Pellet Stove Installation

[Lemms]

Well, we got the pellet stove and are now working on getting it installed. The next task was venting it... As I stated in an earlier post, we are placing the stove against the exterior wall to the front of our house (road side). We just put about 50" high of brick on that side of the house this past summer. So, to direct vent it outside, we will have to bore a hole through our "new brick".
Last night we drilled the hole through the brick on the exterior wall to direct vent our pellets stove out the front side of our house. I'm starting to think that we should have gone out the roof. Not really looking forward to a sooted up area on the front of our house. Plus, we have a deck on the front side of our house that the vent will come out on; about 3 ft. front our front entry door.
Anyone seeing any major concerns? If it ends up being a problem, we can change it to go out the roof. Then, we'll just have to patch the brick that we drilled out. Maybe we won't have any problems... I got to thinking that the vent through the roof would have been handy in case if we decide to switch to a wood stove in a few years. But that may never happen either...
If we were to go out the roof, we would have to use class A venting, right? Can that be painted? I was thinking the rustic flat black chimney pipe look. It kind of defeats the purpose of having a black cast iron stove when you have a shiny chimney behind it.
Also...The vent on our pellet stove is 3". If we were to change it to vent our through the roof, can we adapt that to a 6" or 8" chimney pipe? That way, if we ever would switch to a wood stove, we wouldn't have to replace the chimney pipe.

Thanks everyone for all of the information thus far...

 

[skypager]

The only concern I see is that you mention that the door is 3 ft from the vent exit. Code says the vent must be 4' from a openable door or window. As far as the possibility of soot - well, as you know it was discussed by both Hearthtools and myself in the other thread and all I can say is that you've heard the opinion of two worthy professionals who have reached different conclusions through experience. What can I say other then you'll have to make your own descision from there. (If you want to be 100% positive of no soot, then go up and out or all the way up as hearthtools reccommends.) If you choose to do this and already have the hole cut, why not use it for outside air?

If you do choose to go through the ceiling pellet vent can be used the whole way. They make ceiling pass through's, flashings, and other parts for such applications. At that point you may want to use a tee on the back of the stove that would covert the vertical run to 4". - better draft and looks a little better than a 3" pipe all the way up. There is also pellet vent that is already painted black or you can get high temp stove paint and paint a variety of colors.

If you wanted to do the installation in anticipation of a possible wood stove in the future once you begin to pass through the ceiling you would convert to class A chimney. It would still be pellet vent from the class A box in the ceiling to the stove. There would be a conversion piece from the pellet to class a pipe up at the ceiling. 90% of wood stoves on the market us 6" flues. Not many use 8" flues but some models, like Vermont Castings, require an 8" flue to burn with the doors open. If you were to change the pellet stove to a wood stove then you would eliminate the interior pellet vent and use either single wall black pipe or double wall black pipe (different than class A) I would only suggest the use of class A if you are seriously entertaining the idea of a wood stove in the future. It is a good chunk of change more that the pellet vent.

 

[Lemms]

Josh,
Thanks much.... I appreciate your advice. So, is there a conversion piece that would convert the 3" pellet stove pipe to the 6" ceiling pass through piece? So, that I could put clas A above the ceiling pass through piece out through the roof. That way, if I ever switched oevr to wood, I would just replace from the ceiling pass through piece dopwn to the stove.
If going just verticle out the roof, is there any advantage to 3" or 4"?
Do you recommend using outside air? Or is it more of a case by case thing?

 

[skypager]

The class A pipe would be a installed just like as if you were installing a wood burner now. From the chimney cap down to just inside the room would be class A. (I'm gonna use Simpson Duravent Duratech class A as the example since thats the one I know the most about. Bear with me as I'm not in the shop today and don't have my book in front of me.) In the ceiling above the stove would be a ceiling support box, either round or square. The box stick into the room a few inches and supports the weight of the pipe and maintains safe clearances. On the end of the class A an adapter (style depending on application) allows single wall black pipe, double wall black pipe, or pellet vent pipe to be attached. Simpson Duravent makes specific pieces that will adapt 3" or 4" pellet vent to the class A chimney.

I would recommend using 4" if you go out the roof. It will help insure that there is less back pressure with the longer run (allowing the stove to burn better), will help generate natural draft to get the smoke out of the house in the case of a power outage, and overall just looks better for a vertical run. (In my opinion 3" looks kinda out of place on a vertical run from a stove.) Simpson duravent makes a Tee w/ clean-out that will allow coming off the stove at 3" and shoots upward with 4".

I really don't have a real solid opinion of outside air kits for pellet stoves. I never use one on a pellet stove install unless my customer requests it and never had a problem. Many manuals recommend the installation of outside air but I think they only require it for mobile home installation. Whether it is necessary depends on how tight the house is and where I live most people who buy the pellet stove live in older homes. (It tends to be that most of the newer homeowners around here want gas.) Beyond the negative pressure issue, I can definitely see the practical applications - taking cold air from outside to create heat instead of warm inside air. I don't see how it could make a huge difference as it would seem to me the heat coming of the stove wouldn't be as warm since the cold outside air would be tougher to get hot than the inside "prewarmed" air. Some people swear by it though and, like I said, I haven't dealt with enough out side air kits to have a solid opinion and this is just speculation on my part. Anyone that uses outside air or has more experience with it wanna chime in here?


If you wanna see the vent pieces Simpson Duravent makes check out www.duravent.com and look in their DuraTech and Pellet Vent catalogs.

 

[Lemms]

Once again....Thanks much Josh.
I think that I will direct vent out my wall (as I have already started) and then change it to go through the roof if I run into any soot problems or anything else. At that point, I will have wasted $160 on the direct vent kit. However, I've watsed money in worse ways.
How far outside of your exterior wall does the end of an outside air pipe have to extend?

 

[skypager]

From Simpson Duravents installaton manual:

A. Place the appliance according to manufacturer’s instructions.

B. Connect the Pipe Adapter to back of stove and attach sufficient pipe to penetrate Wall Thimble and extend at least 6" beyond the exterior wall. You may install the optional House Shield as shown in Figure 6. The House Shield is used to protect the exterior wall from vent discharge. Attach a Square or Round Horizontal Cap. The Round Horizontal Cap can be swiveled to be directed away from nearby objects (fence, plants, etc.), but must still be pointing in a generally downward direction.
Important: Horizontal Caps must be pointed in a generally downward direction to insure rain and snow do not enter the cap, and cause potential damage to the appliance. Either vent Cap should be at least 6" from the wall.

C. Follow the below listed NFPA 211 rule for distance of exit terminal from windows and openings: NFPA 211 (2003 ed.) Section 10.4 Termination:

10.4.5 (1) The exit terminal of a mechanical draft system other than a direct vent appliance (sealed combustion
system appliance) shall be located in accordance with the following:
(a) Not less than 3 ft (.91m) above any forced air inlet located within 10 ft. (3m).
(b) Not less than 4 ft. (1.2m) below, 4 ft. (1.2m) horizontally from or 1 ft. (305mm) above any door,window
or gravity air inlet into any building.


See: (broken link removed to http://www.duravent.com/docs/instruct/L502_aug05.pdf) to see figure 6 and to view the whole manual. You should have gotten a copy of this when you purchased the pipe.

 

[Lemms]

Josh,
Actually, I was talking about an ouside air pipe rather than an exhaust pipe. I wouldn't think that an outside air pipe would have to stick out as far as an exhaust pipe... Actually, don't the outside air kits have a "clothes dryer exhaust" type end on them?

 

[skypager]

I believe the outside air would be unit specific and covered in the stove manual. I don't think there is a code covering it beyond following the manuals recomendation.

 

[elkimmeg]

His manual clearly states that 3" diameter outside air feed is required in cellar locations. Its not an option but required

Not that big of a deal as he has the outlet location already cut

 

[Lemms]

Just to clarify... My stove is not in a cellar. It is on the main level of my ranch home. I do not plan to install the outside air feed. I am direct venting the stove through the hole that I cut in the brick. If I run into problems with direct venting it, I will vent it out my roof and then use the hole in my wall for the fresh air kit. However, I don't remeber the manual stating that the outisde air kit was required unless installed in a mobile home....