pacific energy Super 27 or dutchwest 2461

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@ Huntindog...I would say that those were not that good of reviews on the DW catalyst. I decided to stay with the PE super 27. The store I purchased this from said they won't carry catalyst stoves anymore cause they said...people for the most part don't want them. It sure is purty tho. Thanx for the help.
 
@ VCBurner...thank you so much for the support! Right now...I like the technology that the PE presents...and I like the idea of a lifetime warranty on the PE products. I'm hearing that the secondary burn on these are as good as the catalysts. Maybe that's true...or maybe it's not. I'm glad to know that at least it's a close second if not( I've seen the comparisons). I certainly won't have to worry about extra costs down the line. 20 years from now if my secondary chamber messes up I call up PE and they replace it.
 
certified106 said:
leeave96 said:
I think the Dutchwest cat stove are one of the best bangs for the buck. My opinion is their non-cat stoves are not so good based on comments from owners on this forum who have had trouble with their everburn system. I was leaning very strongly towards the 2461 before I bought my Englander 30. Were it not for the 30's $649 price at the time, it is very likely the DW would be in my new addition. The 2461 has a large glass, large firebox, is a cat stove, two door - side and front. I liked the front door just to make things easier to clean the glass. It has a nice ash pan too and is a convective stove. One thing with the 2461 is that you will have an 8 inch flue vs 6. Not a problem if you are going into an existing chimney of that size or a bit larger or you are putting up a new chimney.

Having said that, the PE stove are great and as begreen said, the Alderlea stoves are very nice on the eyes too.

Good luck,
Bill

Actually that is incorrect it requires a 6" flue and it has a 6" reversible flue collar. Only the XL requires recommends an 8" Flue
Here is the link to the specs. in case you need them Neumsky
http://majesticproducts.com/family/Stoves/Catalytic/DutchWest/


My bad - you are correct, thanks for setting me straight!

Bill
 
neumsky said:
@ VCBurner...thank you so much for the support! Right now...I like the technology that the PE presents...and I like the idea of a lifetime warranty on the PE products. I'm hearing that the secondary burn on these are as good as the catalysts. Maybe that's true...or maybe it's not. I'm glad to know that at least it's a close second if not( I've seen the comparisons). I certainly won't have to worry about extra costs down the line. 20 years from now if my secondary chamber messes up I call up PE and they replace it.
I doubt you will be disappointed! PE has many happy users here, good luck!
 
Was noticing...you have a Enviro and that you mentioned finally burning. Did it take you a while to set it up & why?
 
I'm not going to tell you to not go with PE, but a few owners with cracked fireboxes will tell you that a claim on the lifetime warranty is not as simple as "you call up PE, and they replace it." I'd read a few of the threads on PE warranty claims before giving that factor a lot of weight in the decision.
 
I've lost count of how many Dutchwest stoves I've repaired over the years. Never had to lay hands on a P.E. though, except replacing bricks. Super 27 gets my vote, thjough the thought of more business IS always appealing...
 
@ Den...I've heard of cracked tops or cracked anything on true cast or stone... but yet to hear of anything but warpage on steel. I'm not saying that it's not possible...but is'nt this the general consensus? And Defiant...do you work on or sell stoves? Thanx Jeff PS @ Stump...how did you come up with that name haha?
 
Stump_Branch, im the _ in the middle between two opposites like in life.
And i burn whats in between the stump and the branch.
Varies with the size of branch of course...
 
There you go...very cool!
 
Neumsky, probably the most frequent point of failure on steel stoves = the welds. . .and apparently PE had a batch of stoves a few years ago in which the welds had quality issues. Stuff happens, but PE handled it in less-than-spectacular fashion. I think it was ~ 2 years before one guy got his firebox replaced. I'd post a link, but I can't with my phone, so just search for something like "PE cracked welds" for the info. I would still choose thd PE over the DW. . .I just wouldn't get *too* excited about the lifetime warranty. I know plenty of folks who would junk stuff rather than go through a big hassle to get warranty service. BTW, there is another steel stove with a stainless baffle and lifetime warranty, the Jotul F 55, due out next month. No real specs yet, just that it's "almost 3 cu ft," according to the video on youtube. My guess is that it's basically a barebones Rangeley(no TL or ash pan), and the price will be somewhere between that of the Super 27 and the T5.
 
Ok Den...will check it out... Yes...I can understand the hassle of warranty. The Rangeley will be too much stove for us. I'm in that range for a 2. something size. Thanx so much for the info. Jeff
 
i have a PE Summit, in the basement. I'm not overly happy with it, but its ok. i bought it to replace a Large CDW 2461 that i used for a long time, running 24-7 and heating about 2800 square feet. before that i had a VC Adirondack i gave to my brother and he used for years until the bypass lever to the cat broke. I love the VC/DW stoves. I think its the cast iron vs steel. I like the cat although the Jotul i run upstairs nor the summit have them. I'll probably replace my summit for a BK princess. i'm not a big fan of the tubes.....gues i'm more of a cat person. bottom line, do your research. go look at them and decide. something you might also consider is asking your dealer if he has a satisfaction guarantee. some will let you exchange them/take them back in trade at a discounted-used price if you don't like it.....but most don't. good luck and remember......if momma ain't happy, you aren't going to be happy......no matter how good you think the stove works.

cass
 
tcassavaugh said:
i have a PE Summit, in the basement. I'm not overly happy with it, but its ok. i bought it to replace a Large CDW 2461 that i used for a long time, running 24-7 and heating about 2800 square feet. before that i had a VC Adirondack i gave to my brother and he used for years until the bypass lever to the cat broke. I love the VC/DW stoves. I think its the cast iron vs steel. I like the cat although the Jotul i run upstairs nor the summit have them. I'll probably replace my summit for a BK princess. i'm not a big fan of the tubes.....gues i'm more of a cat person. bottom line, do your research. go look at them and decide. something you might also consider is asking your dealer if he has a satisfaction guarantee. some will let you exchange them/take them back in trade at a discounted-used price if you don't like it.....but most don't. good luck and remember......if momma ain't happy, you aren't going to be happy......no matter how good you think the stove works.

cass

That's interesting people can have such varying experiences. I personally heated with a Dutchwest for 8 years and have been around them heating at my parents for about 25 years and used to swear by them for heating purposes. Now that I have the T6 I would be hard pressed to go back to the Dutchwest in my situation since I have been getting as long if not longer burn times and the house temps don't drop at night like I used to struggle with, making my morning much easier.
 
Yeah, diff'rent strokes for diff'rent folks. :) p.s. Neumsky, good deals on stoves should start popping up in another month or so. . .maybe just wait for a sweet deal on a T5, which does seem like the best fit for your preferences.
 
neumsky said:
Was noticing...you have a Enviro and that you mentioned finally burning. Did it take you a while to set it up & why?
I put a down payment on it and took five weeks to pick it up. It was the beginning of the burn season and I was itching to fire it up. However, I wanted to have the stove here before building a raised hearth and cutting wholes in the walls. So, after the stove was finally here, I started building a hearth, which BTW took a lot longer than I thought it was going to take. I was outside connecting the vertical run of exhaust pipe as the October Nor'easter was starting. In fact the first couple inches of a total 22" we got were covering the ground by the time I was done. Therefore, I was anxious to "finally" burn.
 
I love these threads you started Jeff, they have a way of grabbing people's attention. You are like the host of a debate on the most talked about topic of this site: cat vs. nc.

Defiant3, I hate to say it but people can burn up just about any stove if they don't operate them correctly. You can throw a slice of pizza in the microwave for thirty seconds and not burn it. The same slice of pizza in an oven can burn if not watched. Does that make microwaves better than stoves?

I have to say it again, my DW was pushed beyond 800° side door temp several times, no damage. Those things are built like tanks, double walled, cast iron, heating machines. Yes they can heat up quick, flue temps will go beyond 1000° within minutes if the damper is left open. The cat can go beyond 1600° warping the top of the firebox, if you just load it and leave the primary air wide open and close the bypass damper. But if you throw the wood in wait untill it catches and cat is climbing up to 300° then shut the bypass and primary air almost all the way, you will have a stove that will heat your house for the whole night or day while you are at work. It is as simple as that. Two levers, that's it. That is what makes it a great heater, its ability to heat quickly or slowly. Flexibility. It is easy to control the fire, but not everyone takes time to learn how to operate the stove. And like Hanko says, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out how to operate any stove. Some are harder than others. Furthermore, PE, although they are quality stoves can and will be damaged also if overfired constantly. Like someone said before, they have had cracked welds in the past. Another point, some members on here are comparing their twenty+ year old Federal Airtight CDW's with the post 1993 Dutchwest by Vermont Castings, they are NOT THE SAME "CAT"! Similar, yes, in size, shape, look, but dramatic changes were made to the secondary burn chamber and primate air supply. For one, the ash pan air intake was done away with. Those were a big reason why people overheated their CDW's the DW does not have an air intake there. There is an airwash, which keeps the glass clean and preheats the primary air. Replacing a cat every 6 years translates to just over $20 per year of maintenance cost. You'll save that much in wood consumption in a month! It does not take a lot to maintain the Dutchwests, or a great IQ to run them! In fact, the secondary born chamber doesn't even get dirty, with four exterior bolts you can loosen the top off and see for yourself. If you both like the Dutchwest, neither of you will be disappointed with its performance or durability.

If you go with PE, like I said before, I doubt you'll be disappointed.

PS: Those customer reviews are to be taken with a grain of salt, people don't always have the best wood, installation or knowledge on how to operate their stoves. Burning wood is not like watching
TV! Most people are not willing to do the work it takes to burn wood efficiently, starting with the fuel supply.
 
certified106 said:
tcassavaugh said:
i have a PE Summit, in the basement. I'm not overly happy with it, but its ok. i bought it to replace a Large CDW 2461 that i used for a long time, running 24-7 and heating about 2800 square feet. before that i had a VC Adirondack i gave to my brother and he used for years until the bypass lever to the cat broke. I love the VC/DW stoves. I think its the cast iron vs steel. I like the cat although the Jotul i run upstairs nor the summit have them. I'll probably replace my summit for a BK princess. i'm not a big fan of the tubes.....gues i'm more of a cat person. bottom line, do your research. go look at them and decide. something you might also consider is asking your dealer if he has a satisfaction guarantee. some will let you exchange them/take them back in trade at a discounted-used price if you don't like it.....but most don't. good luck and remember......if momma ain't happy, you aren't going to be happy......no matter how good you think the stove works.

cass

That's interesting people can have such varying experiences. I personally heated with a Dutchwest for 8 years and have been around them heating at my parents for about 25 years and used to swear by them for heating purposes. Now that I have the T6 I would be hard pressed to go back to the Dutchwest in my situation since I have been getting as long if not longer burn times and the house temps don't drop at night like I used to struggle with, making my morning much easier.
To be fair, the T6 is a bigger stove than you old CDW correct? It was an old CDW you just retired correct, not a newer model?
 
Ya, In this case, I think a T5 would more than meet neumsky's needs and is a fine stove.
 
BeGreen said:
Ya, In this case, I think a T5 would more than meet neumsky's needs and is a fine stove.
If I was given a choice of one stove and both were free I'd try the T5. Between DW2461 and T5, that is. Those Alderlea stoves are sharp looking and their performance is well documented to be exceptional.
 
VC...thanx for the compliment...I am loving the idea that we can obtain this information from a circle of mostly friendly ideas haha. Thank God this is one of the beneficial things we've been able to take advantage of. I for one...being a newby in this all am probably going to take the safer way out and go with a system of putting the wood in and lighting it and be pretty much done with it. Not to say that the catalyst has'nt got my attention cause it does. I do believe that the EPA will continue to put more & more restrictions as time goes on. The cat system or some form of it will probably prevail. @ BeGreen...I do like the looks of the T-5 and being it has the same box inside of it as the Super 27...and it's only 400 dollars more for the exterior cast... it's going in the ring. When I was looking at the 9 different DW's yesterday...there was'nt a one of them that did'nt have their joints flushly put together...and there was glue or putty oozing out all over these joints...so much for American quality. haha. They all looked like monday or friday stoves! I could'nt get a straight answer from one of the sale people after he said all you gotta do is when the temp hits 500 or so degrees...just kick in the reburn system...so my next question was so if it goes down below...500... you have to shut the reburn off till you get it back up there? Just curious. He said no. The Jotul's are a beautiful stove but the F400 could only be loaded east to west and the Oslo is too large for my situation. What a beautiful stove tho. All the bigger stoves I want for longer burns but am stuck with I'm afraid a medium sized stove. Thanx to all again...I feel smarter everyday cause ya'll. Jeff
 
If you want to load wood, light it, and be done with it, I dunno if you'll like an EPA stove. You won't have to worry about closing the bypass on a non-cat, but for optimal performance you're supposed to gradually reduce the air to get a good secondary burn going. If you have to hang around to do that, flipping the bypass lever on a cat isn't a big deal, IMO. (StumpBranch has one of each and says that his cat requires less tweaking of the air control than his non-cat does.) If I had to get a non-cat, the T5 would be one of my top picks, but if you want looong burns in a med/small stove, Woodstock is as good as it gets (at least until BK releases their small stove.) Made in USA and oozing nothing but quality. :)
 
Ok Den...your up nice & early... Yeah...I realize that I have to tweak a little bit on the non cats...but really do you believe there's less tweaking on the cat models. Ya'll are making me want that T5 but the super 27 is the same stove...just less fancy...botoh...I do like the looks of the 27 also...the fact is...all wood stoves are appealing. And I gotta say...the non cats are pretty efficient. BTW...I would'nt want anything but an EPA stove. When is Burger King(haha) sposed to come out with the smaller stove? I think my wife would like the style of the T5 better but she's also a penny pincher haha...She's squeaks when she walks lmao.
 
The only non-cat I've burned is pre-EPA, so I haven't personally compared cat vs. EPA non-cat. Like I said, Stump_Branch currently has an example of each, and he said he was surprised that with the cat, he doesn't have to tweak the air to maintain a nice secondary burn like with his non-cat (I'm sure there are others who have different experiences.) His cat stove is the same as mine, and I can confirm that after you engage the cat, you're done. If you don't want to, you don't have to touch the stove for 10-12 hours. To answer your Q about the firebox falling below 500F, that doesn't happen until the tail end of the burn, when there's mostly just coals left, and you don't have to worry about disengaging the cat. On the BK front, see a thread called "Blaze King Contact." Says they're showing the new 1.7-cu-ft stove in Feb at a hearth expo in Atlanta. I think he gave a target date for release, but I can't find it ATM. . .
 
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