Stacked Stone Veneer

[TheIndian]

Have learned a ton from this site and I wound up purchasing an F3CB on clearance....10% off. So thank you everyone!

Before I have it installed, I would like to put up a stacked stone veneer on most of the wall behind where stove will go before stove goes in (will leave space for pipe through wall).

1 - What are your thoughts on applying thinset to adhere stacked stone to wall...Apply directly to painted sheetrock? Install wire lath over sheetrock first? Or install Hardibacker (instead of wire lath) over sheetrock first?

https://www.msistone.com/hardscape/rockmount-stacked-stone/

As per MSI, they recommend Prolite thinset by Custom Building Products. I’m guessing I should follow the instructions as per the thinset manufacturer.

2 - Do I need to consider expansion/contraction of any stone product on wall in close proximity to stove? Might stones pop off after a while?

Hoping to tap into your experiences...thanks again.

Chris

 

[Z33]

I used concrete board on mine.

Cut the sheet rock back to a stud and worked the hardi backer in. I used the stone to bridge the gap between the sheet rock and the hardi backer.


Terrible pic but it the only one I have on my phone.

 

[billfred]

I'm going to be doing the exact same thing. Even using the MSI stone. However, I will be going over existing brick. I plan on putting the stone veneer on the brick.

I'll be curious to know how you are going to stone around the pipe. Will you use some type of metal trim/flashing?

 

[TheIndian]

Z33...looks great! My issue is I don’t want to have to take down sheetrock. As a last resort I will if I have to.

BillFred...I hope it comes out great for you! I’m thinking I am going to secure wire lath to sheetrock wall and then embed the lath with thinset as I apply the MSI stone. Should work. And no need for a moisture barrier since it’s not a shower or bathroom. I actually plan on trying it on a small section of wall in another small room first...lath over sheetrock, embed with thinset, apply stone.
As for the pipe through wall, stove installer said he would make me a square or rectangular flange so I can deal with right angles rather than having to make circular cuts.

What thinset you going to use?

 

[billfred]

I’m going to use the recommended ProLite thin set. From what I’ve researched that should work fine for this application. Stacked stone isn’t cheap but it should look good.

 

[sportbikerider78]

I would not put it on drywall. Would you trust hundreds of pounds (and hundreds of dollars) of stone on a sheet of $9 drywall? What do you think happens to drywall when you put wet thinset on it? Why not take it out? Use a framing level. Grab a sharp box cutter. Scribe where you want to remove the sheetrock and then cut deep. Then just punch a hole and pry it out.

When you install the cement board, fill the gaps with thinset and tape. Seriously, the easiest part of the job.

If this intimidates you, you might want to take a step back and think if you want to do this job yourself. Cutting and fitting stone and making it look good, isn't easy at all.

 

[TheIndian]

I’m going to use the recommended ProLite thin set. From what I’ve researched that should work fine for this application. Stacked stone isn’t cheap but it should look good.

Nice...I plan on using the same.

 

[TheIndian]

I would not put it on drywall. Would you trust hundreds of pounds (and hundreds of dollars) of stone on a sheet of $9 drywall? What do you think happens to drywall when you put wet thinset on it? Why not take it out? Use a framing level. Grab a sharp box cutter. Scribe where you want to remove the sheetrock and then cut deep. Then just punch a hole and pry it out.

When you install the cement board, fill the gaps with thinset and tape. Seriously, the easiest part of the job.

If this intimidates you, you might want to take a step back and think if you want to do this job yourself. Cutting and fitting stone and making it look good, isn't easy at all.

Hey Sport...Will likely remove sheetrock and use hardibacker like Z33.

 

[Hogwildz]

30 lb felt over the drywall, nail wire lath every 8" centers on 16" studs. Depending on the stone you use, reall stone veneer heavy stone mortar mix, cultured man made stone veneer Type S mortar.
You can also put cement board over the drywall, or take drywall off and install cement board. Still need 30lb felt behind to keep moisture from getting into the wall. I double the 30 felt up staggering all seams. Seam on 2nd layer centered on middle of first layer.
I believe Durock is less expensive than Hardibacker, and works just as well. I like that is is more rough surface for the mortar to grab to. Metal lath is even less expensive yet, and give a great grab of the mortar. Make sure you wet the wallboard surface as you go prior to adhering the veneer, or the board will soak up the moisture from the mortar for a weaker bond.

 

[rox3406]

Here is mine. MSI product. I’ve installed miles of this stuff. The pro lite is a good product. It is only recommended because it is Home Depot best stuff. Any modified thunder will work. Use white if you have light stone. Gray if it is dark. Don’t put it on drywall it will def fall off. Put 1/2 cement board under it and make sure it is flat. Very flat. 1/2 notch trowel and mix the thin set to by the instructions to a tee.
The stuff is super easy to cut just go slow. Only use a sliding table wet saw.

 

[rox3406]

Thunder =thinset. Darn autocorrect

 

[TheIndian]

Nice work and Thanks guys...great advice!
I confused though on why I need a moisture barrier? Where would the moisture be coming from? Let me clarify that the 2-story house is completely above grade on a concrete slab.

 

[rox3406]

You don’t need the barrier. That’s on exterior applications only.

 

[billfred]

The stuff is super easy to cut just go slow. Only use a sliding table wet saw.

Nice. I’ve got a similar project that I will be putting over existing brick. Any advice on that?
Also I’ve got outside corners to mess with. I decided not to spend money on the pre-made corners. I’m going to try to miter cut the stuff.

 

[RandyBoBandy]

My suggestion is to remove your drywall. Put up cement board and lathe. The lathe is directional so pay attention to this. Type S mortar Is what I have used on many bluestone mortared projects inside and out. I also use a binder in my mortar when mixing. The stuff I use is called weldcrete. You might want your thimble installed before you start sticking stone to the wall. If you are going to have grout lines you can use the same type S mortar just through a little 2ns mason sand in when mixing. This will give the grout a nice sandy look when you sponge it. Above all remove your drywall.

 

[RandyBoBandy]

I'm going to be doing the exact same thing. Even using the MSI stone. However, I will be going over existing brick. I plan on putting the stone veneer on the brick.

I'll be curious to know how you are going to stone around the pipe. Will you use some type of metal trim/flashing?

I would still lathe over your brick. You can drill holes in the mortar joints of your brick and use nails with a thin piece of wire to hold the lathe to your brick. Lathe is directional so keep this in mind.

 

[rox3406]

Use durarock right over the brick. With long tap con screws. I mitered my corners also. Those corner pieces are expensive. Don’t mess with wire lathe. That went out in the 80s when they invented durarock. Pain to work with. You don’t grout any of the msi leger stone. Only use modified thin set. Not type s. Make sure you use the right color.

 

[rox3406]

Also don’t drill into the mortar joints drill right into the brick stay 1 inch from the edge.

 

[rox3406]

Before during and almost done

 

[TheIndian]

My suggestion is to remove your drywall. Put up cement board and lathe. The lathe is directional so pay attention to this. Type S mortar Is what I have used on many bluestone mortared projects inside and out. I also use a binder in my mortar when mixing. The stuff I use is called weldcrete. You might want your thimble installed before you start sticking stone to the wall. If you are going to have grout lines you can use the same type S mortar just through a little 2ns mason sand in when mixing. This will give the grout a nice sandy look when you sponge it. Above all remove your drywall.

Cement board AND lath? That sounds like overkill, no? Then again I am not the expert.

Any preferences on Durock vs Hardibacker?

 

[Hogwildz]

Nice work and Thanks guys...great advice!
I confused though on why I need a moisture barrier? Where would the moisture be coming from? Let me clarify that the 2-story house is completely above grade on a concrete slab.

You're installing a concrete or stone based material on an interior wall, concrete &/ stone absorb moisture, and will transfer to the surface behind, which is the wall or wall cavity depending how you install. Moisture barrier will help prevent mold forming in the wall cavity.

Nice work and Thanks guys...great advice!
I confused though on why I need a moisture barrier? Where would the moisture be coming from? Let me clarify that the 2-story house is completely above grade on a concrete slab.

Your best bet is to read the installation instructions for the stone you're going to use. They are usually pretty detailed and specify how to install, which you want to adhere to as best as can be, in case of any warranty issue, otherwise they will void the warranty quicker than you can batt an eye. The cultured stone I installed inside, required moisture barrier unless over masonry for interior installation. You don't need metal lath unless you are going over the drywall, in which if you are, def use double layer moisture barrier over the drywall. If you're tearing out the drywall, and installing cement board, no lath needed. You're installing masonry/mortar, which does tend to soak up and pass moisture along, better to spend minimal effort & cash to assure a dry wall & cavities than chance moisture & most problems. For the cost & effort involved, it's a no brainer.

My preference for dry stack is darker mortar, white doesn't look all that great if it shows on dry stack walls. Just my preference, yours may differ.
And some will show in spots, that is inevitable. You can knock off any heavy that may happen, after it sets.

You don't have to use a wet saw either if you don't already have one. An angle grinder with a diamond blade works fine.

Do your research take your time, and follow the instructions as best as you can if you want to keep the warranty intact.

 

[Hogwildz]

Nice. I’ve got a similar project that I will be putting over existing brick. Any advice on that?
Also I’ve got outside corners to mess with. I decided not to spend money on the pre-made corners. I’m going to try to miter cut the stuff.

If the brick is not painted, sealed or treated, you can go directly over the brick with a good mortar, but you have to make sure it is cleaned of all of the aforementioned coatings.. You'll still need a scratch coat over the brick.
If it is painted, you can go metal lath or cement board. Everyone has their preferences, use what appeals and will work best for you. Both are good systems. I haven't seen it mentioned, but if the bricks are irregular and some sticking our more than others, lath method works nice for that, as the scratch coat alleviates and irregularities in the brick surface. With cement board you will have to smoth the bricks surface prior to installing the cement board as it will be wavy as hell and have pockets behind it.

For lath Just get some Hilti washer pins or equivalent from the big box store. Hammer them into the mortar joints every 6"-8" on minimum 1" to 1-1/2" vertical lath overlaps, and every 12" on horizontal runs with lath overlaps about 1" or so. Go into the mortar joints or you will end up blowing the bricks apart. The when you install the stone, either scratch coat and let dry, then install buttered stones, or do a wet 1/2" to 3/4" thick over the lath, then butter the stone and set into the wet lath coat. The latter always worked better for me for best adhesion. If you do a dry scratch coat, well the scratch coat with a water & a paint brush prior to installing the buttered stone. I like the lath as it is a hell of a lot easier than hammer drilling holes all through the brick, which can end up breaking or cracking a few here and there. Hell, my fireplace is so old, the mortar was like rock. I shot the pins in the mortar joints with a Hiliti gun and it works perfect. Nice and tight & solid.

Cement board ideas where given above, not much more input on that, other than I go in mortar joints, not the brick itself. You can always refer to the manufacturer and go by their recommendations.

You can try and cut the miters, but the corners look a lot better and are easier to install.

Should be a fun project, enjoy!

 

[RandyBoBandy]

Cement board AND lath? That sounds like overkill, no? Then again I am not the expert.

Any preferences on Durock vs Hardibacker?

I tend to overbuild. Someone at some point in my younger years told me “good enough never was”. If I was just doing tile or a real thin light veneer I would just do Durock or cement board. If I’m doing a heavy cleanup natural stone veneer that ranges in width I like the added surface area and grab of lathe as well. Definitely remove the drywall and put up a vapor barrier. Like hog said, do your homework and stick to the manufacturer’s specs. I like the thickness of durock for a veneer. Hardibacker for tile. The durock is a bit more annoying to cut and such, however peace of mind I guess when hanging heavy stone off of it. A 4” angle grinder with a diamond blade will cut the stone just fine. Just do it outside unless you want dust through out your whole house. Don’t forget a dust mask.

 

[RandyBoBandy]

I would still lathe over your brick. You can drill holes in the mortar joints of your brick and use nails with a thin piece of wire to hold the lathe to your brick. Lathe is directional so keep this in mind.

Don’t drill into the brick. You take the chance of destroying the brick.

 

[TheIndian]

Sheet rock down.
Will finish any necessary framing then insulate.
1/2 hardibacker after that.

Am still on fence about vapor barrier.