pdvc is vindictive

[Dr.Faustus]

So, i knew she needed to be cleaned around friday. I put it off. saturday passed and sunday night i wasnt feelin it. i'll clean it tomorrow i said.
I fill the hopper, crank it a little higher than normal because i wanted to be warm monday morning.

I wake up and the house is 51, stove is off. arrrrrrrrrrgh. what a rotten morning. the stove wanted to be cleaned, i wouldnt and it has sought revenge.

anyway i figured out the cause - not being clean, the room air blower couldnt dissipate the heat fast enough so it would bump its high limit and stop pellet flow. It stopped long enough for the fire to go out. shortly after, the temp dropped and it resumed feeding pellets.

so i wake up not only to a freezing house but a monster load of pellets in the burnpot, and i have my first day on a new job in 2 hrs.

im just ranting. when i got home i super cleaned the stove. lbt, scraped, air compressed insides, passages and vanes on combustion and room air blower. has been running fine all night.

 

[bogieb]

It certainly sux that these types of things tend to bite us like that - and usually at the most inconvenient time!

 

[alternativeheat]

The stove didn't bite anything, you shot yourself in the foot knowing it needed cleaning and not doing it. Don't need to add any drama to that, it's pretty simple. So get it on a cleaning schedule and stick to it and this won't happen to you.

Additionally, when you get your stove on a schedule it generally is easier to clean as a routine than when it's tripped out from getting all plugged up.

 

[bags]

Nothing motivates a good cleaning better than a cold house. LOL! It's a drag that you got beat on a Monday morning but .........

 

[sportbikerider78]

I guess the 1st day went ok, otherwise you wouldn't be talking about your pellet stove woes.

 

[jjones139]

So, i knew she needed to be cleaned around friday. I put it off. saturday passed and sunday night i wasnt feelin it. i'll clean it tomorrow i said.
I fill the hopper, crank it a little higher than normal because i wanted to be warm monday morning.

I wake up and the house is 51, stove is off. arrrrrrrrrrgh. what a rotten morning. the stove wanted to be cleaned, i wouldnt and it has sought revenge.

anyway i figured out the cause - not being clean, the room air blower couldnt dissipate the heat fast enough so it would bump its high limit and stop pellet flow. It stopped long enough for the fire to go out. shortly after, the temp dropped and it resumed feeding pellets.

so i wake up not only to a freezing house but a monster load of pellets in the burnpot, and i have my first day on a new job in 2 hrs.

im just ranting. when i got home i super cleaned the stove. lbt, scraped, air compressed insides, passages and vanes on combustion and room air blower. has been running fine all night.

If I can ask you an unrelated question.... I've had nothing but soot issues and burn plate pile ups since the season began with my PDVC downstairs. My PDV upstairs runs flawlessly. I've been back and forth with Englander and have just about replaced every part imaginable and NO change. Based upon video and pics sent to them they now believe it could be that my PDVC needs a vertical rise outside of 3ft rather than my straight through the wall 2ft run. Could you elaborate on your set up and piping because this may help. Just FYI... My glass is completely sooted after an hour and the burn plate is packed after 2hrs. Any at all help or advice may help me since we have the same stove.....

 

[Lake Girl]

i have my first day on a new job in 2 hrs.

Congrats on the new job. Next time listen to the stove when it lets you know it wants to be cleaned

 

[Lake Girl]

have just about replaced every part imaginable and NO change

How old is the stove, how did it run previously, you have the OAK hooked-up, what parts have you changed, is the PDV a new addition, what else has changed at the house (new appliances, windows, insulating, air handler, etc)? Might want to consider starting a new thread with the stove model in the title...

 

[jjones139]

How old is the stove, how did it run previously, you have the OAK hooked-up, what parts have you changed, is the PDV a new addition, what else has changed at the house (new appliances, windows, insulating, air handler, etc)? Might want to consider starting a new thread with the stove model in the title...

Oct 2015.... Nothing has changed at all in the basement which is a converted garage. Englander has been great, but we are running out of options and the next step is most likely headed towards stove replacement. I'm going to try to 3 foot vertical rise to see if that will help and if not then I believe we're at the end. I didn't start a new thread because the Dr has the same stove so I figured he may have an idea what may be causing it and I was particularly interested in his venting or exhaust.

How old is the stove, how did it run previously, you have the OAK hooked-up, what parts have you changed, is the PDV a new addition, what else has changed at the house (new appliances, windows, insulating, air handler, etc)? Might want to consider starting a new thread with the stove model in the title...

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[jjones139]

How old is the stove, how did it run previously, you have the OAK hooked-up, what parts have you changed, is the PDV a new addition, what else has changed at the house (new appliances, windows, insulating, air handler, etc)? Might want to consider starting a new thread with the stove model in the title...

I will further apologize to you since now I am seeing that my profile does not show when I'm using my cell phone. I do have Oak hooked up and it's an Englander 25-pdvc.

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[alternativeheat]

Just some thoughts on the sooty door experience:

1 It's common for basement installs to encounter negative draft. Usually you would overcome that by having the OAK as you say you have but sometimes also extending the vertical rise.

2 There could be some hidden passages that you aren't reaching but thinking you are doing a complete cleaning but not.

3 How are your gaskets, have you checked them with a dollar bill test , smoke test or flame test ?

4 Pellets. Are you using pellets you know to be good or are they something completely different to you?

5 Voltage in the outlet you use. Low voltage from the outlet or a bad breaker or a bad surge protector could affect exhaust/combustion blower RPM. ( just for the record, we had a guy in here who was going nuts trying to straighten out his dirty running stove, he plugged it into a different outlet, done deal. Then he discovered the original outlet had low voltage. And I had a surge protector go out on me. My stove experienced unreliable start up but I got lucky, the surge protector fried itself next and I had a spare. We had a lot of lightning storms that summer before and we actually lost two surge protectors and the tenant lost a microwave)

6 If it has a damper, could it have gotten bumped and shut down since last year, by some inadvertent means that you don't know about ?

 

[Mt Bob]

Oct 2015.... Nothing has changed at all in the basement which is a converted garage. Englander has been great, but we are running out of options and the next step is most likely headed towards stove replacement. I'm going to try to 3 foot vertical rise to see if that will help and if not then I believe we're at the end. I didn't start a new thread because the Dr has the same stove so I figured he may have an idea what may be causing it and I was particularly interested in his venting or exhaust.



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Did you try running it with the OAK unhooked?If so,purchase a manometer,and write down readings at different burning rates,etc,will help Mike at englanders figure it out.

 

[DneprDave]

What does pdvc stand for?

 

[Mt Bob]

pellet device very complicated??

 

[MCPO]

What does pdvc stand for?

PyroDeViCe ? (grin)

 

[jjones139]

My stove is an Englander 25-PDVC manufatured in 10/2015.


1 It's common for basement installs to encounter negative draft. Usually you would overcome that by having the OAK as you say you have but sometimes also extending the vertical rise. I have just added a 3 ft vertical. It was a straight through the wall prior with OAK!

2 There could be some hidden passages that you aren't reaching but thinking you are doing a complete cleaning but not. It was cleaned to the max on Sunday along with the leaf blower trick! I even have a small tube adapter to sneak into the main heat exchanger for cleaning.

3 How are your gaskets, have you checked them with a dollar bill test , smoke test or flame test ? Door gasket is new! The remaining are original! Flame and smoke test performed and showed nothing wrong!

4 Pellets. Are you using pellets you know to be good or are they something completely different to you? Pellets are good! I have another stove upstairs and that burns flawlessly!

5 Voltage in the outlet you use. Low voltage from the outlet or a bad breaker or a bad surge protector could affect exhaust/combustion blower RPM. ( just for the record, we had a guy in here who was going nuts trying to straighten out his dirty running stove, he plugged it into a different outlet, done deal. Then he discovered the original outlet had low voltage. And I had a surge protector go out on me. My stove experienced unreliable start up but I got lucky, the surge protector fried itself next and I had a spare. We had a lot of lightning storms that summer before and we actually lost two surge protectors and the tenant lost a microwave) It's connected via a battery backup system.

6 If it has a damper, could it have gotten bumped and shut down since last year, by some inadvertent means that you don't know about ? Not equipped with a damper!

Englander customer service has been FANTASTIC and they have been working with me daily! I have replaced just about everything mechanically on the stove with the exception of the door gasket, burn pot gasket and hopper lid gasket! My current install in downstairs in a converted garage now family room. I go straight out 2 ft with no vertical and have OAK attached. Englander feels that even through I have a good install they asked me to add a 3 ft vertical which I have done and the stove is now running. They believe that the stove is not creating enough draft since it's in the basement and the pipe outside is 36 inches from ground level. Stay tuned for an update later....

Thanks for all the comments....

 

[Lake Girl]

Hopefully all that was replaced was warranty ... Mike's usually pretty good with that.

The only thing I can think of off-hand is one ESW owner who found the hopper lid had a slight bow and was allowing air into the hopper. Used a thicker gasket and it cured his dirty burn.

Let us know how you make out with the 3' rise

 

[alternativeheat]

Waiting to hear back on the rise extensions. Another thought meanwhile: Have you tried disconnecting the OAK and open a door or window to the basement to see if the burn straightens out that way ? There is a simple cause here, I seriously doubt you need a new stove LOL !

Also, battery backup or not, I'd still check voltage going into the stove and best under load ( stove running).

 

[jjones139]

Waiting to hear back on the rise extensions. Another thought meanwhile: Have you tried disconnecting the OAK and open a door or window to the basement to see if the burn straightens out that way ? There is a simple cause here, I seriously doubt you need a new stove LOL !

Also, battery backup or not, I'd still check voltage going into the stove and best under load ( stove running).

Ran stove for 7 hours and did notice the burn to be much better. Unfortunately, the glass was once again black sooted after an hour. The flame was robust, but tall at times and that concerns me! No real visible soot on the end cap of the 3ft extension. I guess now I will disconnect the OAK and crack the window that's closest. I'm also just a tad concerned about the hopper lid. When I push down very hard the flame slightly changes, but the lid itself is already snug on both latches. Needless to say I'm getting quite annoyed. I'm now waiting for daylight so I can take a few pics of the outside location to send to Englander. They are calling at 8am for round 15 of diagnosing..... I think I'll switch from coffee to beer soon Stay tuned....

 

[alternativeheat]

Stick with the coffee LOL !

 

[Lake Girl]

When I push down very hard the flame slightly changes, but the lid itself is already snug on both latches.

Can the latches be adjusted to a tighter fit? I think that member's solution was another layer of gasket...

 

[jjones139]

Can the latches be adjusted to a tighter fit? I think that member's solution was another layer of gasket...

I just adjusted the latches a little bit more. They are so tight that I will be the only one that will be able to unlatch when it comes time to feed the pellets. I'm awaiting a call back from Englander.....

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[alternativeheat]

I just adjusted the latches a little bit more. They are so tight that I will be the only one that will be able to unlatch when it comes time to feed the pellets. I'm awaiting a call back from Englander.....

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If you have to latch it that tight you probably need a new gasket. When my P61 was new it had a bit of a leak in one corner of the ash pan door. I always felt the gasket was not tight enough, so I stripped it off and installed the next size larger gasket. It sealed and felt like it should when latched without distorting anything or incorporating excessive force.. Just sayin.

 

[Tonyray]

If you have to latch it that tight you probably need a new gasket. When my P61 was new it had a bit of a leak in one corner of the ash pan door. I always felt the gasket was not tight enough, so I stripped it off and installed the next size larger gasket. It sealed and felt like it should when latched without distorting anything or incorporating excessive force.. Just sayin.

how could u tell that u had a leak at the hopper. lid...?

 

[jjones139]

how could u tell that u had a leak at the hopper. lid...?

When I push down hard on the center of the hopper lid the flame actually increased so I kind of figured there was some type of issue. I just got off the phone with Englander and they don't believe that itself is going to cause all of the issues that I'm having so they were not overly concerned about the slight change in flame. This is been a long drawn-out Saga and we are headed towards stove replacement as per my last conversation with them.

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