Stainless Steel or Vermiculite Baffle?

[MovingOffGrid]

Can anyone expand on the pros and cons of these 2 EPA firebox designs?

I am trying to decide between 2 stoves:
1) The PE Summit - Stainless Steel baffle
2) Regency F3100 - Vermiculite baffle

My dilemma is I prefer the heavier build of the Regency door, hinges and heavy ash lip, but suspect the burn **may **be slighlty better with the Stainless Steel Summit baffle, being a more reflective material, it *may able to sustain slower, cleaner burns longer. Not wanting to start any wars, just looking for honest feedback. Any opinions?

 

[MovingOffGrid]

bump .... anyone?

 

[TheFlame]

With baffles it is all a matter of durability. The vermiculite baffle will most likely crack at some point, probably the first time you jam a log in there and it hits it. As far as efficiency goes the vermiculite *may* have a higher efficiency, but nothing that really matters in the grand scheme of things.

I have cast iron baffles in my Oslo, and one has warped on me. I've read countless posts here about broken vermiculite baffles, it seems WAY too common.

I'd go with the stainless baffle, it will last much longer than any other solution, and you don't have to worry about busting it.

 

[MovingOffGrid]

thanks for your thoughts .... makes sense.

 

[DAKSY]

Stainless Steel Summit baffle, being a more reflective material,

How the heck is stainless more reflective than vermiculite?!??!?
It's steel...it will absorb heat.
The vermiculite baffles are about $60...
They should last 3-4 maybe 5 years...

 

[Lumber-Jack]

I have a Regency F2400 that probably has the same baffles as the F3100 (is that material called vermiculite?), anyway I was a little curious about this set up at first, but after using and removing them a few times they seem to me to be a good idea.
You asked for opinions, so I'll give you mine, but you should keep in mind I have not used a stove with a steel baffle to compare it with, and only have part of a season of use out of my new stove.
The "vermiculite" baffles are easy to install and remove, even when the metal in the stove is still a little hot the baffles don't seem to retain the heat like metal does. This has come in handy when I wanted to clean the chimney as I don't have to wait until the stove has completely cooled down before removing the baffles. (you want to remove the baffles when cleaning the chimney)
I don't think it's likely that I will break them from inserting wood since the wood tends to bash the secondary burn tubes first rather than hit the baffles and even if I did stick something thin enough to slip between the metal tubes and hit the baffles they are just sitting loose on top of the tubes, not held rigidly in place, so the impact will simply nock them out of place slightly at most rather than damage them. Unlike my fire bricks at the back of my stove which does not give at all when I slam some wood into them (I notice a couple of them already have cracks in them). I'm so abusive.
Obviously I can't tell you anything about the long term wear and tear on these baffles other than so far them seem to be holding up better that the fire bricks.
One last thought, the fire box have brick lining to hold the heat in and protect the outer metal out case from warping, it makes sense to use a similar material on the baffle too rather than using a chunk of metal. It seems metal is the CHEAPER way to go, so maybe that speaks to the performance you can expect from the two different materials solutions.
Give me a couple more years of using my stove,,, maybe I'll change my view point.

 

[begreen]

There's an insulation blanket on top of the stainless steel baffle/secondary manifold in the PE. Then there is another stainless cover on top to protect the blanket. Seems built to last without a lot of fuss.

 

[cgeiger]

I believe the Jotul 500 (maybe 600?) has the same vermiculite baffle with insulation construction. I too have seen posts regarding Oslo's and their cast iron baffles warping but I think it really shouldn't be a major factor in deciding on a particular stove (IMO). They both have pros and cons which about even them out - go with the stove you like the most and fits your needs the best. With proper care and use either baffle should serve you well for quite some time before you need to worry about replacing it. If you do and you're reasonably handy you can probably do it yourself and save the labor cost.

FWIW I currently have an Oslo (vermiculate baffle) that replaced my last season's VC Resolute (cast iron baffle). Haven't had a problem with either.

 

[TheFlame]

I believe the Jotul 500 (maybe 600?) has the same vermiculite baffle with insulation construction. I too have seen posts regarding Oslo's and their cast iron baffles warping but I think it really shouldn't be a major factor in deciding on a particular stove (IMO).

I respectfully disagree with this point. Possibly busting a $50 part at any time that can reduce the operating efficiency and potentially harm the stove itself should be a consideration.

Honestly I'm impressed as hell that PE is using a stainless baffle. They obviously got it figured out.

 

[precaud]

Stainless is only reflective when it's shiny, which it isn't for very long in a firebox.

No need to buy that from the manufacturer - replace the vermiculite baffle with ceramic fiber board, such as Kaowool M board or Zicar RS-1200 or similar. Compared to the verm, it's as good or better insulator, weighs less, and won't crack. Easy to cut to size. Widely available in many thicknesses.

 

[TheFlame]

Stainless is only reflective when it's shiny, which it isn't for very long in a firebox.

No need to buy that from the manufacturer - replace the vermiculite baffle with ceramic fiber board, such as Kaowool M board or Zicar RS-1200 or similar. Compared to the verm, it's as good or better insulator, weighs less, and won't crack. Easy to cut to size. Widely available in many thicknesses.

Then why aren't the manufacturers using it instead of the vermiculite?

 

[precaud]

Probably due to cost.

 

[MovingOffGrid]

thanks for all the feedback ... my idea for SS being more reflective came after watching the Gov of Canada video called "Wood Stove Management". Perhaps their comments apply to all sorts of baffles, but it seemed they were singling out the SS baffle.

I bought a PE summit without the ash tray on the weekend and so far, am quite impressed.

I am using a thermometer at 18" on the stack - seems easy to run it at 400 degrees for a nice steady burn over a few hours. Now that the paint is curing, I think I'll crank it up a bit and see how she likes it.

Opening the windows now

 

[precaud]

Then why aren't the manufacturers using it instead of the vermiculite?

Probably due to cost.

Just got a quote from Zircar, and it is pricey stuff, indeed. In small-quantities, pricing is about $63 per sq ft. Ouch. I've asked them if they have any comparable material that is more cost effective.