PEX pricing

[ecrane99]

I'm preparing to install and purchase an OWB 140' from my house. My dealer is offering PEX at $10/foot.
Is this in the ballpark or should I be shopping around? I don't mind paying my dealer a bit more as he has provided me with guidance on my install questions, but do not want to be sure it is fair. Thanks

 

[deerefanatic]

Is that the insulated stuff? Just plain ol' 1 inch pex is around $1 - $1.25 per foot for good quality stuff....times two because you need a supply and return line... If it's the all-in-one stuff that's pre-insulated and such, then it's a fair deal.... Though I'm a fan of sticking plain ol' pex in the ground and having closed cell foam (corbond, etc....) sprayed around..... More insulation for the same money.


For pex brand, Wirsboro is always good, but kinda pricey. I went with Thermapex.... It's also a swedish company like Uponor/Wirsboro so the quality should be good....

 

[Chris S]

I was just quoted 23/ft for Uponor ecoflex 1 1/4"
Good product I've used it before, but it's not cheap

 

[ecrane99]

Yeah, Its the all in one stuff 5" diameter. I'm digging a trench 24" here in CT.

 

[deerefanatic]

I still say plain pex with spray-in closed cell foam is the best way to go for value....

Plus, have you ever worked with regular pex? Even 1" pex can be a beast to work with... Now, multiply that by two, plus add the stiff drain tile and all that foam and I shudder to even think of handling that stuff.........

 

[heaterman]

I'm preparing to install and purchase an OWB 140' from my house. My dealer is offering PEX at $10/foot.
Is this in the ballpark or should I be shopping around? I don't mind paying my dealer a bit more as he has provided me with guidance on my install questions, but do not want to be sure it is fair. Thanks

At 140' you should be using 1-1/4" if your load is over 50,000 btu. Using regular pex and spraying it in the trench is best, then followed by products like Ecoflex, Microflex etc. The pex/bubble foil/sewer pipe stuff...........to be kind, let's just say it's less than satisfactory.

Oh, the salesman says it works great? Hmmmmm he's selling the product and claiming it's the good stuff. 1+1=?

 

[EForest]

ecrane99,
I just finished installing 220' of SDR35 (4" sewer pipe w/ neoprene gasket built in) and spayed it with 2-3" of closed cell urethane foam (purchased from EFI in Westborough MA 800-876-0660 or Wisconsin 800-962-7015) on all sides. I now have a water tight, well insulated, smooth interior conduit from house to barn and house to hot tub. I can snake anything I desire through the pipes with no worries. The SDR cost @ $1/ft but the foam was a little pricey at $1050 for two 600 bd/ft kits and a hose kit. But I couldn't wait for a foam crew to show up two weeks later for the same money. I did the foam in two layers with a helper moving the tanks along the trench in less than 3 hours. It would have gone quicker if we didn't have to pump water out of the trench along the way. If you are interested in the SDR35 you will find it at any TEAM EJP or call the Spfld MA store 413-543-8888.

best of luck,
Ed

 

[heaterman]

ecrane99,
I just finished installing 220' of SDR35 (4" sewer pipe w/ neoprene gasket built in) and spayed it with 2-3" of closed cell urethane foam (purchased from EFI in Westborough MA 800-876-0660 or Wisconsin 800-962-7015) on all sides. I now have a water tight, well insulated, smooth interior conduit from house to barn and house to hot tub. I can snake anything I desire through the pipes with no worries. The SDR cost @ $1/ft but the foam was a little pricey at $1050 for two 600 bd/ft kits and a hose kit. But I couldn't wait for a foam crew to show up two weeks later for the same money. I did the foam in two layers with a helper moving the tanks along the trench in less than 3 hours. It would have gone quicker if we didn't have to pump water out of the trench along the way. If you are interested in the SDR35 you will find it at any TEAM EJP or call the Spfld MA store 413-543-8888.

best of luck,
Ed

Now THAT is a good system. Nice job. Seal the ends so you don't get convective air flow through the tubing.

 

[Willman]

I just finished installing 220’ of SDR35 (4” sewer pipe w/ neoprene gasket built in)

Are the supply and return insulated from each other ? I like the idea of using a chase for tubing for the future serviceability factor. Especially with a grand in foam work.
Will

 

[deerefanatic]

Yah, I thought of doing that too.... But ended up not doing it..... Just the extra cost I guess......

 

[ecrane99]

My dealer is quoting the following for my PEX:

Flexsul-Seal w/2- 1" nonbarrier pex 150' $10.90 /ft = $1635.00


I like the all in one pex, because I don't have the time and know how to make my own
design like some of you have done. I just want to be sure I'm not overpaying.

Also, It was mentioned in this tread that I should be using 1" 1/4 rather than the quoted 1"

All your comments appreciated!!

 

[deerefanatic]

Well, not much know-how needed.... the insulation contractor does all that. BUT, I will mention that 1" single pex by itself is a bit of a wild animal to work with... You're in for a time trying to manhandle that stuff that has two pex lines, the outer tube, and the foam all together...... Especially if you go to 1 1/4 pex

 

[EForest]

[Are the supply and return insulated from each other ? I like the idea of using a chase for tubing for the future serviceability factor. Especially with a grand in foam work.
Will[/quote]
The heat loss between the supply and return is so minimal that its not worth the extra $ or effort to wrap either pipe.

The low end of my trench has about 12" of water with my foamed pipe trying to float to the top.
I have two fittings in the water and was wondering how tight the gaskets were.
I snaked a rag to check for water and not one drop was on the rag.

Ed

 

[Willman]

I snaked a rag to check for water and not one drop was on the rag. grin

Ed

Nice!!

 

[heaterman]

Well, not much know-how needed.... the insulation contractor does all that. BUT, I will mention that 1" single pex by itself is a bit of a wild animal to work with... You're in for a time trying to manhandle that stuff that has two pex lines, the outer tube, and the foam all together...... Especially if you go to 1 1/4 pex

When we're working with 1-1/4" and up we wait for a sunny day if at all possible and uncoil the pex for a couple hours before laying it in the trench. Put the ends of the tube through a couple cement blocks to hold it while it relaxes.

PS: never allow the end of a coil of 2" get out of the blocks as you're unwinding it. Don't ask how I know this............

 

[heaterman]

My dealer is quoting the following for my PEX:

Flexsul-Seal w/2- 1" nonbarrier pex 150' $10.90 /ft = $1635.00


I like the all in one pex, because I don't have the time and know how to make my own
design like some of you have done. I just want to be sure I'm not overpaying.

Also, It was mentioned in this tread that I should be using 1" 1/4 rather than the quoted 1"

All your comments appreciated!!

Here's the reason for the 1-1/4" pex.

Figuring 300' round trip and not even adding any additional restriction caused by elbows, valves, tees, heat exchangers or other piping, the flow numbers look like this. (my guess is that your actual flow rate will be somewhat lower because of additional piping and fittings)

with 1" tube with 1-1/4 tube

007 Taco = 4.9 gpm 007 Taco = 7.9 gpm .85 amps
009 Taco = 6.2 gpm 009 Taco = 7.4 gpm 1.3 amps
0011 Taco = 8.3 gpm 0011 Taco = 12.7 gpm 2.2 amps

To figure the heat carrying capacity of those flow rates multiply the gpm by 10,000. That's figuring a 20 degree drop supply to return

So to get 80,000 btu's through the 1" tube you have to use the 0011 circ which uses 3 times the current of the 007. To get the same 80,000 btu's through 1-1/4" tube you only need the small circ which operates for nearly 1/3 the cost of the 0011. That really adds up over a period of years. Given that oil and gas will never be $2.00 / gallon again, how long do you plan to burn wood? 10 years? 20?

To put it simply the 007 will run for about 10 hours on a dime's worth of electricity. The 0011 will only run for a tad over 3 hours. I know you're smart enough to figure that out over the course of a year because you're here asking questions. You'll be surprised at how quickly the larger diameter tube pays for itself in electrical savings. Not to mention the smaller, low head circ will last longer on an open system 9 times out of 10.
Those 009's and 0011's need a fair bit more pressure on the inlet side of the impeller and it's just not there in that type of a system.

 

[Sawyer]

Heaterman, if the the size is restricted by a smaller fitting say a 1" inlet/outlet heat exchanger will the 1 1/4" figures automatically revert to the 1" size?

 

[Donl]

My dealer is quoting the following for my PEX:

Flexsul-Seal w/2- 1" nonbarrier pex 150' $10.90 /ft = $1635.00

Here's the reason for the 1-1/4" pex.

Figuring 300' round trip and not even adding any additional restriction caused by elbows, valves, tees, heat exchangers or other piping, the flow numbers look like this. (my guess is that your actual flow rate will be somewhat lower because of additional piping and fittings)

with 1" tube with 1-1/4 tube

007 Taco = 4.9 gpm 007 Taco = 7.9 gpm .85 amps
009 Taco = 6.2 gpm 009 Taco = 7.4 gpm 1.3 amps
0011 Taco = 8.3 gpm 0011 Taco = 12.7 gpm 2.2 amps

Heaterman, for the figures you provide, are they related to the actual inside diameter of the pex pipe or the pex pipe advertised diameter. If you are referring to the actual I.D. then for 1 inch I.D.you would need 1 1/4” pex and for 1 1/4” I.D. you would need 1 1/2” pex. Is this correct?

 

[heaterman]

My dealer is quoting the following for my PEX:

Flexsul-Seal w/2- 1" nonbarrier pex 150' $10.90 /ft = $1635.00

Here's the reason for the 1-1/4" pex.

Figuring 300' round trip and not even adding any additional restriction caused by elbows, valves, tees, heat exchangers or other piping, the flow numbers look like this. (my guess is that your actual flow rate will be somewhat lower because of additional piping and fittings)

with 1" tube with 1-1/4 tube

007 Taco = 4.9 gpm 007 Taco = 7.9 gpm .85 amps
009 Taco = 6.2 gpm 009 Taco = 7.4 gpm 1.3 amps
0011 Taco = 8.3 gpm 0011 Taco = 12.7 gpm 2.2 amps

Heaterman, for the figures you provide, are they related to the actual inside diameter of the pex pipe or the pex pipe advertised diameter. If you are referring to the actual I.D. then for 1 inch I.D.you would need 1 1/4” pex and for 1 1/4” I.D. you would need 1 1/2” pex. Is this correct?

Those are for the commonly referred to sizes which as you have said are not quite the same as the actual measurement.

 

[heaterman]

Heaterman, if the the size is restricted by a smaller fitting say a 1" inlet/outlet heat exchanger will the 1 1/4" figures automatically revert to the 1" size?

No, but you want to make sure of the flow the HX will handle. A temporary reduction in size, like an insert coupling for example doesn't effect the overall head to a noticeable extent.