, I'm surprised the 288 starts when I ask it to. It is set up as a bit of an Alaskan mill saw and not used often.
I wonder if we are even talking the same fuel composition, I believe our fuel is under 10% ethanol, maybe it's way under? I wonder if the fuel you used 15yrs ago was a similar blend, higher, or lower alcohol volume, or if some of the fuels have other additives to help? I am certain that some premix oils are going to compliment the ethanol differently.
Newer equipment will come with parts that are more compatible with ethanol.
As I mentioned before, I have had problems with our "REC" gas or as we would call it, "marine" or "marked premium" I think it must have something in it to help prevent the ethanol hygroscopic nature. Whatever is in the marked "purple" gas here wreaked havoc on multiple fuel shutoffs. (Big Bear 350, DRZ-125, KX-65, WR-450, maybe others I have forgotten... all had leaky petcocks dripping purple fuel)

 

[ScottLewis]

As I recall I was using 10 percent ethanol.

 

[salecker]

I have a Stihl 039. Fifteen years ago the saw quit working. The mechanic asked if I was using ethanol gas. I told him I was.
He told me the ethanol had fried the seals around the carburetor. Cost $208 to repair.

The ethanol gas worked fine for me but it fried the saw.

For me it is non ethanol only.

The mechanic ripped you off
There are no seals around the carburetor

 

[Eman85]

I have used gas with ethanol in it since they started selling it. I do buy the non-ethanol sometimes but not usually. I do make sure I buy some at the end of season for my mowers as it does seem to last longer and doesn't attract moisture like alcohol does. I guess one thing is I don't have a mechanic, I am one, so it's all on me to keep all of my junk running. I have more small engines then any man needs.

 

[ScottLewis]

I'm not a mechanic. I don't know exactly what parts were damaged. The ethanol destroyed some parts of the saw because, rest assured it would not run. The mechanic fixed my 039 and I was glad to pay him. I was in the middle of building a log cabin and I needed by Stihl back immediately.
Plus he gave me the tip to stay away from the ethanol gas and his tip was correct, I have had no further problems with that saw, or with my Husqvarna. I have continued to build log cabins and to cut firewood with the Stihl. In fact I was just using it on some white oak last week, what a great saw.

I have talked to mechanics at 2 other shops near here and all agree that ethanol gas will ruin a chain saw. Maybe we have a different formulation of ethanol down here compared to what y'all are using up in Canada.

 

[Dieselhead]

I bought my saw in 2008 and it’s had regular pump gas in it since. 2 stroke sthil mix is what I use, I hear it’s got a stabilizer built into it. Weather that’s true or not I’m not sure. Sometimes it’s sat almost a year and no issue to date.

 

[Max W]

Also had a saw mechanic tell me that the ethanol was causing problems with my saw, old 55 rancher. Non ethanol wasn’t available at that time. If I couldn't get that he recommended buying from a more active station where the gas wasn’t sitting long in the tanks as it might in smaller rural stations.