Propane Price Lock in Rate is a Joke

[bogieb]

Just for prospective - I just got a 350 gal delivery for propane at $.99 per gallon.

Heck, I spent more than you just did when I bought 150 gals of propane last winter. That was when I saw my lowest price at $3.22 (yep - ~$500 for that 150 gallons). If I had locked in at the rate they want this year, I would pay even more (assuming I need to get propane at all - last I checked, I hadn't even used all of that 150 gallons).

 

[SidecarFlip]

I find it interesting that different parts of the country command different pricing on things like propane (and pellets)... We are at $241 a ton pre buy on pellets and right at 99 cents on propane like Jags. That makes propane the clear winner.

I don't understand why propane would be so much higher east of the Hudson river, makes no sense to me. Gouging, greed or actual cost? Who really knows?

 

[begreen]

Just got a quote from the local and only propane delivery source. $3.05/gallon. The tank is at 25% and we only use it for a gas cooktop. Think I will wait.

 

[SidecarFlip]

Wow, I can't fathom the difference in pricing. Where you are, propane is in overstocked supply, I just don't get it. This country is awash in NG (and propane) right now.

 

[begreen]

Check Seattle area propane prices. We pay more for gasoline here too in spite of having a refinery only 70 miles to the north.
http://www.seattlepropane.com/prices

 

[SidecarFlip]

Kind of ironic, both coasts have higher prices on fuels than the interior of the country

I haven't paid that per gallon price...ever. I use propane to heat my machine shop.

 

[begreen]

Search around to the north of the city and you can find propane for about half the price. We are the victims of price fixing.

 

[SidecarFlip]

I stated early on in the thread that I own my tanks, all 3 actually and that allows me to price shop even though my hunting partner who also owns the propane company here in town always seems to have the best price. We talk all the time so I usually know what the wholesale price is. I just add 6 cents to that to get my retail price.. He does a 6 cent markup based on gallons so he makes his money no matter what the price is.

Now, if I had grain dryers, I could get what we call 'dryer gas'. Thats no tax fuel (ag exemption) and it's about 15 cents a gallon under retail. I don't have grain dryers however....(probably should add one to my GSI grain storage bin and get in on the really cheap gas....lol

It's not common knowledge but you can take an anhydrous nurse tank, remove the undercarriage, change the valving and dip tube (so it delivers vapor instead of liquid) and it becomes a propane tank. They are one in the same except for valving.

I believe my oldest tank (bottle is the correct term) started life as a nurse tank. It's around 60 years old. There is really no lifespan to a propane tank so long as it's kept painted and corrosion free, I've had to have the valves changed out on one tank, Propane is dry so the seats go bad after a while. I got a leaky seat and my buddy changed it out, waited until the tank was at 20% came out with another tank on his truck, evacuated the 20%, changed the valves, pumped the 20 back in and I was good to go.

 

[jim2074]

In Northern Wisconsin propane is going for .69Cents a gallon minimum 300 gallons purchase. That is a great price.

 

[bogieb]

I find it interesting that different parts of the country command different pricing on things like propane (and pellets)... We are at $241 a ton pre buy on pellets and right at 99 cents on propane like Jags. That makes propane the clear winner.

I don't understand why propane would be so much higher east of the Hudson river, makes no sense to me. Gouging, greed or actual cost? Who really knows?

You guys are sitting on all the resources to make propane - NH has nothing even close. We truck (or train everything either from the Midwest or Canada. Heck, I can't even get NG here (and most the state can't either). So, we pay a premium for everything. Although a couple of years old, here is an interesting post that examines propane prices from NH's perspective http://nhenergy.blogspot.com/2013/08/crossing-muddy-waters-trying-to.html

 

[coobie]

Had my once a year propane (500 gal.)fill up two weeks ago 85 cents per gal.Thats correct not a typo.Cheapest I have ever paid..

 

[Arti]

In the past we had 3 companies to choose LP from, also had 4 car dealers.
Now we have one gentleman that owns all the new car dealer ships and if you want local service your vehicle is purchased from him.

Back to the propain, First lp dealer was handed down to the son in law with a few changes, he was into marketing and protecting the company so a lot of new rules were put in place such as if you don't have a receipt and proof of where your tank came from then you are not the owner and they wouldn't fill it. The Second company was a local Coop sort of hard to tell what anything cost because you were investing in the company, dividend checks at the end of the year etc.
3 rd company was hard to describe, sort of good prices but you best be around when they delivered because he might forget to see if the fill valve was leaking had it over filled twice. etc.

Well fast forward, A large company came in and over a period of a few years bought up the first 2 companies, They made it plain that they were here to make money.
Delivery charge, hazmat fee, snow in driveway fee etc. Want to pump the tank and move it sure for $$$$ we will be glad to send out bubba, hazmat fee, pumping fee, service call, etc. So if you pay a dollar for a gallon of lp it will likely be close to a dollar and a half by the time you get the bill,

So at this point we have one company that has control of the lp pricing in this area. the third company while supplying things at an affordable price isn't the best to deal with. I suspect that the big corporation that owns the other 2 companies is closing in on buying it.

So I'm staying with the corn / pellet burning We do have lp as a backup however it's not used. We decided to not complain about corporate control over our fuel and just move on to heat pumps and our pellet furnaces. Shop is heated with waste oil for the last 6 years.

 

[bwise.157]

$1.60/gallon from Amerigas here in central Ohio. I am out of my contract with them, and would love to go elsewhere, but I have 25% left in my tank. That will last me until sometime in December/January. For them to pump out if I switch now, it will cost $$$. For them to come get my tank, it will cost $$$. I am afraid if I don't fill soon, prices will sky rocket (always my luck). Propane is for hot water and backup heat. Use about 150-200 gallons a year.

 

[bogieb]

$1.60/gallon from Amerigas here in central Ohio. I am out of my contract with them, and would love to go elsewhere, but I have 25% left in my tank. That will last me until sometime in December/January. For them to pump out if I switch now, it will cost $$$. For them to come get my tank, it will cost $$$. I am afraid if I don't fill soon, prices will sky rocket (always my luck). Propane is for hot water and backup heat. Use about 150-200 gallons a year.

That is pretty much my scenario, with the same company ~30% left. and use about 150-200 gals/year. But I can't have them take it when empty because it will be snowed in by then (and my luck, will run empty about the time I want to take a trip to see family in KS - for which I do need propane heating).

 

[Bioburner]

NYMEX corn down today to 4.26 and crude fell over $4 to 52.78 a barrel, gasoline fell over 9 cents. I paid the elevator last year $3.46 a bushel for corn at this time as I had $$$ from the 4th.
The corn ,beans, wheat and beets are looking the best I have seen again around here. Tomorrows high to be 67 with tonights low in the 40's. Probably have to roundup some coats to wear. We have had only one 90 degree day so far this year.

 

[Dpopps]

I called my propane company today and they don't have a lock in price yet.

I am not sure what tsc you get somersets pellets at, I called 10 stores today and can't find them.

All the TSC stores I called have the same pre-buy price and comes out at $209.00 a ton.

 

[SidecarFlip]

Even at a buck sixty a gallon, propane is cheaper to run than corn (it's $4.06 a bushel here right now) or TSC pre buy pellets. Amerigas has been begging to fill my tanks, taking 1500 gallons a fill which is about a delivery truck load is good for them (or anyone). One stop and dump.

 

[SidecarFlip]

NYMEX corn down today to 4.26 and crude fell over $4 to 52.78 a barrel, gasoline fell over 9 cents. I paid the elevator last year $3.46 a bushel for corn at this time as I had $$$ from the 4th.
The corn ,beans, wheat and beets are looking the best I have seen again around here. Tomorrows high to be 67 with tonights low in the 40's. Probably have to roundup some coats to wear. We have had only one 90 degree day so far this year.

It's rained and rained here. The row crops are terrible. Lots of fields not even planted. I have yet to cut hay, I can't get in the fields to cut it. Been a good year for diesel consumption...I haven't used any.

We do have one bumper crop...skeeters.

 

[Bioburner]

I will using a lot more propane in the freestanding gas stove it looks like this winter. Lot less work and still get nice radiant heat. Have enough corn to blend for the Harman to keep the basement floor warm. Will mothball the Bixby for this upcoming heating season.

 

[SidecarFlip]

I will using a lot more propane in the freestanding gas stove it looks like this winter. Lot less work and still get nice radiant heat. Have enough corn to blend for the Harman to keep the basement floor warm. Will mothball the Bixby for this upcoming heating season.

I have about 3/4 ton of Somersets left in the (right now almost empty) hay barn. I'll pick up enough to round out the ton for those real cold evenings but I'm sure the wife will prefer the Plus 90 Bryant.

The only way I'll use pellets or corn is if it's financially comparable and I don't see that at this juncture.

I always have corn in the GSI's for the cattle anyway. I just won't have as much this winter.

I have a feeling that this winter is gonna be a killer, snowfall wise. This El nino system is supposed to persist until spring.

Considering the amount of precip we had in June here.... over 12 inches, that would equate to 12 feet of snow. Add in the wind and the snow wpould be up to the roof.

My problem with hay is that the ground is saturated, I can take it off but at what price to my fields. I have FWA on the tractors but ruts are for decades.

According to my hunting partner and local propane business owner, the low fuel prices will persist at least through the Presidential elections.... fine with me. More hunting trip money.

 

[fmsm]

I just looked into buying a tank. I am using propane for a whole house generator, a dryer, and DHW. I don't anticipate using much propane but wanted to bury a 500 gallon tank and forget it. The one thing that swayed me was if I own the tank I also own the liability. With my propane company I have 10 million in protection.

 

[ccmac]

Just got a letter last week with our lock-in rate; $1.49 Which I am not happy with. Current price is $1.09/gal. Makes it a real gamble, if I buy now I am betting that mid winter the price is higher than $1.49. Last year mid winter price was $1.25 so I am not doing it. Really feel for those of you that deal with these high prices all the time. I really love my wood stove and fireplace but I also bought a high efficiency LP furnace as my back up. Hopefully this year I won't use the furnace much. I much prefer wood burning.

 

[SidecarFlip]

I just looked into buying a tank. I am using propane for a whole house generator, a dryer, and DHW. I don't anticipate using much propane but wanted to bury a 500 gallon tank and forget it. The one thing that swayed me was if I own the tank I also own the liability. With my propane company I have 10 million in protection.

Your homeowners policy covers the liability.... Besides, if it blows up you won't be worrying about it...You won't be around to worry.

I have 3 500 gallon tanks about 20 feet from the house btw.

You really think your propane supplier will cover your loss???

 

[Bioburner]

Only time I have heard of problems with tanks has been when they are parked close to a burning building. We in MN have had a couple accidents when someone was filling BBQ tanks commercially. One accident was when a truck hit the bulk tank.
What's a lot more of concern is a the rail cars with propane and ND crude derailing or idiots trying to beat the train across a crossing.
Oh I forgot, a teen thought he could shoot a tank with a high power rifle. A center shot on the end. Darwin worked.

 

[SidecarFlip]

A propane tank (technically called a bottle) operates at a storage pressure much less than say an oxygen or acetelyne welding tank, typically a propane storage tank is less than 100 psi static whereas a welding bottle could be 2000 psi. The chance of explosion from failure is almost nonexistent unless it's impacted like Bio said or subjected to extreme heat to raise the internal pressure and even then they will vent to atmosphere pending failure.

Though ugly (don't really blend in with any landscaping unless buried which is allowed in some states), they are very safe.