Questions regarding subfloor/base, and hearth requirements.

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DaBurner87

New Member
Sep 17, 2021
22
New York
20210924_171424.jpg

Note the baseboard radiator.

20210924_171429.jpg

I've attached a few pictures showing the area I want to put a wood burning stove. The subfloor is plywood, about half inch thick I believe. Now the base radiator is there after this ledge and the plan is to cut enough it out and reroute it underneath the floor so when a fire isn't going we still have heat. I want it cut to fit around the hearth so it looks perfect. Removing it completely seems like a bad idea. My guess is they framed this box out from the wall to have an entertainment area. It just doesn't seem correct to me.

My question is, what is necessary for a subfloor for the hearth to lie on? I plan to build an alcove, and wanted one solid natural stone for the stove to sit on, but the weight of the stove, and the natural stone(granite) worries me. On top of that, what is a proper base for all of this to sit on? Underneath the plywood is 2x8 joists I believe. Is there anything special as far as thinset, or epoxy or anything like that required to hold the natural stone base down on the flooring or can I simply use it's own weight as a base as it will probably be 200lbs alone?

The fireplace store wants $100 just to come take a look at it the job, but I wanted to install everything myself. They told me over the phone most people average around $6000 all in. I'm pretty damn handy, but I've never installed one of these before and obviously I don't want to screw this up. I can't really afford $6000 at the moment though, and I need this done soon.
 
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bholler

Chimney sweep
Staff member
Jan 14, 2014
26,077
central pa
View attachment 282286

Note the baseboard radiator.

View attachment 282287



I've attached a few pictures showing the area I want to put a wood burning stove. The subfloor is plywood, about half inch thick I believe. Now the base radiator is there after this ledge and the plan is to cut enough it out and reroute it underneath the floor so when a fire isn't going we still have heat. I want it cut to fit around the hearth so it looks perfect. Removing it completely seems like a bad idea. My guess is they framed this box out from the wall to have an entertainment area. It just doesn't seem correct to me.

My question is, what is necessary for a subfloor for the hearth to lie on? I plan to build an alcove, and wanted one solid natural stone for the stove to sit on, but the weight of the stove, and the natural stone(granite) worries me. On top of that, what is a proper base for all of this to sit on? Underneath the plywood is 2x8 joists I believe. Is there anything special as far as thinset, or epoxy or anything like that required to hold the natural stone base down on the flooring or can I simply use it's own weight as a base as it will probably be 200lbs alone?

The fireplace store wants $100 just to come take a look at it the job, but I wanted to install everything myself. They told me over the phone most people average around $6000 all in. I'm pretty damn handy, but I've never installed one of these before and obviously I don't want to screw this up. I can't really afford $6000 at the moment though, and I need this done soon.
What stove is this for? That will be what determines the hearth requirements. As far as what support is needed that will vary greatly depending upon stone type and thickness
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
90,473
South Puget Sound, WA
Continuation on the other two threads already in progress.

Post a sketch of what is planned and indicate what stove. Making an alcove will have it's own constraints so be mindful of that.

Just spitballing here, but what about relocating the baseboard heat to another wall to make planning more straight-forward?
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
90,473
South Puget Sound, WA

 

DaBurner87

New Member
Sep 17, 2021
22
New York
Continuation on the other two threads already in progress.

Post a sketch of what is planned and indicate what stove. Making an alcove will have it's own constraints so be mindful of that.

Just spitballing here, but what about relocating the baseboard heat to another wall to make planning more straight-forward?
That is of course possible. That radiator is a 13ft stretch to the corner to the right which is where it runs probably 19 ft along the other wall. The problem is I dont have a stove picked out, most stores are sold out at the moment, however I just spoke to a guy who has 3 Jotul F500s, other than that Im limited to Home Depot, Lowes, and whatever I can order online.

The alcove looks amazing to me, and I feel its safer with my children.

I dont have exact room dimensions, as I said in one of my other threads this room was the garage and it was converted into the main living room in the late 80s, but the size is limited. I believe its 13x16. So to fit couches, the stove, tv, etc... and be comfortable is a challenge.
 

bholler

Chimney sweep
Staff member
Jan 14, 2014
26,077
central pa
That is of course possible. That radiator is a 13ft stretch to the corner to the right which is where it runs probably 19 ft along the other wall. The problem is I dont have a stove picked out, most stores are sold out at the moment, however I just spoke to a guy who has 3 Jotul F500s, other than that Im limited to Home Depot, Lowes, and whatever I can order online.

The alcove looks amazing to me, and I feel its safer with my children.

I dont have exact room dimensions, as I said in one of my other threads this room was the garage and it was converted into the main living room in the late 80s, but the size is limited. I believe its 13x16. So to fit couches, the stove, tv, etc... and be comfortable is a challenge.
You can't possibly start building an alcove without having the stove picked out.
 
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begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
90,473
South Puget Sound, WA
The Jotul F500 is not an ideal alcove stove due to the side-load door. Nothing should be started without first drawing up a plan and getting it reviewed. Alcoves have more constraints than a flat wall or corner install.
 

DaBurner87

New Member
Sep 17, 2021
22
New York
I didnt think those clearances were too bad. It showed 6 inches per side and 12 inches off the back wall. Yes I notuces you needed the locking side door kit. The price of the Jotul I believe is $4000 which is out if my budget.


I guess I really need help picking a stove. My budget is about $1800, but it neess to be an alcove friendly stove with a way to reduce clearances.
 

kennyp2339

Minister of Fire
Feb 16, 2014
6,099
07462
I totally see what your saying now, or dealing with, those pics help a lot, let me ask the question, what are you planning on doing chimney wise? straight up and through the roof or out the wall then straight up along side the house?
Also, I would call in a plumber, just cutout the section of baseboard heat and run a piece of pex tubing from the inlet of the former baseboard to the next baseboard, loosing on strip prob wont make a difference, and when its really cold out the stove will be going anyway.
As far as an alcove, I dont quiet understand that desire, nothing like taking a radiant heater and shoving it into a smaller space to block heat and take away natural convection, since the jotul f500 doesnt have a blower unless you buy the kit at almost an additional $500.00.
BTW the jotul is a great stove, lots of happy member here and it looks like thats a proper size stove for you house and climate location.
 

DaBurner87

New Member
Sep 17, 2021
22
New York
I totally see what your saying now, or dealing with, those pics help a lot, let me ask the question, what are you planning on doing chimney wise? straight up and through the roof or out the wall then straight up along side the house?
Also, I would call in a plumber, just cutout the section of baseboard heat and run a piece of pex tubing from the inlet of the former baseboard to the next baseboard, loosing on strip prob wont make a difference, and when its really cold out the stove will be going anyway.
As far as an alcove, I dont quiet understand that desire, nothing like taking a radiant heater and shoving it into a smaller space to block heat and take away natural convection, since the jotul f500 doesnt have a blower unless you buy the kit at almost an additional $500.00.
BTW the jotul is a great stove, lots of happy member here and it looks like thats a proper size stove for you house and climate location.
I love the look of the alcove, and I feel its safer for my kids. I figured it would cut the output down a bit, but I love that it gives me a mantel to hang stocks etc...from during the holidays. It might seem silly but my wife loves Xmas, and she wants the mantel.

I am calling more fireplace stores to see if they have floor models to sell if they have no stock it doesn't seem like a bad idea to ask.
 

DaBurner87

New Member
Sep 17, 2021
22
New York
I love the look of the alcove, and I feel its safer for my kids. I figured it would cut the output down a bit, but I love that it gives me a mantel to hang stocks etc...from during the holidays. It might seem silly but my wife loves Xmas, and she wants the mantel.

I am calling more fireplace stores to see if they have floor models to sell if they have no stock it doesn't seem like a bad idea to ask.
Oh and the plan is to have the pipe go straight up out of the roof, I've read its safer that way.
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
90,473
South Puget Sound, WA
I didnt think those clearances were too bad. It showed 6 inches per side and 12 inches off the back wall. Yes I notuces you needed the locking side door kit. The price of the Jotul I believe is $4000 which is out if my budget.


I guess I really need help picking a stove. My budget is about $1800, but it neess to be an alcove friendly stove with a way to reduce clearances.
This is not a realistic project budget and design even if a good quality used stove is found that qualifies. The flue system alone may cost $1500 depending on design and the house.
 

vatmark

Member
Jan 5, 2017
103
Nebo NC
That's a great looking holiday picture and wonderful setting for that beautiful stove.
Thanks! We are not full time burners but we love using the stove. There is just no comparing the type of heat that comes from burning wood.

We do take the stockings down when we use the stove.

IMG_4711.jpg
 

DaBurner87

New Member
Sep 17, 2021
22
New York
That's a good idea vatmark, something I will consider. I like the alcove for a few reasons, the mantle as stated, but also the option to mount a TV up on that wall. Although I'm sure a TV won't be recommended to be mounted above a stove, I've seen it done many times. Just incase we decide to change the look of the room. I guess when the stove comes I will have to make a choice. By the way I ordered a Drolet Escape 1800. So the budget I previously stated is all sorts of wrong.
 

kennyp2339

Minister of Fire
Feb 16, 2014
6,099
07462
Nice stove choice, Things to consider if your putting the stove up on the bump out, depending on the orientation of the outside wall (does it lead to direct day light?) if so order the fresh air kit (oak) this will provide direct outside air to the stove for combustion and reduce the floor draft you'll feel when the stove is running. If you remove the existing baseboard heat run and bump out the the bump out, factor in the steel studs for behind the stove and the stove w/ the blower mounted, I see the stove is more or less 25 5/8" depth but that w/out the blower mounted on the back. A removeable hearth pad might be suitable for the front of the stove on the lower floor portion since the stove only requires ember protection and it will be sitting higher up, but check with local code enforcement on that.
Reconsider the tv mounting area, a stove in an alcove will already have a more focused area of heat coming from it, just a recipe to cook expensive electronics.
Kids & woodstoves, kids are always curious, especially with fire, but if they are taught from the beginning that its a tool and not a toy they will respect it, depending on how old they are means different things, for a toddler just saying hot (like the cooking stove) and putting they're hand near it to feel the radiant heat is usually enough for the kiddo to register danger in there mind danger, older kids need to be reminded not to throw things near the stove (toys, clothing stuff)
Having an alcove seems a bit more dangerous because the visual area of the stove is closed off on 3 sides and there is more of a chance of a rouge toy landing somewhere near or behind the stove and not being seen until you start smelling that soft plastic smell. But everyone's kids are different and its how they are raised, some families have kids that live perpetually in a library / boot camp environment, others have the Ringling Brothers and 3 Stooges 24/7.
 

Stovepiper

New Member
Sep 21, 2021
20
Canada
The mantle is stained pine.
Thanks! @vatmark, does the stone wall protrude from the wooden wall very much? If you wouldn't mind taking a few more photos from side angles, I'd really love to show this example to our contractor... I am trying to find a way to have a mantel with our new stove (to be installed in November)!
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
90,473
South Puget Sound, WA
If the mantel is non-combustible, then clearances are not an issue. There are many great looking non-combustible mantels now available.
 

vatmark

Member
Jan 5, 2017
103
Nebo NC
Thanks! @vatmark, does the stone wall protrude from the wooden wall very much? If you wouldn't mind taking a few more photos from side angles, I'd really love to show this example to our contractor... I am trying to find a way to have a mantel with our new stove (to be installed in November)!
I wont be home until next week so can not snap any pictures. I found one picture I took right when we moved in. The stone is a veneer so it does not protrude from the wall much. Our stove pipe is double wall and we have a rear heat guard on the back of the stove.

150AD16C-8304-4E34-B960-A360C3EA68F9.jpeg
 
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