Shop stove

[Highbeam]

Hello,

I've been running an Englander NC30 in my 1800 SF shop building, insulated, 14' tall ceilings, for about 12 years. I use the building intermittently so when I burn the stove I burn it hot to heat up the large space. The NC30 has been fine, a little cracking, a little melting, both in the normal places and both safely. I closely monitor flue and stove temps to keep it safe but yes I run it at high output a lot.

I like a stove for this space. A wood furnace is less aesthetically pleasing and I really enjoy sitting by the stove to warm up vs. a ducted system.

Thinking about upgrading the stove before the fed rebate expires. I have been eyeballing the Woodstock IS because I think it would be a great stove to run, the price is decent and it is rebate eligible due to high efficiency.

Are there any other large, high output, efficient stoves out there at a similar price point?

 

[begreen]

The Drolet Austral III is probably the closest, but not that different from the 30-NC.

Some furnaces from Drolet are essentially their big wood stove with a blower cabinet. They have the same door and fireview as the freestanding stove. Englander did this with the 30-NC before SBI bought them out.

 

[Turbo89]

Another vote for looking at Drolet, I’m running a 2.3cu-ft firebox VC in my ~1000 sq-ft shop with 13.5ft ceilings (r38 ceiling and r21 wall insulation), and that can keep up, especially with the blower I added. But if I was looking at something new, I’d be looking for a 3+ cu-ft box.

The Drolet HT-3000 is pretty affordable, and I’m sure with a blower its 3.5cu-ft firebox (looks to be about the same as what you have now) would keep up. Other than that I’d be looking at blaze king… but the 2-3x the cost.

Update after thought - I assume this is the one you’re looking at: https://www.woodstove.com/ideal-steel-hybrid-wood-stove

Are you concerned about going down in firebox size? Or has the 3.5 been keeping up fine?

 

[Highbeam]

Another vote for looking at Drolet, I’m running a 2.3cu-ft firebox VC in my ~1000 sq-ft shop with 13.5ft ceilings (r38 ceiling and r21 wall insulation), and that can keep up, especially with the blower I added. But if I was looking at something new, I’d be looking for a 3+ cu-ft box.

The Drolet HT-3000 is pretty affordable, and I’m sure with a blower its 3.5cu-ft firebox (looks to be about the same as what you have now) would keep up. Other than that I’d be looking at blaze king… but the 2-3x the cost.

Update after thought - I assume this is the one you’re looking at: https://www.woodstove.com/ideal-steel-hybrid-wood-stove

Are you concerned about going down in firebox size? Or has the 3.5 been keeping up fine?

The IS is a 3.2 cubic foot box and since my wood is 16" long I don't usually get to fill up the 3.5 CF englander to the max anyway. Then since efficiency is so much higher with the IS I thought it would be a wash. The 3.5 englander keeps up just fine though not a very long burn time even when I try for a long burntime. It just goes through the fuel. Can't say much bad about the Englander other than low efficiency and I've had it so long that I might want to try something cool.

Oh and my stack is all vertical 19'.

The drolet would be a good replacement but not an upgrade. I just didn't know if there was another option out there.

Going to a cat stove like the IS would mean I could not burn anything of suspect origins such as oily rags. I burn them now to avoid the spontaneous combustion issue.

One last thought is that if this stove was great in the shop then maybe it could be swapped with the princess in the house someday. I don't see the BK as a lifetime stove and it's got 13 years on it. There's also the kuma at 2.5 CF but it looks kinda fragile.

 

[Turbo89]

interesting thoughts, I would think such a big firebox would be able to easily burn 10hrs on light load, heck my buddy has an older PE of similar design that coals for 24+hrs with a full box of hardwood and low.

I would not go any lower on firebox size for that many sq-ft with the ceiling height. On cold days my 2.3 eats more wood, and I’m 800+ sq-ft smaller. That being said I can easily get 8hr burns, and 10-12hr burns with the right wood and some careful packing if the firebox.

I’m curious why you don’t think a BK is a lifetime stove? Lots of folks on here love them, and there’s plenty of 20yr old ones out there running? Obviously the CATs will need to be periodically, and gaskets, but the base design looks beefy.

Anyways, that IS stove looks right at home in a shop, post some pics / updates if you end up picking one up.

 

[EatenByLimestone]

So, if you’re hearing from ambient temp, you’re running that Englander hot, and it sounds like it’s doing a pretty good job for you.

Would it be possible to throw a stove that’ll do baseload heating, maybe a BK to run on low at the other end as the Englander is at. When you want to use the shop. You turn up the BK and fire up the Englander. You’ll have good temps quicker.

 

[Whitenuckler]

So, if you’re hearing from ambient temp, you’re running that Englander hot, and it sounds like it’s doing a pretty good job for you.

Would it be possible to throw a stove that’ll do baseload heating, maybe a BK to run on low at the other end as the Englander is at. When you want to use the shop. You turn up the BK and fire up the Englander. You’ll have good temps quicker.

Hey ! Now we can consider a pellet stove as the base stove.

 

[begreen]

interesting thoughts, I would think such a big firebox would be able to easily burn 10hrs on light load, heck my buddy has an older PE of similar design that coals for 24+hrs with a full box of hardwood and low.

I would not go any lower on firebox size for that many sq-ft with the ceiling height. On cold days my 2.3 eats more wood, and I’m 800+ sq-ft smaller. That being said I can easily get 8hr burns, and 10-12hr burns with the right wood and some careful packing if the firebox.

I’m curious why you don’t think a BK is a lifetime stove? Lots of folks on here love them, and there’s plenty of 20yr old ones out there running? Obviously the CATs will need to be periodically, and gaskets, but the base design looks beefy.

Anyways, that IS stove looks right at home in a shop, post some pics / updates if you end up picking one up.

It should. Something is not right. Most folks reported getting 8-12 hr burns on a full load. I will have to dig a bit, but I thought Roy was on a 12 hr., shoulder season, reload cycle, but could be confusing it with someone else.

 

[Turbo89]

So, if you’re hearing from ambient temp, you’re running that Englander hot, and it sounds like it’s doing a pretty good job for you.

Would it be possible to throw a stove that’ll do baseload heating, maybe a BK to run on low at the other end as the Englander is at. When you want to use the shop. You turn up the BK and fire up the Englander. You’ll have good temps quicker.

The two stove idea is good. I use an electric heater as backup / if I don’t want to keep the stove running (it’s set to like 40F). The electric heater is plenty by itself… but I wouldn’t want to pay the electric bill to keep it going 24/7.

 

[Highbeam]

interesting thoughts, I would think such a big firebox would be able to easily burn 10hrs on light load, heck my buddy has an older PE of similar design that coals for 24+hrs with a full box of hardwood and low.

I would not go any lower on firebox size for that many sq-ft with the ceiling height. On cold days my 2.3 eats more wood, and I’m 800+ sq-ft smaller. That being said I can easily get 8hr burns, and 10-12hr burns with the right wood and some careful packing if the firebox.

I’m curious why you don’t think a BK is a lifetime stove? Lots of folks on here love them, and there’s plenty of 20yr old ones out there running? Obviously the CATs will need to be periodically, and gaskets, but the base design looks beefy.

Anyways, that IS stove looks right at home in a shop, post some pics / updates if you end up picking one up.

The NC30 has never made it overnight. Nah, I could run full loads three hours apart and made a whole post about it. This stove eats and makes lots of heat. It is not a long burner, to be fair I'm burning PWN woods like maple and fir. When the only BS you care about is Burning Stuff. Some of the higher quality and more efficient noncats like the PE summit would almost certainly do a better job at prolonging the burn and then you get into what some folks are willing to call "burn time".

The BK is a great design and performs very well in a home to keep it warm. Really can't be beat the technology for long and low burn times. The metal is thin, you can see the welds from inside when you look at the top. I have had parts of the inside melt and crack despite careful temperature control. Even BKVP has gone through several kings but I'm not sure how many of those were because of house moves or some other reason. Then there is the corrosion issue. I don't know of any 20 year old BKs on these forums of actual burners, especially none that haven't had welding done on them. Certainly an unused stove could last 100 years. Cats and gaskets and paint are normal wear items, no big deal.

What if the IS does low and slow almost as well as the BK? Woodstocks are pretty unique looking (same as BK) but the IS is probably the most traditional. My daughter will be working in Portsmouth Maine for a few months this summer so if we go to visit then maybe I can tour the factory!

 

[Highbeam]

So, if you’re hearing from ambient temp, you’re running that Englander hot, and it sounds like it’s doing a pretty good job for you.

Would it be possible to throw a stove that’ll do baseload heating, maybe a BK to run on low at the other end as the Englander is at. When you want to use the shop. You turn up the BK and fire up the Englander. You’ll have good temps quicker.

The insulated slab has underfloor heating tubes installed. That would be the base heat if such a thing was desired. The shop seldom drops below 50 during the winter so most of the Englander's chore is getting the space from 50 to 70 ish. It really does it well even if not terribly efficiently.

 

[Turbo89]

The NC30 has never made it overnight. Nah, I could run full loads three hours apart and made a whole post about it. This stove eats and makes lots of heat. It is not a long burner, to be fair I'm burning PWN woods like maple and fir. When the only BS you care about is Burning Stuff. Some of the higher quality and more efficient noncats like the PE summit would almost certainly do a better job at prolonging the burn and then you get into what some folks are willing to call "burn time".

The BK is a great design and performs very well in a home to keep it warm. Really can't be beat the technology for long and low burn times. The metal is thin, you can see the welds from inside when you look at the top. I have had parts of the inside melt and crack despite careful temperature control. Even BKVP has gone through several kings but I'm not sure how many of those were because of house moves or some other reason. Then there is the corrosion issue. I don't know of any 20 year old BKs on these forums of actual burners, especially none that haven't had welding done on them. Certainly an unused stove could last 100 years. Cats and gaskets and paint are normal wear items, no big deal.

What if the IS does low and slow almost as well as the BK? Woodstocks are pretty unique looking (same as BK) but the IS is probably the most traditional. My daughter will be working in Portsmouth Maine for a few months this summer so if we go to visit then maybe I can tour the factory!

Great response, thanks! I’ll keep it in mind when I’m shopping for my house basement unit… now I’m definetly interested in IS feedback. Cheers and happy burning.

 

[weee123]

If you’re constantly having to warm up the shop from 50-70 years the Englander isn’t going to get much more than a 3 hour burn time since you’re running it balls out all the time.

In my house where it’s usually running consistently, with 12-14” splits (cut for osburn 1600) I was getting 6-7 hour burns with a 2/3 load on low. Not this upcoming season but next season, I’ll finally be into wood cut for the Englander at 18” and I’m expecting at least 8-9 hour burns times.

 

[EatenByLimestone]

It’d be hard to convince me I needed heat for occasional use when it only gets down to 50 there, lol.

But assuming the bigger the stove, the more heat could be put out in a short period of time, I think I might look at the huge JA Roby stove that uses a 6” chimney.

J. A. ROBY - Wood stoves - ULTIMATE TOR

Nothing but the best for the ones you love! Wood stove heat is warm and healthy. And wood, the oldest natural and renewable energy source, provides unparalleled comfort and ambiance. We’re always on the lookout for new styles and designs and you’ll be amazed by the wide variety and efficiency...

www.jaroby.com

 

[brenndatomu]

My thoughts are that there is nothing to gain from a cat stove since you run hard most of the time...they are only efficient at lower settings.
Personally I'd either go with the big Drolet stove (at that point you may as well run your NC30 into the ground first) or go with the Drolet Heat Commander furnace, since you want the fire view, and the radiant heat to sit by.

 

[Highbeam]

If you’re constantly having to warm up the shop from 50-70 years the Englander isn’t going to get much more than a 3 hour burn time since you’re running it balls out all the time.

In my house where it’s usually running consistently, with 12-14” splits (cut for osburn 1600) I was getting 6-7 hour burns with a 2/3 load on low. Not this upcoming season but next season, I’ll finally be into wood cut for the Englander at 18” and I’m expecting at least 8-9 hour burns times.

Once I heat the shop to 70, then a full load can be turned down. I've done it but that's really not important to me or relevant to the issue here. It's very important to house heating though.

 

[Highbeam]

It’d be hard to convince me I needed heat for occasional use when it only gets down to 50 there, lol.

But assuming the bigger the stove, the more heat could be put out in a short period of time, I think I might look at the huge JA Roby stove that uses a 6” chimney.

J. A. ROBY - Wood stoves - ULTIMATE TOR

Nothing but the best for the ones you love! Wood stove heat is warm and healthy. And wood, the oldest natural and renewable energy source, provides unparalleled comfort and ambiance. We’re always on the lookout for new styles and designs and you’ll be amazed by the wide variety and efficiency...

www.jaroby.com

The shop is well insulated. Outside temps into the single digits Fahrenheit with wind mean it will drop below 50 but those colder stretches don't last very long. I am burning after all and with the thermal mass of an insulated slab the shop doesn't cool too much overnight.

If no wood burning occured in the shop during a cold snap then it would likely cool to unsafe levels for the liquids in there.

I'll look at the JA ROby. Yes, my chimney is 6". Just checked, only their little stoves are EPA certified.

 

[Highbeam]

My thoughts are that there is nothing to gain from a cat stove since you run hard most of the time...they are only efficient at lower settings.
Personally I'd either go with the big Drolet stove (at that point you may as well run your NC30 into the ground first) or go with the Drolet Heat Commander furnace, since you want the fire view, and the radiant heat to sit by.

It's starting to look that way. While I would like to try a cool stove like the IS, and getting a discount with the fed rebate is even better. It might not be a smart move. As a stove enthusiast maybe I just wanted to try something new.

 

[brenndatomu]

As a stove enthusiast maybe I just wanted to try something new.

I get it...I've had thoughts of running a cat stove for shoulder season heat myself...