realistic expectations ?

[deedub]

Hi,
I'm ready to pull the trigger and buy a Jotul Castine 400 to help in heating costs for my house. I'm looking to supplement my oil heating and since the Castine 400 is " rated " for up to 1600 sf, I am curious as to how effective it will be. The first floor of the house is 1300 sf and upstairs is 900 sf, see attached plans. I have (2) masonry fireplaces and the one on the left side of the plan ( in Living room 23' x 13' ) is where i'm putting the wood stove. I thought about putting the stove at the other end of the house ( on the right side of the plan), but that portion of the house is only a single story and feel that I will get more heat gain upstairs in the bedrooms if the stove is below the second floor ( on the left side of the plan ). You will also see that the first floor plan is relatively open with several cased openings between rooms and more than one way to move from room to room. Any thoughts on how well the Castine should perform with this layout and what I could expect in terms of heat gain throughout the house ? FYI, the Castine is the largest stove that will fit in my existing fireplace. Thanks in advance

 

[Jags]

Being that wood stoves are considered "space" heaters, and by the layout of your house, I would consider the Jotul a good call. I think you will find that it nicely warms the rooms to the left with "maybe" some carry over to the other parts of the house. I would not get my hopes up too much that it will have any big impact to the right side of your layout though.

Any bigger of a stove than what you are looking at would probably just cook you out of the living room area and you would STILL have a difficult time in moving that heat around.

Welcome to the forum! There should be others stopping by to give additional opinions.

 

[savageactor7]

Before you pull the trigger do some research to see how easy it will be to get wood where you live. Earlier this year a few posters were scrambling to find a wood source. Now if wood isn't a problem for you ...go for it. You might like enough to put an insert in your other fireplace too.

 

[begreen]

Welcome deedub. I concur with Jags, the floorplan is not open which means that it will be a challenge to get heat circulating from the wood stove room to the rest of the house. The F400 looks to be about the right sized stove for the area to be heated. I'd recommend connecting it to an insulated liner in the exterior chimney if at all possible.

 

[stoveguy13]

If the f400 fits the f500 should go as well in most cases and will give you some more kick

 

[deedub]

Before you pull the trigger do some research to see how easy it will be to get wood where you live. Earlier this year a few posters were scrambling to find a wood source. Now if wood isn't a problem for you ...go for it. You might like enough to put an insert in your other fireplace too.

Thanks, I have about 2 cords now with more to come just on my property. What is the benefit to having an insulated liner ? I was planning on just a liner all the way up the chimney..25'. Is it realistic that I will get some noticeable heat gain to the upstairs bedrooms ?

 

[fossil]

The Living Room would seem to be the logical location, and you've obviously put some good thought into this. I would wonder only about where you find you like to spend your time...Family Room vs. Living Room. Just depends on your lifestyle. Some folks with house layouts like yours hardly ever sit around in the Living Room. During the burning season, you're definitely gonna want to have the insert in the same room as you have you most of the time. There are ways to encourage diffusion of the warm air, mostly through the use of strategically placed fans, be they ceiling fans, or even portable fans. That's something you might incorporate into your plan, and then experiment with after you've got the install up and running. Gotta tell ya, I'm intrigued by savage's notion of eventually seeing two inserts in that home...that would be deluxe! Welcome, good luck, and have fun! Rick

 

[deedub]

The Living Room would seem to be the logical location, and you've obviously put some good thought into this. I would wonder only about where you find you like to spend your time...Family Room vs. Living Room. Just depends on your lifestyle. Some folks with house layouts like yours hardly ever sit around in the Living Room. During the burning season, you're definitely gonna want to have the insert in the same room as you have you most of the time. There are ways to encourage diffusion of the warm air, mostly through the use of strategically placed fans, be they ceiling fans, or even portable fans. That's something you might incorporate into your plan, and then experiment with after you've got the install up and running. Gotta tell ya, I'm intrigued by savage's notion of eventually seeing two inserts in that home...that would be deluxe! Welcome, good luck, and have fun! Rick

ahh, the living room vs. family room dilemma. my wife and I went back and forth sooo many times but since the kitchen / family room is where we are most, the stove wanted to be there, but it didn't make sense from a overall home heating perspective. We have the lcd tv in the family room ( and that was a fiasco to find the best location ) near the fireplace so I thought a stove would certainly damage the tv, so another pro for having the stove in the living room. I have heard others suggest a stove or insert in both, perhaps in time.

 

[begreen]

Two stoves would be a sweet solution, but twice the work and expense as well. How close is the LCD? Is it to the side of the fireplace or above it?

 

[deedub]

Two stoves would be a sweet solution, but twice the work and expense as well. How close is the LCD? Is it to the side of the fireplace or above it?

the lcd to the side of the fireplace opening is about 24" and would be about 29" to the corner of the stove...too close no ?

 

[granpajohn]

I think he's going to have a summer family room and a winter family room. Seriously, I went through a somewhat similar process, and am glad that I put the stove into the family room that we use. If I was one of those 24/7 burners, it might be OK, but for evening/weekend heat, I'm sure this is better. Be advised, however, that my house layout is more open; and I think smaller overall.

Sell the big TV and use the money to buy 2 stoves. Your children's minds will thank you someday. (Sorry, I'm old school, as they say.)

 

[savageactor7]

My thinking with the two stoves is that deedub would only have to put an occasional split in at a time to keep his entire house warm...beside he has his own source of wood...that means if he cleaned up his wood lot he could burn trash wood that's properly dried out...besides how cold could it possible get in CT? While I have a lot of prime wood piled up...I am the king of the punky wood burners.

 

[fossil]

...Sell the big TV and use the money to buy 2 stoves. Your children's minds will thank you someday. (Sorry, I'm old school, as they say.)

Or...you could keep the TV and sell the kids. You'll save enough money in the long run to buy more forested acreage and a nice garage full of equipment to harvest it. :coolsmile: Rick

 

[deedub]

thanks for the humor..can't sell the kids, they'll need to be put to work. lots of good comments here. I'm now entertaining the idea of putting the stove in the family room ( unlike what the plan shows ) IF someone can tell me what kind of heat gains I may have upstairs if the stove stays in the Living room. If they are minimal and I won't really see a difference, there's really no point in heating the living room since we don't use it that much.

thanks

 

[granpajohn]

...IF someone can tell me what kind of heat gains I may have upstairs if the stove stays in the Living room. If they are minimal and I won't really see a difference, there's really no point in heating the living room since we don't use it that much.
thanks

One other thing...Is the oil heat you ref'd forced air or hot water baseboard? My feeling is that the forced air systems are better at moving the hot room dividends around. I don't think it's something to count on for whole house heating, but in the few occassions I've done so, it has helped a bit. Consider also our Southern winters are not so cold here.

 

[fossil]

thanks for the humor..can't sell the kids, they'll need to be put to work. lots of good comments here. I'm now entertaining the idea of putting the stove in the family room ( unlike what the plan shows ) IF someone can tell me what kind of heat gains I may have upstairs if the stove stays in the Living room. If they are minimal and I won't really see a difference, there's really no point in heating the living room since we don't use it that much.

thanks

Hmm...good point about the kids. Never occured to me, because I just have one daughter, now in graduate school, and she's never done a lick o' work for me in her life. Tough call on the heat gain upstairs. Regardless of the insert location, there's a somewhat torturous path, but hot air is hot air, and it's gonna want to find its way up. If the staircase is wide open, then there will certainly be some heating effect upstairs, depending on how hot and how consistently you burn the insert. One advantage to the Family Room location is that it looks as though the kitchen and Dining Room are likely to benefit more than if the insert was in the LR. Lots to think about, but always remember that the appliances we're talking about are, as Jags said early on, space heaters. That being said, we're able to pretty effectively heat a 2400 sf two-story (vaulted ceiling great room and partially open lofted upstairs) using only a freestanding woodstove at one end of the great room. Blower on the stove and ceiling fans make the system work. Keep thinking and asking questions. Rick

 

[Poult]

I think it depends on how much oil you want to burn. If you put it in the living room you get an overall reduction in oil usage since the upstairs gets a lot of the heat from the stove. But, if you use the kitchen and family room more, you won't be enjoying yourself so much in there assuming you keep the thermostat turned down to save oil. I'd opt for putting it in the family room, and maybe do some extra work venting to get the heat upstairs if it needed it. Put the cheap heat (wood) where you'll get the most benefit from it.

Poult

 

[Jags]

Put the cheap heat (wood) where you'll get the most benefit from it.

Poult

Yep, put the darn thing where YOU are gonna be. Neither one of your locations is gonna be "great" for heating the upstairs. One, maybe a little better than the other, but for nightly and weekend fires, I think you will find that the upstairs gain is gonna be minimal with your layout.

You will get more enjoyment from it and the fire will be tended better from a used room than if it were located in an unused room. Just one dudes opinion.

 

[deedub]

so if I do plan on reversing my thinking and putting the stove in the family room, does it make sense to get the same size stove if the stove would now be farther away from the second floor ? It would then only have to focus on heating the 1300 sf first floor. the staircase to the second floor is open on one side and there is a return air grille at the top of the stair so if I run the hydro air system at the same time, it should pull warm air upstairs. any more thoughts on the second floor heat benefit ?

 

[Jags]

I still think that you would be doing good with the 1100 or the NC-13 as far as size goes. Especially if you are gonna try and move that air around the bottom floor.

 

[BrotherBart]

Well, it looks like I get to be the bad guy. If you put a free standing stove in either one of those fireplaces cut the heated area rating in half. Unless there is a blower option for the Castine that I haven't heard of yet.

That layout just screams for a fireplace insert with blower in the living room fireplace.

I have a monster free stander in a fireplace located approximately where your family room fireplace is located and without the blower I have a very warm family room and kitchen and that is about it. With the blower I heat the whole 2,500 sq. feet center hall colonial with it. The blower blows the heat straight out from the fireplace and from there the heat goes looking for other places to live. As well the blower is pulling cool air in at floor level setting up a circulation loop in the house. When you walk up the stairs you can feel the cold air falling down the stairs and the warm air going up to replace it.

 

[BrotherBart]

I still think that you would be doing good with the 1100 or the NC-13 as far as size goes. Especially if you are gonna try and move that air around the bottom floor.

I think you are thinking of a different thread Sailor.

 

[begreen]

If they are minimal and I won’t really see a difference, there’s really no point in heating the living room since we don’t use it that much.

It looks like the family room is very open to the adjacent kitchen dining space. If that is where your family spends a lot of it's time, that's the best plan. If it will fit, in this location, I would go up one size larger to the Oslo and get longer burn times and a bit more reserve heat. Or there are some good 2 cu ft inserts out there.

 

[Jags]

I still think that you would be doing good with the 1100 or the NC-13 as far as size goes. Especially if you are gonna try and move that air around the bottom floor.

I think you are thinking of a different thread Sailor.

Belay my last.

Baaaahaa, ha. I better check what I wrote in the other thread. Gawd, its gotta be beer thirty somewhere. %-P

 

[fossil]

Well, it looks like I get to be the bad guy.

So, what's new? :coolsmile: I can't even see the point of an insert without a blower. Even on a freestanding, it makes a world of difference in my experience. Absent the blower, the insert's just radiating out the front, and doing a bit of convection straight up the face. With the blower, cold room air's being circulated around the firebox and returned horizontally to the room (forced convection)...much better use of the energy released by combustion in the box. Same holds true for a freestanding, although some folks seem perfectly happy with a freestanding without a blower kit. Works for me in my workshop, but in the house, where we're trying to heat a much larger and more complex space, the blower kit is essential, in my mind. (I still think the insert should go where the people go). Rick