Reduce fireplace size?

[ccarrigan]

Hey everyone! We recently bought a home and are looking at options to open up the main downstairs area. Unfortunately, right in the middle is a huge fireplace. Pictures are here: https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/2561-Chester-Rd-Upper-Arlington-OH-43221/33992717_zpid/

Do you think it's possible to reduce the size? We'd love to keep it where possible and maybe integrate it into an island, but as it is now taking out the surrounding walls won't buy us a lot of openness. We're open to other ideas as well. Thanks!

 

[Vale straven]

Slim it down or go double sided. It could open things up.

 

[Whitenuckler]

Hey everyone! We recently bought a home and are looking at options to open up the main downstairs area. Unfortunately, right in the middle is a huge fireplace. Pictures are here: https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/2561-Chester-Rd-Upper-Arlington-OH-43221/33992717_zpid/

Do you think it's possible to reduce the size? We'd love to keep it where possible and maybe integrate it into an island, but as it is now taking out the surrounding walls won't buy us a lot of openness. We're open to other ideas as well. Thanks!

I am not sure if there is any load bearing support in there, but to me unless you really want an open burn masonry fireplace, it might be worth considering doing wood somewhere else in the house and be airtight. If you have gas you redesign it and maybe have a gas log set there. All depends on if you want to heat with wood, or just have it for looks and the odd fire. You will need to get it all inspected if you are going to use it.

 

[4x4prepper]

> Do you think it's possible to reduce the size?

It looks like the house was designed and built around the chimney and was the very first thing built. You have no roof vents except what is inside the chimney, this means even your house plumbing is venting through that area along with your HVAC. You can plainly see the ceramic flue liner (?) with rain cover in the photos that the fireplace uses.

So, you are not getting a see through fireplace, moving the wall, or anything such thing unless you plan on spending $100,000 to redo the plumbing and HVAC by sticking more holes in the roof.

It is a beautiful ideally located chimney, if it was ME, I would just leave it.

 

[ccarrigan]

> Do you think it's possible to reduce the size?

It looks like the house was designed and built around the chimney and was the very first thing built. You have no roof vents except what is inside the chimney, this means even your house plumbing is venting through that area along with your HVAC. You can plainly see the ceramic flue liner (?) with rain cover in the photos that the fireplace uses.

So, you are not getting a see through fireplace, moving the wall, or anything such thing unless you plan on spending $100,000 to redo the plumbing and HVAC by sticking more holes in the roof.

It is a beautiful ideally located chimney, if it was ME, I would just leave it.

So we did look in to that and there's already an alternate exhaust pipe in the basement near the HVAC and plumbing. So we should be able to do those without much hassle. But we'd like to leave it for sure if possible, just making it smaller. I have to assume that some of it is just "for show", like the corner portion. That corner can't be holding up the whole chimney stack, right?

 

[ccarrigan]

I am not sure if there is any load bearing support in there, but to me unless you really want an open burn masonry fireplace, it might be worth considering doing wood somewhere else in the house and be airtight. If you have gas you redesign it and maybe have a gas log set there. All depends on if you want to heat with wood, or just have it for looks and the odd fire. You will need to get it all inspected if you are going to use it.

It's gas. And having a smaller gas fireplace would be great if we could slim it down a bit.

 

[Whitenuckler]

> Do you think it's possible to reduce the size?

It looks like the house was designed and built around the chimney and was the very first thing built. You have no roof vents except what is inside the chimney, this means even your house plumbing is venting through that area along with your HVAC. You can plainly see the ceramic flue liner (?) with rain cover in the photos that the fireplace uses.

So, you are not getting a see through fireplace, moving the wall, or anything such thing unless you plan on spending $100,000 to redo the plumbing and HVAC by sticking more holes in the roof.

It is a beautiful ideally located chimney, if it was ME, I would just leave it.

Good catch. I didn't take notice of those pipes in the chimney. If it is a gas furnace, maybe if it was upgraded it would vent out of the side of the house. As far as a plumbing stack, I find it had to believe it's there in the first place. A new one could be installed, but it would not be easy and likely some closet space to get to the roof. Maybe it's something else? There is no view of the other side of the roof is there?

 

[ccarrigan]

Good catch. I didn't take notice of those pipes in the chimney. If it is a gas furnace, maybe if it was upgraded it would vent out of the side of the house. As far as a plumbing stack, I find it had to believe it's there in the first place. A new one could be installed, but it would not be easy and likely some closet space to get to the roof. Maybe it's something else? There is no view of the other side of the roof is there?

It's a gas furnace. The hot water heater does go up in to the chimney. They noted I could get a different kind that could then vent out the wall.

For a picture, you mean one from the back of the house of the chimney?

 

[bholler]

It's a gas furnace. The hot water heater does go up in to the chimney. They noted I could get a different kind that could then vent out the wall.

For a picture, you mean one from the back of the house of the chimney?

Really the only way to make it smaller is take it down and start over quite honestly

 

[ccarrigan]

Really the only way to make it smaller is take it down and start over quite honestly

So like that open corner portion, that can't be supporting the rest of the chimney right? Couldn't that go?

 

[Whitenuckler]

It's a gas furnace. The hot water heater does go up in to the chimney. They noted I could get a different kind that could then vent out the wall.

For a picture, you mean one from the back of the house of the chimney?

So one spot with the big rain cap is the wood fireplace, then next is the gas furnace, and then the white pipe is the water heater? I am still looking for the plumbing stack pipe which is either cast iron or black ABS. Yes, I don't think they were able to include a picture of the roof from the back. All this really only matters if you were to get rid of the masonry chimney I guess. I had a house that had a small brick chimney that was used for an oil furnace. I got them to take it down below the soffit when I had a new roof put on. It was not being used anymore.

 

[4x4prepper]

I have actually help built these before in houses when I did construction. The space itself has to be a certain width, volume, and off set, seams filled with self-charring foam, etc., The ones we built were basically heavy sheet metal from the basement to attic, and had to met certain codes to contain a fire for a certain amount of time and degrees.

I have no idea on the specs, the architect getting paid $300+ an hour by the boss does the blueprint, the builders just try to follow them.

Just because you remove utilities from the space, does not mean you can decrease the space.

I bet with a good IR scanner available today, with all the utilities being used, and the house A/C on, you can see all the details of the enclosed space without being intrusive, on all floors. On the 2nd floor, usually in a bedroom closet, you can find an access panel under the drywall (set a certain number of inches away using special fireproof drywall/fiberglass) if you wanted to put a scope or something in there. Been 20 years, but, I think maybe we screwed them down and then taped it.

I would go in the attic and scope out what the chimney space looks like. If it is cement, block, or field stone, you basically are not doing anything with it without rebuilding the house. If it is sheet (plate) steel then the possibility is there. Though that space might be like balloon walls with the studs going from basement to attic floor.

Go to the city, get the blue prints, and have an architect that makes $300+ an hour, at a design house, have a look at it.

 

[4x4prepper]

> then the white pipe is the water heater?

Unlikely since everyone I had to fix or install has been sheet metal. Plus, they have to have a cover-hood. Most likely a vent for the P-traps and it could be attached to a cast iron pipe out of sight. All the house plumbing might be attached to that one plastic PVC 3" pipe.

 

[ccarrigan]

So one spot with the big rain cap is the wood fireplace, then next is the gas furnace, and then the white pipe is the water heater? I am still looking for the plumbing stack pipe which is either cast iron or black ABS. Yes, I don't think they were able to include a picture of the roof from the back. All this really only matters if you were to get rid of the masonry chimney I guess. I had a house that had a small brick chimney that was used for an oil furnace. I got them to take it down below the soffit when I had a new roof put on. It was not being used anymore.

Yeah we're also looking at removing it completely but that's both a huge expense and a removal of something interesting that'd be nice to keep.

 

[ccarrigan]

I have actually help built these before in houses when I did construction. The space itself has to be a certain width, volume, and off set, seams filled with self-charring foam, etc., The ones we built were basically heavy sheet metal from the basement to attic, and had to met certain codes to contain a fire for a certain amount of time and degrees.

I have no idea on the specs, the architect getting paid $300+ an hour by the boss does the blueprint, the builders just try to follow them.

Just because you remove utilities from the space, does not mean you can decrease the space.

I bet with a good IR scanner available today, with all the utilities being used, and the house A/C on, you can see all the details of the enclosed space without being intrusive, on all floors. On the 2nd floor, usually in a bedroom closet, you can find an access panel under the drywall (set a certain number of inches away using special fireproof drywall/fiberglass) if you wanted to put a scope or something in there. Been 20 years, but, I think maybe we screwed them down and then taped it.

I would go in the attic and scope out what the chimney space looks like. If it is cement, block, or field stone, you basically are not doing anything with it without rebuilding the house. If it is sheet (plate) steel then the possibility is there. Though that space might be like balloon walls with the studs going from basement to attic floor.

Go to the city, get the blue prints, and have an architect that makes $300+ an hour, at a design house, have a look at it.

The second floor portion goes in between two bedrooms (jut outs). In the attic I believe it's MUCH smaller than what I see in the living room. That's why I was wondering if I could just support the chimney portion and remove the rest.

 

[4x4prepper]

Picture of the attic and then post a picture of the IR scan.

 

[Whitenuckler]

Also, I think your first priority should be to inspect it on the outside. Check the brick and mortar. Check the capping.
Check the flashing. I bought this house last year. It was built in the 70's. Masonry fireplace in the living room (outside wall).
The chimney has two sides. One side was an oil furnace. Before I could even get house insurance I needed the fireplace part either approved, or capped. The oil side was already not used. When I got a new roof here, they found water damage around the chimney.
You need to make sure everything is OK the way it is before planning upgrades. I ended up sticking an electric fireplace in the opening and capped the chimney myself with sheet metal. Your situation is harder to solve due to it's location, but you still need to verify it's not causing problems.

 

[ccarrigan]

Picture of the attic and then post a picture of the IR scan.

I’ll have to get up in the attic. I don’t have an IR scanner though.