Pre wood stove installation help.

[Niko]

So I have a option to get either a BK princess or a King. Not sure what direction I wanna go in right now as I'm wondering about the installation part. I have a old smoke dragon that came with the house and I used maybe a handful of times which was 3 years ago. I assume the black pipe is 6 inches maybe bigger, I know it goes into a masonry chimney with a clay flu liner. I just went up and took a pic the clay look perfect with no problem. It is a 7x11 around 15 ft tall to the stove, I ran a measuring tape inside the flu to get that number.

So one question is the pre existing black pipe looks like it's cemented into the masonry chimney, obviously when I get into it'll the install the pipe will have to ripped out. When I measure the pipe by eye balling it it looks like 6-8 inches wide. How do I check to see how wide it is?

Another question is if I get the blaze king King Is the flue big enough as it needs a 8 inch exhaust. Which also means I won't be able to get a insulated flex liner in their, or do they make oval liner? So I called a bunch a dealers on the Bill website and a lot said to me many people ha e the stove hooked up with no class a or flex pipe, they just use their clay liners as long as they are in great condition with no cracks etc.

The princes uses a 6 inch pipe so I assume a insulated liner will fit into the masonry chimney.

Any help would be much appreciated.

 

[bholler]

So I have a option to get either a BK princess or a King.

I am confused dont you already have a king?

 

[kennyp2339]

Go with the princess and a 6" insulated liner.
Member ?Rwhite? I think went with a king and piped directly into a 7x11" clay liner and had some issues with his setup, I believe he stated that if he was to do this all over again he would have had an insulated liner for better performance. As far as the existing black pipe it looks like 8" single wall is being used with that franklin stove.
BK's run lower than "normal" exhaust temps due to being a higher efficiency stove, so there's a greater chance that the exhaust temps will hit a critical cooling point of 250def or less in its travel up the chimney and condense causing creosote build up and amore sluggish draft which can stall the cat out on low burns, an insulated liner will keep the flue gasses warmer, reducing creosote build up and help keep a positive draft so you can run low and slow reaping the BK benefits of good heat, and long burn times.

 

[bholler]

A round 6" liner will not fit you will either have to go with an ovalized 7" or break out the old liners to fit a round 6" insulated. You can also ask bk if an ovalized 6" will work but with only 15' of chimney I would not push it.

 

[kennyp2339]

I am confused dont you already have a king?

Oh man, I hope this is his second stove for a weekend house or I'll feel sick....

 

[bholler]

Never mind I just looked at the pics again the 2 liners are touching so breaking out the liners is not an option because you will break both of them no way around it. So it would have to be ovalized.

 

[Niko]

I am confused dont you already have a king?

Yes i do but thats downstairs and i dont like running it hot to get the heat upstairs.

 

[bholler]

Yes i do but thats downstairs and i dont like running it hot to get the heat upstairs.

ok i remember you talking about that before

 

[Niko]

Go with the princess and a 6" insulated liner.
Member ?Rwhite? I think went with a king and piped directly into a 7x11" clay liner and had some issues with his setup, I believe he stated that if he was to do this all over again he would have had an insulated liner for better performance. As far as the existing black pipe it looks like 8" single wall is being used with that franklin stove.
BK's run lower than "normal" exhaust temps due to being a higher efficiency stove, so there's a greater chance that the exhaust temps will hit a critical cooling point of 250def or less in its travel up the chimney and condense causing creosote build up and amore sluggish draft which can stall the cat out on low burns, an insulated liner will keep the flue gasses warmer, reducing creosote build up and help keep a positive draft so you can run low and slow reaping the BK benefits of good heat, and long burn times.

Yea that what i was thinking i domt want to gamble with that and i also don't want to run anohter class a chimney on the side of my house. You think the princess will work without a insulated liner?

 

[bholler]

Yes i do but thats downstairs and i dont like running it hot to get the heat upstairs.

We would really need to know if the chimney is code comliant as it is now if so you could probably run the king through the 7x11 as is with the princess you need a liner regardless

 

[Niko]

The other bigger clay liner is for this but i dont want a insert.

Never look up oval liners are they any good or worse the a stamdard one?

 

[bholler]

Never look up oval liners are they any good or worse the a stamdard one?

They cost more and dont flow as well as round but it really is your only option unless you are ok with breaking out both of those 7x11 liners.

 

[kennyp2339]

You think the princess will work without a insulated liner?

I think your going to be fighting it the whole time, I run mine 24/7 and have consistent 350 deg flue temps (measure single wall, stove pipe thermometer) that's low, but my class a is interior and insulated double wall so I get away with it. Dumping into an masonry chimney at those low temps seems like a up hill battle in fighting draft and creosote production, go the b holler route and ask bk about an ovalized liner.

 

[Niko]

They cost more and dont flow as well as round but it really is your only option unless you are ok with breaking out both of those 7x11 liners.

I domt want to do that cause the other one is for more oil furnace. I domt want to add any more expense or open a can of worms per say.

We would really need to know if the chimney is code comliant as it is now if so you could probably run the king through the 7x11 as is with the princess you need a liner regardless

Ok what do i need to do to make sure it is up to code? I thought as long as the brick/mortar/clay are fine then its good.

 

[bholler]

I domt want to do that cause the other one is for more oil furnace. I domt want to add any more expense or open a can of worms per say.

Yeah most people are not ok with that

Ok what do i need to do to make sure it is up to code? I thought as long as the brick/mortar/clay are fine then its good.

First off hav the clay scanned to be sure it really is ok. But it does look pretty good from above. next does it have the required clearance to combustibles? I can tell you it does not where the paneling is in your pic but if that is the only spot it is easily fixed. But chances are that you have combustibles to close to the outside of the masonry structure. And if that is the case you need an insulated liner.

 

[Niko]

Yeah most people are not ok with that


First off hav the clay scanned to be sure it really is ok. But it does look pretty good from above. next does it have the required clearance to combustibles? I can tell you it does not where the paneling is in your pic but if that is the only spot it is easily fixed. But chances are that you have combustibles to close to the outside of the masonry structure. And if that is the case you need an insulated liner.

I assume you mean this picture for the paneling, even if its not i stopped using this because of the clearances. But all the paneling will come off anyway.

 

[bholler]

I assume you mean this picture for the paneling, even if its not i stopped using this because of the clearances. But all the paneling will come off anyway.

That is good but what about the roof framing sheathing ect? And the framing of the walls?

 

[Niko]

That is good but what about the roof framing sheathing ect? And the framing of the walls?

I gotcha so if the roof overhead overlaps the chimney thats a no no cause of the framing laying of the chimney?

 

[bholler]

I gotcha so if the roof overhead overlaps the chimney thats a no no cause of the framing laying of the chimney?

If the framing of the roof or walls is withing 2" of the outside of your chimney it does not meet code and it needs a liner. If your chimney was an external one it would only need 1"

here is a copy of the code.

http://www.rumford.com/code/clearances.html

 

[Niko]

http://www.woodlanddirect.com/Chimn...Pre-Insulated-Easy-Flex-Chimney-Liner-Kit-5-5

Will a 5.5 insulated liner work instead of 6? As im sure you guys know the insulated linears are one inch thicker in diameter. So a 6 inch would not work cause it has a total diameter of 7 inches and my chimney is 7x11.

@BKVP or anyelne else is you habe a sec what do you think. 5.5 insulated liner roughly 15 feet tall. Inside it eould be 30 inches before i would do (2) 45s into the liner.

 

[bholler]

Will a 5.5 insulated liner work instead of 6? As im sure you guys know the insulated linears are one inch thicker in diameter. So a 6 inch would not work cause it has a total diameter of 7 inches and my chimney is 7x11.

Well it is actually closer to 1.5" more an insulated 5.5 probably wont fit either. And with your short chimney I would be worried about downsizing but BKVP will know the answer to that.

 

[Niko]

Under q & a it says outside diameter 6.75

 

[bholler]

Under q & a it says outside diameter 6.75

Yes which means the chances of you fitting it in a liner that is 7" inside are slim to none. Any offset in a tile joint or mortar hanging out will make it not fit. Are you talking about preinsulated stuff or stuff you wrap yourself?

 

[Niko]

I posted a link above. I copied and pasted the first thing I saw in the net. I see some mortor sticking out in my picture but t i figured it could break that out with some long 2x4s.

 

[bholler]

I posted a link above.

That just links to woodland direct site not any particular product. Different types of liners are different outside diameters also.

I see some mortor sticking out in my picture but t i figured it could break that out with some long 2x4s.

I also see a couple offset joints to.