Old Benjamin Franklin Flue Question

[BJF]

Hi Y'all

I've got an old BF that's on it's last leg. I called our local stove guy and he recommended a Quadra-Fire 3100 Millennium as a replacement (it's a great time to buy now w/ the $300 EPA discount & the $100 rebate). A site inspection (or assessment) is scheduled for later this week. I'm wondering... Is it possible the flue we currently have might prevent us from getting the Quadra-Fire installed? It seems rather large. I actually prefer it larger than smaller... but i'm wondering if the more modern Quad will potentially require a costly flue reduction or something to that extent. Can I keep the larger flue with the Quad for cheap.... or will there need to be a major replacement? I'm not even certain what size flue is on the BF... I'm guessing 8" but it looks like it's 100 years old so I'm uncertain if they even made 8" back then. Any feedback is greatly appreciated.

 

[bholler]

Hi Y'all

I've got an old BF that's on it's last leg. I called our local stove guy and he recommended a Quadra-Fire 3100 Millennium as a replacement (it's a great time to buy now w/ the $300 EPA discount & the $100 rebate). A site inspection (or assessment) is scheduled for later this week. I'm wondering... Is it possible the flue we currently have might prevent us from getting the Quadra-Fire installed? It seems rather large. I actually prefer it larger than smaller... but i'm wondering if the more modern Quad will potentially require a costly flue reduction or something to that extent. Can I keep the larger flue with the Quad for cheap.... or will there need to be a major replacement? I'm not even certain what size flue is on the BF... I'm guessing 8" but it looks like it's 100 years old so I'm uncertain if they even made 8" back then. Any feedback is greatly appreciated.

View attachment 266187

It is probably 8" yes. And the quad may or may not work on that. Also that stove is probably from the late 70s not 100 years old

 

[BJF]

It is probably 8" yes. And the quad may or may not work on that. Also that stove is probably from the late 70s not 100 years old

Thanks bholler for helping me to confirm the flue size and date... I just saw an article on these which said...

Back in the 1970's Montgomery Wards sold a ton of these stoves. They typically had 3 legs and a set of bi fold doors on the front. They're designed to be burned with the doors open and they burned really hot, which is nice for heat output, but very unsafe.

The stove has a swinging arm inside to hang a stew pot on... so I always thought it was allot older (maybe being refurbished or something). It came with the house when we moved in around 2000. I've almost been asphyxiated by it several times.... so I figured it was made before they had all the modern safety regulations . It almost got my uncle once too. Other than that we've had few problems with it.

 

[bholler]

Thanks bholler for helping me to confirm the flue size and date... I just saw an article on these which said...

The stove has a swinging arm inside to hang a stew pot on... so I always thought it was allot older (maybe being refurbished or something). It came with the house when we moved in around 2000. I've almost been asphyxiated by it several times.... so I figured it was made before they had all the modern safety regulations . It almost got my uncle once too. Other than that we've had few problems with it.

It doesn't look like one of the montgomery ward ones. But there were many others having them made as well. And they were churning them out with little concern for safety standards. But really the safety comes down to installation and operation. Not the stove really

 

[SpaceBus]

Franklin

Antique Franklin Stoves

barnstablestove.com

If you go to the above link you will see some authentic Franklin stoves. What does your flue look like after the metal stove pipe?

 

[begreen]

The stovepipe should be 6". It will probably work ok but this depends on the chimney. Does the chimney have a clay or stainless liner? What size is it? About how tall?

 

[BJF]

Here's a shot of the pipe coming out of the roof (on Google)... it would appear to be stainless steel... maybe 6-10' high. We are installing the stove in a garage that was converted into an office. There's no brick chimney or anything.

https://www.google.com/maps/place/2...3aac2fc040847b!8m2!3d40.1098322!4d-75.2121018

Here's a pick of the top of the flue inside the house. The things that look like bricks behind the stove (in the pictures)... I believe are some kind of imitation brick heat shield... attached somehow to the wall. Potentially to prevent the garage from burning down due to the intense heat of the stove when it's lit. Maybe also to help retain the heat. I hope this answers your questions.

 

[bholler]

Here's a shot of the pipe coming out of the roof (on Google)... it would appear to be stainless steel... maybe 6-10' high. We are installing the stove in a garage that was converted into an office. There's no brick chimney or anything.

https://www.google.com/maps/place/2...3aac2fc040847b!8m2!3d40.1098322!4d-75.2121018

Here's a pick of the top of the flue inside the house. The things that look like bricks behind the stove (in the pictures)... I believe are some kind of imitation brick heat shield... attached somehow to the wall. Potentially to prevent the garage from burning down due to the intense heat of the stove when it's lit. Maybe also to help retain the heat. I hope this answers your questions.

The stove and pipe are still way to close to the wall. But it looks like double wall pipe should fix the pipe clearance

 

[SpaceBus]

It probably wouldn't be tough to bring it up to code with double wall pipe and a modern stove with good clearances.

 

[begreen]

To make this right you will need to use 6" double-wall stove pipe to the chimney support box at the ceiling. Then use an increaser to go from 6" to 8".

 

[BJF]

To make this right you will need to use 6" double-wall stove pipe to the chimney support box at the ceiling. Then use an increaser to go from 6" to 8".

I'm trying to get a ball park on the potential cost for the flue upgrades etc... to bring it up to spec... My poor old mom's paying and I want to make sure the quote from the installer isn't too inflated to break the bank. The installer hasn't arrived yet (he's coming tomorrow)... what would be a reasonable price for the flue work etc... y'all (i grew up in the south) are suggesting... $100, $500, $1000?

We're already in the hole for $1489 for the stove (w/ rebates).... and i'm avoiding purchasing the blower/fan unit ($399 is a little much). Just ordered 1/2 a cord for $130 (delivered) from a guy locally. What's a worst case scenario price wise for the flue & safety upgrades? If the installer tells me $1500 BF may be around for awhile longer.

 

[firefighterjake]

I understand wanting to save money . . . it's just that with the smaller diameter pipe you may find the stove will have a better draft and work better which will make you happier in the long run.

P.S. Not to be a Debbie Downer, but if you are ordering wood now, there is a really good chance the wood will not be seasoned to the optimum moisture level which can also be a discouraging fact for someone using an EPA stove where well seasoned wood is crucial.

 

[BJF]

I understand wanting to save money . . . it's just that with the smaller diameter pipe you may find the stove will have a better draft and work better which will make you happier in the long run.

P.S. Not to be a Debbie Downer, but if you are ordering wood now, there is a really good chance the wood will not be seasoned to the optimum moisture level which can also be a discouraging fact for someone using an EPA stove where well seasoned wood is crucial.

thanks for the heads up FFJ... after seeing BEGREENS recent post on "Dry vs. Wet Wood" I think I'm going to have to go out and get a moisture meter. I wonder how many lives could have been saved (from creosote explosions etc...) if he would have posted it sooner. Not to mention the reduction in emissions. Despite some of the hardships of Covid one thing I'm thankful for is there aren't 200 airplanes a day flying over my house.... the air smells allot cleaner than it did a few months ago. I vowed I'd never drive again... Amtrak all the way!

 

[Quadrider]

We're already in the hole for $1489 for the stove (w/ rebates).... and i'm avoiding purchasing the blower/fan unit ($399 is a little much). Just ordered 1/2 a cord for $130 (delivered) from a guy locally. What's a worst case scenario price wise for the flue & safety upgrades? If the installer tells me $1500 BF may be around for awhile longer.

Wondering what ever became of this? Did you have to upgrade the pipe? Were you able to retrofit to the existing run? Cost involve to upgrade?? We’re in a very similar situation on our 81 year old cabin purchased this past spring. Since we’re now into the rigid Up North Michigan winter, I’ve been using our Franklin Stove, but will definitely be upgrading to a more efficient and safer Modern wood stove. However we have solid 8” Vertical pipe all the way up, and I’m Not sure if I’ll need to upgrade my Pipe as well….