Raising Lintel Height

[CT-Mike]

Some of you may remember my thread a little while ago about removing our Freedom insert, and replacing it with a pellet insert. I been thinking a lot about this, and I don't think I want to limit myself to a single fuel. With that in mind, I would like to remove the insert and install a Lopi Cape Cod. A BKK would be nice for the long burn times, but SWMBO can't get past the utilitarian look of it.

So to install the Cape Cod it seems I would need to remove a couple of courses of brick from the masonry fireplace to raise the lintel height. This would give the added benefit of allowing the stove to sit back into the opening more so it doesn't protrude into the room as much. I would definitely go for the optional fan in this setup since the stove would be semi-recessed.

So, how hard is it to raise the lintel? Is this something I could do myself, or would I need to hire a mason?

Thanks,

Mike

 

[Jon1270]

It's tough to answer this without some pictures, preferably from inside and out of the fireplace. I did a bit of brick work around my hearth, and my guess is that you'll have some unsupported bricks fall out before you get the new lintel in place. Getting them back in is easy, but getting new mortar to look like the original mortar might be challenging.

 

[CT-Mike]

A couple of loose bricks and unmatched mortar isn't a problem as the entire fireplace is getting veneered with black granite.

 

[begreen]

Is there a metal lintel frame in place? If so that will need to be cut or removed and replaced. I would certainly get a pro to look at this and give a quote before proceeding. But then again my masonry skills and knowledge are weak.

 

[Ashful]

I know very little about modern construction, but have done a good deal of masonry work in old houses. Generally, a masonry wall will not cave when a lintel is removed, assuming that wall is thick enough that it cannot buckle outwards or inwards. In an old stone or brick wall, 18" thick, the worst that can happen is a few bricks / stones fall out. What you end up with then is an arch, which is self-supporting. This is usually the case when replacing rotten window or door lintels in 18th-century buildings.

The issue with modern construction, I anticipate, is that it's only 1 course of brick (3.5") thick. The stresses could cause the wall to buckle in or out, instead of holding the arch, and allow the entire thing to collapse.

 

[CT-Mike]

Yes, there is a metal lintel frame in place. I am wondering if I can remove the mortar between a couple of courses higher up, insert a new lintel frame and then remove the lower courses and frame.

 

[Jon1270]

That idea sounds like a long shot. I'd be surprised if you could remove enough mortar from the back while still leaving enough in front to support the bricks. If you somehow managed to do that, then it would be difficult to slip in the new lintel *and* enough mortar to fill in the little irregular gaps between the lintel and the bricks above.

 

[CT-Mike]

I have a mason coming out Thursday afternoon to look at it and give me a quote.

 

[Jon1270]

Let us know what you learn.

 

[Ashful]

If you remove enough brick to get the new lintel in, the lower bricks and lintel might as well not be there. If you're thinking they'll catch things if they begin to fall, remember there's no "small" movement in masonry.

How thick is the wall?

 

[Dune]

It is actually a corbeling effect , rather than an arch effect, which supports the upper bricks when a lintel is removed. To have an actual arch, the brick/stone must
be tapered.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corbel_arch

 

[Ashful]

It is actually a corbeling effect , rather than an arch effect...

Vocabulary never was my strong suit.

 

[sailor61]

I had a similar problem in mid 60's fireplace and I skipped trying to raise the lintel. Was afraid the whole wall would come down. Had a raised hearth so what I did was remove the hearth down to the floor, that gave me plenty of height. This room is built on a slab so redoing the exposed section of floor was simple with some slate from the big box store. One suggestion to someone doing this - don't use real slate, go with the ceramic tile look a likes. The natural slate is miserable to get level.

 

[Berner]

I have a mason coming out Thursday afternoon to look at it and give me a quote.

I recently had a few masons come in to give me a qoute for this exact situation. One gave me a qoute for 850 (removing old lintel and installing a new lintel 2 courses higher) one said he couldn't do it, and one the following week told me he was leaving the country. Needless to say I have a couple of more guys coming in this weekend as I was a little surprised how expensive 850 sounded. Please let me know how you make out when you get your qoute.

 

[CT-Mike]

I recently had a few masons come in to give me a qoute for this exact situation. One gave me a qoute for 850 (removing old lintel and installing a new lintel 2 courses higher) one said he couldn't do it, and one the following week told me he was leaving the country. Needless to say I have a couple of more guys coming in this weekend as I was a little surprised how expensive 850 sounded. Please let me know how you make out when you get your qoute.

Actually SWMBO has decreed that she is done with the mess associated with burning wood, and we are replacing the Freedom with a MT Vernon AE pellet insert. So there is no need to raise the lintel and I have cancelled the appointment.

Sorry.

 

[begreen]

I think it's we that are sorry Mike. That's a nice (expensive) pellet insert, but pellets are not dust or mess free either.

 

[CT-Mike]

I think it's we that are sorry Mike. That's a nice (expensive) pellet insert, but pellets are not dust or mess free either.

Agreed, but at least the mess associated with pellets can be vacummed up with the central vac system, no need for a broom or dustpan.

 

[Scols]

What mess from a woodstove cant be cleaned upith a vacuum?

 

[Ashful]

What mess from a woodstove cant be cleaned upith a vacuum?

Anything live!

 

[Scols]

Thought you were refering to the mess out side the stove. Sorry to see you going to pellets, I would rather get rid of my wife than make that switch.

 

[Ashful]

I do often get live bits outside the stove, either falling out when I'm raking the coals, or popping out when I burn something resinous (walnut is the biggest offender in my stacks).

Scols makes a good point, though...

I would rather get rid of my wife than make that switch.

 

[Scols]

It seems like every time I log onto the Hearth.Com homepage half of the new questions are from people having trouble with pellet stoves, whether it be the temp controls,augers,hoppers,or lousy pellets. Plus,my wife and I hate big box stores and our electric company so i'll be damned if im gonna pay either to heat my home. Even if I had to buy all the wood I burn, I would rather give my money to the local tree guys than HD, Lowes,TSC,etc. And best of all,cutting stuff up with chain saws and mauls and sledge hammers is great exercise,teaches the kids about hard work, and is a hell of alot of fun.

 

[Scols]

Didnt mean to highjack this thread into a yay for wood boo to pellets thing.. I have a similar problem as OP, my lintel is only 25 inches from the bottom of the FP. I cut the legs down on my smoke dragon so I could set it back into my FP and maintain my clearences. However this spring I would like to upgrade to an epa stove.I cant decide if I should just pick the stove I want and have the fp modified to that stoves dimensions,or see how much work can be done to the fp and then pick whatever stove would fit.

 

[Brian850]

Mike, I recently raised mine. I raised it about the height of 2 bricks. I couldn't go up any more because of the housing/ frame for the damper. I had a mason look at it before I did it. I put in a new steel lentel

 

[CT-Mike]

Mike, I recently raised mine. I raised it about the height of 2 bricks. I couldn't go up any more because of the housing/ frame for the damper. I had a mason look at it before I did it. I put in a new steel lentel

Would you mind giving a little explanation of how you did it? Did you just remove two courses and then install a new lintel, or do something to support the upper courses before removing the two courses?